With that income you could live along the coast of Texas and it wouldn’t be as expensive as Florida but neither would it be as exciting as Mexico. Having said that you should look for a place where you can have an exit strategy in case you need emergency medical treatment. A few years ago my sister in law was vacationing in Cancun when she developed a blood clot. She had to be taken by ambulance to Merida where she lingered in a hospital for several days before eventually dying.

 

That is terrible. Thanks for the information....definitely requires more research. I am assuming that if she was on Vacation she did not have private insurance locally? I don't know if that would have made any difference but its my understanding that there are basically 2 types of "insurance" available outside of private insurance, one that is available to anyone with a Permanent Resident Visa who has no major pre-existing conditions and the same for those with major pre-existing conditions. I don't know what someone on vacation would have, if anything, but if it is like health care in the US the better insurance you have the better care you get.


I would be happy as a clam on the Texas gulf coast. It is right up my alley....I lived in Galveston for 3 years years ago and I fell in love with the Texas Gulf Coast. The fishing is right in my round house with the added benefit of having good duck hunting and dove shooting. Alas my lovely bride is not as enamored with Texas, gulf coast or not, as I am....it'd be a hard sale LOL. I'd be happy as a clam in the Hill Country also....

 

I don't understand your finances. Are you asking us if you will like Playa del Carmen in 10 years or if you will be able to afford living there or what your life situation will be in 10 years ? I'll predict that in 10 years the cost of living will have at least doubled. PDC will be at least twice as crowded. I cannot predict what affect the 'Mayan Train' is going to have on the area - but it likely ain't going to curtail growth.

I just recently sold my Mexican house for twice what I paid for it 10 years ago. Today it feels like I need to spend ALL the monies I have just received in order to purchase a house I would never have even considered 10 years ago.

When I look back - it might have been interesting if we would have purchased a nice Mexican beach condo while we were still working and vacationed there over the years - possibly renting it out when we were not using it. If you need ideas of places to consider, have a look into Fonatur's current or future projects.

 

I don't understand your finances. Are you asking us if you will like Playa del Carmen in 10 years or if you will be able to afford living there or what your life situation will be in 10 years ? I'll predict that in 10 years the cost of living will have at least doubled. PDC will be at least twice as crowded. I cannot predict what affect the 'Mayan Train' is going to have on the area - but it likely ain't going to curtail growth.

I just recently sold my Mexican house for twice what I paid for it 10 years ago. Today it feels like I need to spend ALL the monies I have just received in order to purchase a house I would never have even considered 10 years ago.

When I look back - it might have been interesting if we would have purchased a nice Mexican beach condo while we were still working and vacationed there over the years - possibly renting it out when we were not using it. If you need ideas of places to consider, have a look into Fonatur's current or future projects.

I am asking if it is indeed possible to live comfortably in the area, today, on $3K a month. Living pretty simply in an apartment or condo or home (renting, not buying) with modern conveniences, and have some adequate health insurance. The income I am basing decisions on are estimates based on 10 years in the future...given the performance of my wife's retirement accounts the last year or so we may just continue to work until we reach room temperature LOL. She is more risk tolerant than me.....mine has performed about the same as it has for nearly 40 years....doesn't grow fast but it does it steadily.

We have looked at some properties in south Florida where we have planned to retire and would buy now, put the property into a rental program and even if it cost a little every month it'd be OK. The problem with that plan is the association fees in almost any property in Florida which would be suitable....there is nothing that says that those fees, already way too high, won't outpace inflation...in fact the stats over the last 10 years indicate they will and will do so by a bunch. Lot of folks in Florida on fixed incomes being forced to sell because association fees have risen to the point that they can't afford to live in their homes any longer. I suspect the same thing is happening in all areas where such fees are common....which makes us VERY hesitant to buy today for the future. There is also the issue with shifting communities in most of Florida....what is a completely adequate area of town today may be pretty dodgy 10 years from now.

 

As far as buying property in mx or usa, now is not the best time, imo. The world and its economy is in a tailspin. We are all in a recession and its heading toward a depression if we keep making mistakes. The last time this happened was '08 and by '09 housing prices had collapsed.

This happened all over the world, I was just in spain and they saw the same run up in home prices, then the collapse. When the economy collapses, when people can't pay their mortgages, then the bank takes the house back. A savvy investor can pick up a house for 1/2 down to as low as 1/10 the previous price. I did it myself in '09 and '10 and its happening all over again.

MT, hold onto your cash and rent. When the crash comes you can pick and chose from the bargains. Buy now and you will be "under water" with the mortgage higher than the value of the property. Wait for the crash and pick it up cheaper.

I'm sure those trends will happen in mx as well as the states.

 

As far as buying property in mx or usa, now is not the best time, imo. The world and its economy is in a tailspin. We are all in a recession and its heading toward a depression if we keep making mistakes. The last time this happened was '08 and by '09 housing prices had collapsed.

This happened all over the world, I was just in spain and they saw the same run up in home prices, then the collapse. When the economy collapses, when people can't pay their mortgages, then the bank takes the house back. A savvy investor can pick up a house for 1/2 down to as low as 1/10 the previous price. I did it myself in '09 and '10 and its happening all over again.

MT, hold onto your cash and rent. When the crash comes you can pick and chose from the bargains. Buy now and you will be "under water" with the mortgage higher than the value of the property. Wait for the crash and pick it up cheaper.

I'm sure those trends will happen in mx as well as the states.

TE (he he) In a large way I agree with you (and thank you for your opinion). Stuff is going to hit the fan, and Mexico will not avoid it. But there are some things which make Mexico a little different. A lot of Mexicans have no mortgage. That is certainly true of the wealthy as well as say my gardener and ALL of his family. Venturing a guess, mortgage rates are something like 15-20%. Also, it costs very little to 'keep' a house in Mexico. Property taxes are very very (very) low. In many places properties are surrounded by tall stone walls. A homeowner can easily close up their house and walk away - for years. Finally - there is a genuine 'fear' at the moment of having your money in the bank. Some people are emptying their accounts and putting the money into real estate (or the US).

But some opportunities will arise. Some people want to sell their house to put the money to another use. In the coming days I will likely have a look at a house owned by an American woman who "has come into some money" and doesn't want her house any longer.

 

You’ll be hard pressed to find top notch medical care outside of the major population hubs of Mexico. When you’re young and healthy you can adapt. As you get older you have to carefully find the right niche that fits you.

 

My father died (years ago) because he had a heart attack and was too far from a hospital - in Ft Myers Fl !! At the moment - I happen to live in an area with perhaps some of the best health care options in Mexico. Having said that - prices for some things are much higher than other places. A simple office visit with a specialist here can run as high as 1500-2500 pesos. Recently I was mentioning to a friend some of the factors I am considering when it comes to moving out of the 'city' that has been my home for 10+ years. Doctors/hospitals is near the top. It is not simply - does the city have hospitals - are they good hospitals ? If I stay where I am now I have already weeded out some of the "crack pots" (for the most part).

 

(sorry bobby - don't mean to steal your thread)

 

Although the OP has some excellent replies I would wonder what Mexico will be like in 10 years. That is a long time. Here are some possibilities. Mexico will change. Lots of mfrs. and industries will move to Mexico. Wages will increase. Crime will decrease. Of course the cost of living will also increase. OR: Mexico will be less of a democracy. I will not get into politics but Mexico could be like many of the nations in South America.. Autocracy.. Crime will be worse than today. Will not be on any list of best places to retire. 3rd possibility is that things will not very different than today. Take your pick. I would have a plan B..

 

I've lived in Cancun for six years now. There's plenty of top-notch medical care in Cancun certainly, and Playa Del Carmin probably. I count six private hospitals in PDC looking at google maps. I go to Hospiten in Cancun, and I see they have a branch in PDC, plus a couple other 'big name' hospital chains. If you had some need for some kind of a specialist and you wanted a very top notch one, you might end up driving from PDC to Cancun for an appointment, but that's certainly doable.

One should ask oneself why it's called Playa Del Carmin. I have a theory: red seaweed. But the sargasso isn't any worse in PDC than Cancun, I think. There might be a difference in how fast it's scooped up.

What you have to spend is going to depend on whether you just want a place or a place with a view or a place right on the water.

I think in recent years there has been some buzz in retirement circles about PDC, but anything that once made it more attractive than Cancun for retirees is likely long lost at this point. Development continues to extend to the south, south of Tulum. I'm not sure how far the high speed internet reaches at this point. PDC certainly. Tulum probably, beyond that maybe. I'm sure you'll be able to find something in 10 years that's affordable, but you might not end up right on the ocean.

If you haven't visited PDC on vacation then you have time to do so.

When you are ready to retire, I highly encourage you to rent for a year or two for all the usual reasons.

 

MangoTango wrote:
"TE (he he) In a large way I agree with you (and thank you for your opinion). Stuff is going to hit the fan, and Mexico will not avoid it. But there are some things which make Mexico a little different. A lot of Mexicans have no mortgage. That is certainly true of the wealthy as well as say my gardener and ALL of his family. Venturing a guess, mortgage rates are something like 15-20%. Also, it costs very little to 'keep' a house in Mexico. Property taxes are very very (very) low. In many places properties are surrounded by tall stone walls. A homeowner can easily close up their house and walk away - for years. Finally - there is a genuine 'fear' at the moment of having your money in the bank. Some people are emptying their accounts and putting the money into real estate (or the US). "

Yes, that is certainly different than in the states where most homes are bought on credit. However, homes in bankruptcy are not the only cause of price collapse. The general economic hardship caused by the present recession and coming depression will grind everyone down. When people have to sell their home because their back is against the wall, housing prices fall and if there is too much pressure, prices collapse. It happened many places

The rich are less affected personally, their upscale homes drop in value but not nearly the percentage that poorer people's homes drop. So the 10 million peso home might drop 20% in a crash, maybe more, but the poor mans 40k home might drop in value by 40% or more. If there is a big glut of homes, then people take a tiny offer or can't sell.

You mentioned people taking their cash out of banks. In china banks are closing and no one gets money back. Unless you are connected or lucky. People are furious and worried. It happened in venezuela, could happen in mx perhaps? Usa banks will be among the last to fall. Bitcoin is a way to keep assets safe and is at a low point and should rise in the next 2 to 3 years.

I agree with eastwind in renting for a couple years until prices shake out and you have your plans decided.

 

TE, OP is just planning for 10 years out, the downturn you're talking about will be over and recovered from by the time they need to rent or buy.

The issue for OP is whether to buy early (and try to rent out the place to others until they're ready to retire and move into it).

I would advise against that. The apartment I rented for 4 years before buying a place for myself was owned by a US family with that notion to retire later. They were losing money on the apartment, because the rent I was paying wasn't always covering all their expenses. (Not to mention getting no return on the money they'd invested to buy it). And if they'd raised the rent enough to cover expenses, I would have moved out. Part of the problem was they had to pay 10% to an apartment manager who was a bit shady. Part of the problem was repairs they ended up paying for multiple times because they weren't here to assure the job was done right the first time.

Investing in property is often not a great hedge against inflation, if that's the worry.

 

Yes one would hope the downturn will be over in 10 years. That may be a bit optimistic though since in the states at least, it seemed real estate prices didn't really return toward their old levels until about 2018. Then they shot up dramatically.

My point was mainly to those thinking of buying now, who do not have to buy immediately and can wait. If you can wait, then you will avoid holding the bag on a high priced property when all around you prices are falling. If your property is upside down, value vs amount owed, then you can't get your money back out until years have passed and prices went back up. Whereas if you held off and picked something up near the bottom, you are not in such a financial trap.

"Investing in property is often not a great hedge against inflation, if that's the worry."

It depends, if you are the type who likes to move a lot, you are better off renting. If you put down roots and plan to stay, real estate has been one of the best investments, and one of the few you can use and get benefit from every day. I did not sell any of my properties even though I figure the prices will drop. I'm still taking in good rent money and after the market goes down, it goes back up. That is the benefit of the long view. If you take the shorter view, then you are correct. Many unpleasant surprises come from short term ownership, but again it depends

So no, I was not saying buy now and rent it out though that sometimes works. Buy low then you can rent it out and expect to get expenses covered at least and maybe a profit. I was kicking around the idea of buying a house and just using it for vacations. That was last year and now with storm clouds everywhere, now is not the time

 

Consider this:

investopedia Answers

The simplest way to compare stock and real estate is by examining the indexed performance of both markets. From March 1992 to March 2022, the U.S. average growth rate was 5.3%. The S&P 500 returned 9.65% annualized from the beginning of 1992 to the same period in 2022.

Yes, you say, but what about the 80's when there was high inflation?

Or, consider the 47 years between 1975 and 2022. A $100 investment in the average home (as tracked by the Home Price Index from the Federal Housing Finance Agency [FHFA]) in the fourth quarter of 1975 would have grown to about $928 by the first quarter of 2022. A similar $100 investment in the S&P 500 at the beginning of 1975 would yield approximately $19,351 in 2022, provided all dividends were reinvested.

What has made housing attractive for US investors is favorable government tax treatment, and the ability to buy it with leverage via cheap mortgages. If you bought a house with a 30 year fixed mortgage at a low interest rate in the past few years, you'd be in great shape now. But most of that doesn't apply to Mexico.

 

Yes, if you are buying a home in mx your best bet is to pay all cash. Few if any usa banks will do a loan in another country even mx or canada. On the good side is prices are much lower so you may be able to tap a line of credit or regular loan without saying you will spend it in mx which they will frown on. There may be a bank or two if you search hard. In mexico if you have most of the money down and are just short 1/4 or so you may find a bank to carry the rest. I never looked into that angle.

Its not so easy for mexicans to get a mortgage in mx, much harder for us from el norte. So most property is bought all cash. You may find a place acceptable for as little as $10,000US depending on location and size, etc. A nicer place near the center might be 50k or more up to millions. Others can recommend cheaper places to look. I mentioned sma because its cool in summer, lots of english speakers and expats. More than most other cities if you like to run into people from your area.

 

Easy - What are you smoking ? Do you live in Mexico ? The internet is a vast resource. Please - show us ONE property you would live in at a cost of $10K US (200,000 MXN). Just one...

 

Forgot to mention you will need residencia for a bank account, makes it super difficult otherwise because other things depend on that. You can pay utilities that way instead of lining up like the foolish people do. Many places, not all, want to see residencia before they will rent to you and will want rent in advance possibly several months since you are not a citizen and may take off. If you want to try several cities you may run into a problem or may find someone who just rents for the season and has people coming in a few months. That gives a chance to look around plus it may be cheaper because few want to leave after a short amount of time. Just a thought, there is airBB but its expensive

 

Easy - We opened our first HSBC Mexico account sitting in a nice air conditioned HSBC US branch in South Florida at a time when living in Mexico was a glimmer in our eyes. We did not even have flight reservations let alone a residency visa. True it was a basic non-interest bearing checking account with a debit card /check book. But it was enough for us to write a paper check (which was later torn up) for deposit on a rental property when we did get to Mexico. btw - I'll venture a guess that there are 20 or so countries in which HSBC will let you open an account.

Here is a link :
International Banking - HSBC Bank USA

Edit : We did do this a decade ago (but the link I posted is current). In today's world you may need an RFC, which would require residency - but I do not know...

 

Of course a paper check from the US was torn up - they didn't have any way to cash it without traveling to the US.

 

Sorry for not being more clear - it was a Mexican check. And yes - in 10+ years in Mexico a paper check may have come in handy a few times (I still have a check book some where). For one thing it is a nice convenient way to make a placeholder transaction which both sides realize will have a better solution at some point. Just my experience.

 

@MT First I did not say I would want to live in a 200,000 peso home, I merely said that they exist. I was trying to give a range of prices from my research which I did in person. I was not making it up out of my head. In answer to your question, as I've stated before, I returned to the states when my plan ran into problems which is on hold for now. I'm not sure why you attacked that statement, you know there are cheap places. I pointed out that they might be difficult and far from the areas desired but they exist. If I said there is nothing below $300k mx that would be incorrect, you could no doubt find some property even lower than the $200k I mentioned. Probably in an undesirable location and needing repairs

Now you may have been able to open an account without residencia, possibly because you had an account with hsbc previously. I however was told it is not possible and this was end of last year, not many years ago . Also the fact that your experience was over 10 years ago, brings the possibility the laws have changed since then. Until a couple or so years ago you could go over and come back without a passport but now its required. Things do change.

I would not advise someone to go to mx planning to open a bank account without first applying for residencia. There are other requirements, most, perhaps all bank require a local address. They may also ask for a local phone number, now the rfc. It takes time to arrange all those things.

 

Here in my inexpensive state of Tlaxcala, 50-100K could get anyone a highly acceptable, move-in-ready three-bedroom house with a yard. I see listings below that, too, but chancier quality-wise.

 

Buying a bank owned home in Mexico is very foolish in my opinion. While you could luck out, due to Mexicos laws it is very hard to evict the previous owners, so you will most likely find you bought an occupied home, and who wants to kick out a family that knows where you now live. It takes years of legal fees to get them out successfully, which probably includes bribing officials, and again, what will you do if they are holding a grudge?

When you see remates (bank homes) advertised online, they are often scams, sold over and over to the ignorant. It is only my opinion, but I would avoid these.

Rent is quite cheap in Mexico, so the only reason I see to buy is if you find an area that you love, and want that place forever. Property taxes are so low that people hold onto their old worn out homes instead of selling them, so if the deal sounds too good to be true, it probably is.

Also while illegal, don't be surprised if when buying a legit home in cash you are expected to pay in 2 sums, which leaves you paying a ridiculous tax if you decide to sell later on. For example if buying a 100,000 home, you pay 30,000 1st, which is the reported price....and then you pay the remaining 70,000 which goes unreported. This is so common in Mexico that the notarios often know it is happening so you do not even need to pay the owner in secret, they just look the other way. But then if you sell the home for the same exact amount of 100,000....you pay the capital gains tax (which can be as high as 35% today, and that number may change tomorrow) of the 70,000 that you "profited" from the home listed as being purchased for only 30,0000, even though you have not made any profit on that 100,000 total. If you sell it for more that number obviously goes up.

1 way to ease that risk is by both proving you live in the property/it is your primary residency and by obtaining residency/RFC number. In this scenario you can get a 1 time exemption (might be 1 time every 3 years), provided they do not find a reason to deny you....but the rules could always change down the road screwing you, or they could find a reason to deny your exemption because, well it is Mexico. Of course obtaining residency is relatively easy at this time so it is not the end of the world, but as Mexico becomes more popular for people looking to live a cheaper life that could always get more difficult in the future.

And yes, the laws surrounding the RFC number have in fact just changed/are changing now. All residents are now required to have the RFC number, and banks/CFE electric/Internet providers/even car registration cannot be obtained without the number for the most part. The law was supposed to go into effect Jan 1st of 2022, but since the backlog to get the number was so much they kept pushing it out, so I am not sure if it is in effect yet, but the banks etc. generally stopped opening accounts due to this.

 

My wife and I will be retiring in 10 years, lord willing and the creek stays in its banks, and thinking about retiring in Playa Del Carmen. Our thinking is that the cost of living is within our means, healthcare seems readily available and there are affordable flights to the US. Are we missing something?

We lived abroad (Europe) for 7 years and lived close to El Paso for 5 and spent a lot of time in Juarez (this was 4 years ago). We have also spent some time in Mexico in both resort areas and fishing villages so we are pretty comfortable in Mexico. Currently it looks like we would have in the neighborhood of $8K a month in income and some savings as well as what equity we have in our current home. Our daughter will be graduating college a couple of years prior to my 67th birthday so she will probably still be on the payroll somewhat. I have read that it is currently possible to live pretty good in the area for $3K a month. Is this realistic? Our lifestyle is pretty basic and neither of us is high maintenance. We aren't foodies, we don't drink a lot and a good day is simply being lazy doing almost nothing. I do fish but I don't want or need a huge hole in the water to toss money in (a boat) other than maybe a Panga with a tiller outboard.

We have travelled to Juarez for health care when living in New Mexico and are comfortable with that aspect but not certain if the situation is similar in PDC. Thoughts?

Most likely we would rent instead of buying. If we find we aren't happy we can just go home without having to worry about selling property. We would want to buy a beater car locally and I would like to own a Panga but do not know if this is realistic or not. Thoughts?

Crime is not a concern for us. I grew up in Atlanta and she grew up in South Florida and our experience in Mexico has taught us that like both of our home towns you usually only run into trouble if you are looking for it. I did have some experiences in Matamoros as a young man in the early 80's with the local police but that was as much about our activity as it was the "corrupt" police. Neither of us are fluent in Spanish but that can be somewhat fixed in 10 years.

We want to be near good healthcare. We are pretty healthy now but medical appointments are a weekly thing for most people in their 60's and 70's.

We were very satisfied living in Europe. Being the "outsider" fits our lifestyle to a tee. While we have not travelled extensively in Mexico (we are definitely going to correct that going forward) we have spent some time in Mexico and are comfortable in Mexico. PDC seems like an ideal location to retire due to affordable flights stateside and cost of living. Any suggestions or thoughts would be greatly appreciated. Especially any thoughts of other areas of Mexico we might consider.

Seems like the thread got off track. So I'll get it going again. We're thinking of retiring in 20 years. Any thoughts?

 

That’s quite an open ended question. What do you want to know?

 

My thought is that you're on the wrong forum. You should go visit a 'saving for retirement' financial forum. This forum's dead anyway.

 

It was light, good natured sarcasm.

 

Continuing it to see who would answer all the original poster's questions, just replace the 10 with 20. And when did the forum die, do you mean the thread?

 

No, I mean the community. Almost everyone has left. Only a couple people left to answer all the generic questions that the forum owners occasionally post to pretend it's alive. I think mainly it died due to aggressive cancellation of viewpoints during covid. Now there's no one left to say "I told you so".

 

It’s disappointing to try to help someone and then there’s no feedback. It would be nice to hear what happened afterwards and if the advice given helped or hindered.

 

Yes but so many of these questions are silly trolling type questions that anybody could find out with a simple search on the internet.