Expat Forum For People Moving Overseas And Living Abroad banner

1 - 20 of 85 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
645 Posts
I didnt think Spain wanted Gib????

Jo xxx
I think its to try and boost their profile after they were castigated by the people for King Carlos going hunting in Africa as many spanish people I have spoken to say they are not interested in the Gibraltar saga anymore:clap2::clap2:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,421 Posts
The spanish have been claiming soveriy of the rock for years. Personally, I think they should give up...the rock was after all given as it is very clearly stated in the utretch treaty and thats that. we dont need Gibraltar, what we need is to take control of our black money, so it goes where is needed Gibraltar would be yet another burden to the spaniards, its full of ugly monkeys, inhabitants are mostly uncooperative and resentful towards us and whats given shouldnt be claimed back. Gibraltar for the Gibraltarenos, there you go.

The problem is that Gibraltar has beein lAughing at Spain far too much lately. The have taken possesion of Spanish waters, build their airport in spanish territory, currently building fancy resorts in land reclaimed from actual Spanish waters... all good (well, not really, it sucks but hey we are not in a position of looking for confrontation) and now their authorities are bullying and intimidating spanish fisherman that are practicing perfectly legal fishing in spanish waters? Wtf? I mean, come on, WTF???

This very morning spanish fishermen have had to leave escorted by the guardia civil acording to El Pais. Before we know it, our nasty neighbours won't let the spanish sunbath in Malaga claiming that it belongs to them
What do I reckon? i reckon we should close the border, and stop the nosense, Keep them tight in their rock. As for the queen, I agree, this has been the last straw, enough is enough. She shouldnt go.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
33,612 Posts
The spanish have been claiming soveriy of the rock for years. Personally, I think they should give up...the rock was after all given as it is very clearly stated in the utretch treaty and thats that. we dont need Gibraltar, what we need is to take control of our black money, so it goes where is needed Gibraltar would be yet another burden to the spaniards, its full of ugly monkeys, inhabitants are mostly uncooperative and resentful towards us and whats given shouldnt be claimed back. Gibraltar for the Gibraltarenos, there you go.

The problem is that Gibraltar has beein lAughing at Spain far too much lately. The have taken possesion of Spanish waters, build their airport in spanish territory, currently building fancy resorts in land reclaimed from actual Spanish waters... all good (well, not really, it sucks but hey we are not in a position of looking for confrontation) and now their authorities are bullying and intimidating spanish fisherman that are practicing perfectly legal fishing in spanish waters? Wtf? I mean, come on, WTF???

This very morning spanish fishermen have had to leave escorted by the guardia civil acording to El Pais. Before we know it, our nasty neighbours won't let the spanish sunbath in Malaga claiming that it belongs to them
What do I reckon? i reckon we should close the border, and stop the nosense, Keep them tight in their rock. As for the queen, I agree, this has been the last straw, enough is enough. She shouldnt go.
Thanks for this information :clap2:. I had no idea there was a problem or that this stuff was going on!!!

Jo xxx
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,036 Posts
The spanish have been claiming soveriy of the rock for years. Personally, I think they should give up...the rock was after all given as it is very clearly stated in the utretch treaty and thats that. we dont need Gibraltar, what we need is to take control of our black money, so it goes where is needed Gibraltar would be yet another burden to the spaniards, its full of ugly monkeys, inhabitants are mostly uncooperative and resentful towards us and whats given shouldnt be claimed back. Gibraltar for the Gibraltarenos, there you go.
Quite agree!

The problem is that Gibraltar has beein lAughing at Spain far too much lately. The have taken possesion of Spanish waters, build their airport in spanish territory, currently building fancy resorts in land reclaimed from actual Spanish waters... all good (well, not really, it sucks but hey we are not in a position of looking for confrontation) and now their authorities are bullying and intimidating spanish fisherman that are practicing perfectly legal fishing in spanish waters? Wtf? I mean, come on, WTF???
Can't argue with any of that.

This very morning spanish fishermen have had to leave escorted by the guardia civil acording to El Pais. Before we know it, our nasty neighbours won't let the spanish sunbath in Malaga claiming that it belongs to them
What do I reckon? i reckon we should close the border, and stop the nosense, Keep them tight in their rock. As for the queen, I agree, this has been the last straw, enough is enough. She shouldnt go.
Aw - come on Sonrisa! Malaga? The whole Costa del Sol belongs to the UK!;)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
22,362 Posts
Agree with Sonrisa but if the border is closed that's a problem for OH getting Quorn stuff from Morrisons!

Gibraltar is vile. It always amazes me how a short walk of a few metres can bring about such a changed ambience. It's like Great Yarmouth on heat...tacky, tawdry, tasteless...with a Marks and Spencers that reminds me of Barnsley Co-op in the nineteen-fifties and very few 'quality' shops.

But it's 'ours' and the inhabitants want it to stay that way which is the sole reason for keeping the status quo.
Same with the Falklands...

So I think the Government made a bad move. It could serve to distract from the state of the economy, I suppose, just like the Argentinian expropriation...
 
G

·
The spanish have been claiming soveriy of the rock for years. Personally, I think they should give up...the rock was after all given as it is very clearly stated in the utretch treaty and thats that. we dont need Gibraltar, what we need is to take control of our black money, so it goes where is needed Gibraltar would be yet another burden to the spaniards, its full of ugly monkeys, inhabitants are mostly uncooperative and resentful towards us and whats given shouldnt be claimed back. Gibraltar for the Gibraltarenos, there you go.

The problem is that Gibraltar has beein lAughing at Spain far too much lately. The have taken possesion of Spanish waters, build their airport in spanish territory, currently building fancy resorts in land reclaimed from actual Spanish waters... all good (well, not really, it sucks but hey we are not in a position of looking for confrontation) and now their authorities are bullying and intimidating spanish fisherman that are practicing perfectly legal fishing in spanish waters? Wtf? I mean, come on, WTF???

This very morning spanish fishermen have had to leave escorted by the guardia civil acording to El Pais. Before we know it, our nasty neighbours won't let the spanish sunbath in Malaga claiming that it belongs to them
What do I reckon? i reckon we should close the border, and stop the nosense, Keep them tight in their rock. As for the queen, I agree, this has been the last straw, enough is enough. She shouldnt go.
Why not tell us what you really think? hehe

Totally agree - good post.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,036 Posts
Actually, closing the border would probably be the nail in the coffin for La Linea - many thousands of them work in Gibraltar. In fact the whole Campo de Gibraltar benefits massively financially from Gibraltar - so better be careful what you wish for...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,421 Posts
Actually, closing the border would probably be the nail in the coffin for La Linea - many thousands of them work in Gibraltar. In fact the whole Campo de Gibraltar benefits massively financially from Gibraltar - so better be careful what you wish for...
Collateral Damage, I'm afroid. What do you reckon Spain should do, donate the waters?
I don't think the fisherman aren't seeing any of those massive financial benefits that you mention. Or the council. Or the teachers, rubbish collectors, doctors and so on.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,421 Posts
Agree with Sonrisa but if the border is closed that's a problem for OH getting Quorn stuff from Morrisons!

Gibraltar is vile. It always amazes me how a short walk of a few metres can bring about such a changed ambience. It's like Great Yarmouth on heat...tacky, tawdry, tasteless...with a Marks and Spencers that reminds me of Barnsley Co-op in the nineteen-fifties and very few 'quality' shops.

But it's 'ours' and the inhabitants want it to stay that way which is the sole reason for keeping the status quo.
Same with the Falklands...

So I think the Government made a bad move. It could serve to distract from the state of the economy, I suppose, just like the Argentinian expropriation...
oh I don't think is a dristraccion at all, people are very much aware of the economic woes. IT amuses me that the british appear to think that just becuase of our economic agony, we shouldn't complain about Gibraltar's offensive and illegal claim of Spanish waters and the constant bulliying. I wonder whats the logic behind that.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,421 Posts
Thanks for this information :clap2:. I had no idea there was a problem or that this stuff was going on!!!

Jo xxx[/QUO
Somehow the british media has made it look like the queen Sofia is having a tantrum because she wants Gibraltar back.

Two sides to every story.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,055 Posts
Totally off topic.

My Father was stationed in Gibraltar in WW2, whilst there the Spaniards infiltrated the rock and blew him up. However he survived without a scratch and later lived in Spain. His neighbour was German with a gammy arm, the British had machine gunned him, whilst he was serving on a U Boat, the b*stards!!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
22,362 Posts
Whatever the rights and wrongs of it all, the fact remains that Gibraltar is and will remain British and Spain can huff and puff all it likes but it can and will do...nada.

Let's not forget, we've been here before. How many years was the border closed under Franco? Did it result in the 'return' of the Rock to Spain?

Both Spain and Gibraltar benefit from the various nefarious activities than go on and will continue to do so. So yes, Spanish people know all about the state of their economy..

But as we Brits know only too well, a bit of nationalism, sabre-rattling, jingoism...all work wonders for a Government under extreme pressure and duress. Ask Mrs.Thatcher whose Falklands campaign helped her get reelected after she'd f****d up our economy.

The fact that the Queen of Spain will boycott the Jubilee celebrations will pass unnoticed in the UK.

Hells bells, I'm boycotting them too.....does anybody care??
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,036 Posts
As far as I am aware the status of the waters around Gibraltar is 'disputed' - not 'Spanish'. Britain and Gibraltar claim a three mile limit (although they are entitled to declare a 12 mile limit if they want) which is the same for any maritime state. Are you saying that the waters inside this three mile limit are Spanish or are you saying that these fishermen are being prevented from fishing further out than three miles?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,421 Posts
THey are "disputed" becuase Gibraltar wants it. As far as Spain is concerned it was never included in the treaty, therefore they do not belong to Gibraltar. Clearly.
Yes 12 miles might be for any maritime state, but Gibraltar isn't a state, is it?. And besides, Gibraltar is what...half a mile wide? How can it possibly claim 12 miles of spanish waters?
Spanish are turning a blind eye at their filthy bunkering business, so I don't see whythey are getting all environmentally anal about some fishing in the (spanish) waters that surround their rock.

Nosense.
 
G

·
THey are "disputed" becuase Gibraltar wants it. As far as Spain is concerned it was never included in the treaty, therefore they do not belong to Gibraltar. Clearly.
Yes 12 miles might be for any maritime state, but Gibraltar isn't a state, is it?. And besides, Gibraltar is what...half a mile wide? How can it possibly claim 12 miles of spanish waters?
Spanish are turning a blind eye at their filthy bunkering business, so I don't see whythey are getting all environmentally anal about some fishing in the (spanish) waters that surround their rock.

Nosense.
Off-topic(ish), but hey...

Given that the Treaty of Utrecht was signed in 1713, culminating in the end to Wars of The Spanish Succession (as we call it), the idea of 12 miles territorial would not really have been on the agenda as it was only during the late 18th and early 19th century that the concept of territorial waters was properly defined and even then it was very loosely applied. Originally it was 3 miles, or the length of a cannon shot and was later changed to 12 nautical miles (approx 22Km). In fact, the UK only changed its territorial waters from 3 nautical miles to 12 in 1987.

The problem with all of this goes back to events 299 years ago, when the world was a very, very different place and no-one would have thought we´d be arguing the toss almost three hundred years later. By definition a treaty, such as Utrecht, is still a concrete agreement and is internationally recognised, therefore quite difficult to simply drop.

Personally, I find it strange that Gib is in British hands still. However, strategically and financially, it benefits the UK and I don´t think this will be necessarily be resolved in the near future.

This one is always going to be a bone of contention.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,036 Posts
THey are "disputed" becuase Gibraltar wants it. As far as Spain is concerned it was never included in the treaty, therefore they do not belong to Gibraltar. Clearly.
Yes 12 miles might be for any maritime state, but Gibraltar isn't a state, is it?. And besides, Gibraltar is what...half a mile wide? How can it possibly claim 12 miles of spanish waters?
Spanish are turning a blind eye at their filthy bunkering business, so I don't see whythey are getting all environmentally anal about some fishing in the (spanish) waters that surround their rock.

Nosense.
Gibraltar is not claiming 12 miles it's only claiming 3 although it has the right to claim 12 if it wanted to. If the treaty didn't mention waters then they should be treated the same as the waters surrounding any other body of land - not treated as the nearest neighbour would like. Clearly.
 
1 - 20 of 85 Posts
Top