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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi guys,

I thought I would set up an account here as I know the knowledge and support is vast thankfully.

Basically I am in a challenging situation with an Indonesian girl I met online about 9 months ago.

We are now deeply in love and talk of our dream of living together most likely in the UK.

Having been made redundant from my last job, I am now searching for a job that meets the financial requirement. Luckily for me my job is a relatively high ranking police officer has found me at least two jobs for myself to apply for within the police.

I am 24 years old and my girl is 19 years old.

She is currently studying for her business and marketing degree in Jakarta.

We met about 10 weeks ago in India where she was studying. We spent two weeks together at the end of her trip, it was truly amazing.

Her parents know about me and absolutely hate me for reason's unknown. But of course they are Muslim, I am not but have no problem becoming, I am also white westerner and I think they hate this also.

My girlfriend was brought up Muslim but you would never have thought it she doesn't follow Islam herself her parents do.

Now I mean she has three years left of studies and we constantly talk about being together. She really wants to be with me, we know now is obviously not the right time, I need time to get myself sorted with a job etc.. Luckily the house I live in is virtually 2 houses in one as we had a good size extension put on a few years ago made for at least 3 people.

Housing is not as issue.

Just she admits she is immature and really wants to be with me more than anything etc.. I want this also. I know anything can happen within a few years.

She wants to get a scholarship anywhere outside of her country next year or year after and fly to visit me etc... She thinks her parents or Indonesian laws can stop her from coming to UK. I beg to differ but really am not one hundred percent certain.

I have many many questions. I would be truly grateful for any advice and support from members.

Thank you so much for your time.

Kind regards,

Jona.

p.s. I apologise if I post in wrong section of forum, please forgive me.
 

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In Indonesia, as in most Asian countries, the family has a much greater power over a member's life than in the West. Therefore, even if legally they can't, her parents CAN stop her from going anywhere. If you don't want to lose her, you'd be wise to never get her into a situation where she needs to choose between you and her family. (Remember: In Asia, you always marry a family, never just a woman. If you want this woman, you need to sort out the situation with her parents, even if it it started with no fault of yours!)
Also becoming Muslim, which the Indonesian society (not law!) would demand from you before marrying her, isn't as easy as you think - new converts are expected to follow the rules much stricter than most born Muslims do. Are you prepared to forgo pork and alcohol for the rest of your life, and all food, drinks, smoke, etc. during daylight for a month each year?
Even without the above issues, an intercultural relationship is always more challenging than a "normal" one. Were you successful in a foreign partner before? Did you ever live abroad? Do you know this woman well enough to be sure she's the right one for you (and you the right one for her)?
Both of you sound quite young - you need to make a lot of considerations before deciding on a permanent step!
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
In Indonesia, as in most Asian countries, the family has a much greater power over a member's life than in the West. Therefore, even if legally they can't, her parents CAN stop her from going anywhere. If you don't want to lose her, you'd be wise to never get her into a situation where she needs to choose between you and her family. (Remember: In Asia, you always marry a family, never just a woman. If you want this woman, you need to sort out the situation with her parents, even if it it started with no fault of yours!)
Also becoming Muslim, which the Indonesian society (not law!) would demand from you before marrying her, isn't as easy as you think - new converts are expected to follow the rules much stricter than most born Muslims do. Are you prepared to forgo pork and alcohol for the rest of your life, and all food, drinks, smoke, etc. during daylight for a month each year?
Even without the above issues, an intercultural relationship is always more challenging than a "normal" one. Were you successful in a foreign partner before? Did you ever live abroad? Do you know this woman well enough to be sure she's the right one for you (and you the right one for her)?
Both of you sound quite young - you need to make a lot of considerations before deciding on a permanent step!
Excellent reply sir!

Well I understand the family can have more 'control' over their children. But it is an illusion really and the only power her parents have over her is the power she gives them.

There will come a time in her life when she will be mature and able to make her own decisions.

Yes we are both young in certain respects in terms of a number but very aware in other respects.

Her parents are never there and she is growing further and further apart from them as time goes on.

She isn't even close to them. She in her own words wants her independence.

In my mind I'm like if she isn't the one I don't know who is, the love we have for each other is beyond words, unexplainable.

We met in India for two weeks and it was incredible.

Currently she needs her parents for finances of course.

If she was more independent and had her own money she would no doubt fill out the visa and come to the UK I have no issues over that.

There is no rush for us, we both need to concentrate on getting ourselves up and running, self empowerment, maturity and looking after ourselves and becoming more whole people within ourselves.

I say to her I will not force her or beg her the choice is hers I just want her to do what makes her truly happy and follow her heart if she so likes.

I'm giving her an offer and it would be a dream for both of us to be together.

Personally I do not want to become Muslim and get involved in that whole dogmatic control system.

I don't want anything to do with her parents if they don't accept me as I am willing to accept them.

They can continue giving away their power to something outside of themselves and believe it is 'god.' Me personally, this doesn't excite me or interest me in the least. I'm done with such childish displays of servile behaviour. Religion is not for me.

Thanks again for the reply it meant a lot to me to hear another person's point of view regarding this very important topic for me.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
The above should make it fairly clear why her parents hate you.

(That's not a judgement, just a statement of fact.)
Hi,

Could you expand on your point please as to why they hate me based on my post?

TO be honest they haven't met me, only seen pictures.

At first her dad laughed when she told him about me because I am a white guy.

Then over the next two days they threatened to kick her out if she mentioned my name and took all her belongings off her.

As far as I know it is because I am a non muslim, white western guy. I am more than willing to accept her parents and I have always said if I had to I would convert but she is the one wanting to get out of that isn't a practising Muslim.

Thanks man
 

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Although you claim you do, your post clearly tells that you are not willing to accept her parents (as they are, not as you want them to be).
Remember my words when the time comes: if she has to choose between you and them, you will lose her!
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Although you claim you do, your post clearly tells that you are not willing to accept her parents (as they are, not as you want them to be).
Remember my words when the time comes: if she has to choose between you and them, you will lose her!
Well I'd rather not listen to your words as they do not inspire me when you say I WILL LOSE HER... how do you know. You can predict the future? I understand what angle you are coming from though because we all know how 'close' the Muslim family usually is.

She said to me now, if she listened to her parents she wouldn't be speaking to me right now as when they say no, it means no forever.

Thanks for the reply.

I don't see why I should have to become Muslim, I mean as a last resort yeah I would. But she already told them I would convert and they still said no.

So at the end of the day I can accept the fact they are Muslim anyway, I don't discriminate.

They are the ones who cannot accept me, that's their issue. Not mine.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Well I'd rather not listen to your words as they do not inspire me when you say I WILL LOSE HER... how do you know. You can predict the future? I understand what angle you are coming from though because we all know how 'close' the Muslim family usually is.

She said to me now, if she listened to her parents she wouldn't be speaking to me right now as when they say no, it means no forever.

Thanks for the reply.

I don't see why I should have to become Muslim, I mean as a last resort yeah I would. But she already told them I would convert and they still said no.

So at the end of the day I can accept the fact they are Muslim anyway, I don't discriminate.

They are the ones who cannot accept me, that's their issue. Not mine.

Also once she gains her own independence and has her own money it makes it much easier for her to choose.

I mean yeah, she is young now, me also. We are in no rush.

We agreed to go with the flow but our goal is to be together, most likely in the UK so we live our lives as if it is happening etc...

If she finds someone else fine, I just want it to flow and to be natural and for her to make her own choices in all this.

She is truly an amazing girl, I have never met a girl like her and our connection is beyond words.

So I will let it flow and concentrate on getting myself a career. Looking at the immigration rules as next years we will see if the financial requirement changes and if the law comes in for a right to appeal in regards to if you are denied once you are denied for life. I'm not concerned though, I'm enjoying what we have now and just know it is all possible once we choose what we want to do.

Thanks again for the replies.

I aplogise if if I come across as arrogant in my posts or something. This isn't the case, this is just the most meaningful situation in my life and it means so much to me.

Thanks!
 

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You are of course free to have your own opinion and ignore/reject advice from somebody who lived in various Asian countries (incl. Indonesia) for 15 years and is married to an Asian.
But do you really understand Asians? Or can you at least accept them as they are (incl. the religious ones, or her parents)?
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
You are of course free to have your own opinion and ignore/reject advice from somebody who lived in various Asian countries (incl. Indonesia) for 15 years and is married to an Asian.
But do you really understand Asians? Or can you at least accept them as they are (incl. the religious ones, or her parents)?
You seem to categorise asians and lump them all in one box.

You cannot generalise like this but to be honest I am more than happy to take advice . I am willing to accept them, I don't care what race or religion they are. They are the ones who have a problem with me and completely reject me.

I don't know what else to say I am not racist.

I do understand generally easterners can have a vastly different culture in some respects I am not saying to her throw away and leave it all behind. I say to her you can have it all, I am not the one making you choose your parents are.

Her mother begged her not to go with me she went crazy.

I am not the close minded one here or scared or fearful.

I accept whoever, I really don't mind. I don't see why I should have to change just because they don't like me.

It's like how about they change because I don't like them... you see makes no sense.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
If you are committing to another culture , you must walk in their shoes! Or stay in your own world . you ha e been given great advice and u are not listening which will result likely in,your having a favorable result .... being a Muslum is a massive commitment and thats what you are going to have to do if u want harmony with the family! plus other bells and whistles u have not even dreamed about yet .You sound a little immature for a relationship of this quality .. start with a puppy
Hey man thanks for the helpful reply.

I've had a dog for 9 years but had to put him to sleep last year from tumour was heartbreaking.

Also I am not the one who didn't mention the fact that they were Muslim until 6 months into the relationship. That was her. I was the one who was constantly asking about her parents, her culture and why she doesn't celebrate Christmas and she was like it's not big deal blah blah etc....

I trusted her as she trusted me and we still do.

I have got to get myself a job and a career on the go or how ever you want to put it. I have to sort my life out first and let me and my girl flow ...

Look I am willing to do what it takes. I'm lost at the moment to be honest with what shall I do with her. I don't feel converting will help anytime soon her parents already said they don't care if I convert or not. I cannot change the colour of my skin and I cannot be Indonesian and an easterner, that is their issue I believe.

Look I leave it down to her I give her the freedom of choice, something which her culture and family never have given her if it comes down to it. She doesn't need her parent's permission at the end of the day. Albeit it would make things much easier.

Then if it comes down to it and she picks her parents over me then so be it's out of my hands it just tells me she obviously wasn't the girl for me and doesn't love me as much as I thought.

So to be honest whatever happens at the end of the day is fine, I have to be ok with it.

She's amazing, highly attractive, cute and all of that fun stuff but as the saying goes there's plenty more fish in the sea and tbh I'm used to being single, she is my first girl after 24 years old so it's fine really. It was fun whilst it lasted.

All I know is, in my heart it can be done, I'm willing to convert because I love her and I don't mind being a Muslim and playing ball with her parents for as long as it takes but somehow I don't feel they will ever accept that and to be honest once she is in UK with me then who cares what her parent's think.

How about they dance to my tune, how come it's always the non religious ones who have to conform. Silly but true.

We'll see guys what happens, I will just let it flow.

Thanks for the tips and advice.

x
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
If you are committing to another culture , you must walk in their shoes! Or stay in your own world . you ha e been given great advice and u are not listening which will result likely in,your having a favorable result .... being a Muslum is a massive commitment and thats what you are going to have to do if u want harmony with the family! plus other bells and whistles u have not even dreamed about yet .You sound a little immature for a relationship of this quality .. start with a puppy
Oh tell me about the other bells and whistles also please that I might not have dreamt about .....

thanks
 

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Friend, you are in for a lllllllllllooooooooooooonnnnnnnnnggggggggg ride.

Lived in Jakarta for 7 years, seriously dates 2 Indonesian women then married a Filipina. Mark the words of the person above - if she has to choose, you will lose her.

It's not a case of lumping them all into one category. It's just a stone cold fact and you will learn it in time. Even if you do win the battle, you will lose the war. I advise you to make your peace and I wish you all the very best of luck with your new love interest.

But...why not try to live together in Indonesia first and see how it goes? It is much easier for you to stay here than for her to go there.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 · (Edited)
We shall see what the future holds my man. If it's meant to be it's meant to be.

Thank you for the lovely reply.

I have no issue if she picks her family that's fine for me, it means she isn't the one for me. No big deal because I would leave my family to be with her so I don't mean THAT much to her. Move on, find a girl who is right for me.

It's all good, her dream is to be independent from her family, financially and have her own life. She loves to travel and live in other countries.

She is quite different from the typical stereotype associated with an Indonesian Muslim girl. It's like you'd have to really know her to know her if that makes sense.

I have no doubts eventually she will move away from her family.

She just spent 6 months in Hungary where I stayed with her for two months of her time there.

We will see what happens...
 
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