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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Refusal reason 1:
My wife spouse visa has been refused on the ground that our relationship is not genuine as I have provided unsupported call records and limited email conversation. Also that my name isn't listed on electoral roll of my flat, plus the ECO stated that my ex name is appearing as being on the electoral roll of my flat. This is utter nonsense as I attached a letter from the Electoral board stating that my name will be listed on 5th of July (I am thinking the ECO’s view was that it may not have eventually been listed or he wasn’t paying attention). Also my ex does not even know where I currently live and there is no way she would appear on my currents flat electoral roll if we live in different cities.
Solution 2:
My solution to this is printed out email conversation that span 9 months (60 pages) and got my mobile phone provider to send me itemised call records showing my name, account number and mobile number.
Refusal reason 2:
The other reasons were not meeting the financial requirement due to June missing bank statement and employment reference letter (even though I have provided contract of employment).
Solution 2:
I have called for a copy of June bank statement and got an employment reference letter from my employer stating terms of employment and that I earn 30k plus. Additionally I have started my current job in the last 11 months.
Question
1. Can you please advise on the appropriate ground of appeal? This is the most crucial question I want answers to please
2. Are my solutions sufficient enough? If not please advise.

Kind regards
 

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How does a boat load of printed e-mails prove a genuine relationship?

What else did you provide to prove your relationship and marriage when you submitted your application?
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Hi Crawford,

Thanks for you reply.

The email was part of evidence of our relationship. With the initial application I provided unsupported call record for at least 8 months, picture of our marriage, marriage certificate, wife's new passport in my last name, affidavit for change of name and news paper publication.

The ECO only had problem with the call record as he said its printed online and does not have my name and account number and also said the emails content are limited. He seem happy with the rest of evidence provided. Hence the reason I have called for a itemised call records from my network provided showing my name and account number. I have also printed more email as oppose to few I initially printed. To be honest these are the only two medium we communicate. We occasionally do Skype video but I don't suppose you can get a video call record from Skype.

Kindly advise on grounds of appeal.

Regards
 

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Hi Crawford,

Thanks for you reply.

The email was part of evidence of our relationship. With the initial application I provided unsupported call record for at least 8 months, picture of our marriage, marriage certificate, wife's new passport in my last name, affidavit for change of name and news paper publication.

The ECO only had problem with the call record as he said its printed online and does not have my name and account number and also said the emails content are limited. He seem happy with the rest of evidence provided. Hence the reason I have called for a itemised call records from my network provided showing my name and account number. I have also printed more email as oppose to few I initially printed. To be honest these are the only two medium we communicate. We occasionally do Skype video but I don't suppose you can get a video call record from Skype.

Kindly advise on grounds of appeal.

Regards
You can get skype logs assuming you use the same computer or cell phone, i just printed a years worth of logs today. Just call dates and instant messages.

Did you include any other photos of you together? Trips together with hotel reservations or flight tickets? Family gatherings with photos?
 

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Hi Crawford,

Thanks for you reply.

The email was part of evidence of our relationship. With the initial application I provided unsupported call record for at least 8 months, picture of our marriage, marriage certificate, wife's new passport in my last name, affidavit for change of name and news paper publication.

The ECO only had problem with the call record as he said its printed online and does not have my name and account number and also said the emails content are limited. He seem happy with the rest of evidence provided. Hence the reason I have called for a itemised call records from my network provided showing my name and account number. I have also printed more email as oppose to few I initially printed. To be honest these are the only two medium we communicate. We occasionally do Skype video but I don't suppose you can get a video call record from Skype.



Kindly advise on grounds of appeal.

Regards
Just based on what you have written it appears that you only met on your wedding day. Have you any proof of previous meetings, subsequent meetings after the wedding, met her family, she met yours, trips together?
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
I have known her for at least 15 yrs before now. Her elder brother is my friend. We first stated talking in Aug last year when her brother told me she has split with her ex husband and after about 6 months of talking we decided we are meant for each other and should get married. All this is apparent in our email conversation plus the fact that we talk a lot on the phone.

We got married in June and she applied for spouse visa in Sept 2013. Going back home is not cheap and its logical that we communicate via phone, Skype and email.

As much as I appreciate that we have to prove that our relationship is genuine. I don't think there is any immigration law that states that you have to have met in person before or after your wedding day. I have been looking at other possible evidence of our relationship I can provide.

It was stated that I can appeal under section 82(1) of Immigration Act 2002. Would you be kind to advise on which of the grounds listed under this section I can appeal?
 

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Paragraph 290 (ii) of the Immigration Rules requires that the parties to an intended marriage or civil partnership have met each other.
The immigration tribunal has interpreted ‘to have met’ as ‘to make the acquaintance of’ which means that provided the parties have made the acquaintance of each other, that acquaintance does not need to be in the context of marriage or civil partnerships.
The tribunal decided that ‘met’ implies a face-to-face meeting itself resulting in the making of mutual acquaintance.
http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/s...d/family/fiance-civilpartners.pdf?view=Binary

So it's open to question whether merely meeting on the wedding day itself meets the requirement of 'having met' of the immigration rules.
 

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I have known her for at least 15 yrs before now. Her elder brother is my friend. We first stated talking in Aug last year when her brother told me she has split with her ex husband and after about 6 months of talking we decided we are meant for each other and should get married. All this is apparent in our email conversation plus the fact that we talk a lot on the phone.

We got married in June and she applied for spouse visa in Sept 2013. Going back home is not cheap and its logical that we communicate via phone, Skype and email.

As much as I appreciate that we have to prove that our relationship is genuine. I don't think there is any immigration law that states that you have to have met in person before or after your wedding day. I have been looking at other possible evidence of our relationship I can provide.

It was stated that I can appeal under section 82(1) of Immigration Act 2002. Would you be kind to advise on which of the grounds listed under this section I can appeal?
Your response implies that whereas you have known of this woman's existence for 15 years you only began corresponding with her via the Internet and phone in August 2012. You married in June 2013 when by all accounts you first met, and you have not met since ?

The following is an interesting comment from the link Joppa provided:

Internet relationships and the requirement to have met. A relationship that has developed over the internet does not satisfy the requirement 'to
have met' unless the relationship included a personal face-to-face meeting between the couple concerned. Evidence of a face-to-face meeting might include a travel history, or relevant email exchanges detailing meetings.


I don't know under what grounds you have course to appeal.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Thanks for sharing this immigration guidance/rule (Paragraph 290 (ii))with me. Very helpful. I reckon this is open to debate.

We lived and grew up in the same neighborhood and we met in 2008 before she got married and also in 2010 when she was married. I have printed out ticket for my travel in 2008 and 2010 which proves that I travel home but doesn't prove that we met.

It is reasonable that we have been communicating by mobile, email, and Skype whilst developing a relation. Due to the nature of my job, it was difficult to get long holiday at work, and a short trip to home to visit me will be expensive (approx £1800). The relationship took time to develop, from initial contact till when we started talking about spending time together. All of this is evident in our email conversation.

Can anyone please advise of appropriate ground of appeal and there are 7 listed in under section 82(1).

I really appreciate everyone comment. It has help joggle me memory and help me think a bit more like the ECO would think

Kind regards
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
You can get skype logs assuming you use the same computer or cell phone, i just printed a years worth of logs today. Just call dates and instant messages.

Did you include any other photos of you together? Trips together with hotel reservations or flight tickets? Family gatherings with photos?


Hello Kylemacca01,

Can you please send me a guide on how to print video call and chat records on Skype?


Kind regards
 

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I think they don't take time to read all the contents of the emails..... photos with family,friends are normally a plus.we didn't provide an wedding photos but we had a few from different places we visited together.
 

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Hey Jazi!

For Skype, you'll need to open the program on your computer. You can click on your spouse's name to pull up the chat history. Make sure that it's clear that her username is her; i.e. if her username is "golflover" then it's not clear that it's her whereas if it was "jsmith" and her name is Jane Smith then it's clear. I'm not sure if it's possible, but if the username is not clear then perhaps she can change it and it might reflect in your call history. At any rate, you'll need proof that "golflover" is Jane Smith if they're not correlated; she should have email confirmation from Skype when she set up her account.


To get screen shots:

If you're on a Mac you can press on the keyboard Command Shift 3 to take a screen shot of the entire screen. It should save either to your desktop or to a folder designated for screen shots. If you can't find them, use your spotlight search for "Screen Shot" and it should show up. Alternatively, you can press Command Shift 4 and your mouse will turn into a screen shot tool; you can click the corner of the area you'd like to screen shot and drag the cursor (while clicked) to expand the area.

If you're on a PC (I haven't used on in a while!) you can press "Print Screen" or "Prnt Scrn" on your keyboard. You can open a program, such as Paint, and click on the Edit tab and click Paste (or Ctrl V on your keyboard). Your screenshot from when you pressed Print Screen should be pasted and you can print it.

Joppa has mentioned not to provide TOO much proof of communication (which for many of us is hundreds of pages!) and said a good rule of thumb is a few screen shots per every 6 months. If your case calls for extra proof then I would suggest supply one screen shot of conversation per month or thereabout. With my application I just picked the screens that showed our longest conversations every couple of months.

Alternatively, if you used Skype on your iPhone you can also take a screen shot of that. Hold down the home button and press the power button (on the top right) and your screen will go all white for a second, as if a flash went off. You can do this with emails as well to show proof of communication or FaceTime. Just make sure anything your providing shows the date and, ideally, how long the conversation was (as many get dropped!). The photos automatically get saved to your Photos app on your iPhone. I'm not positive, but I reckon this is available on other smart phones.

I hope this helps and stay positive! Remember to scrutinize your own documents before sending them out and also remember that they only see you on paper and not as your thoughts and feelings. Not that they don't care, but the burden of proof is on you to show that you and your wife are in a subsisting and meaningful relationship.

Good luck!
 

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One other thing to consider when providing screen shots of email communication... be sure that the content that you are "shooting" doesn't contain information that you don't want a total stranger reading... i.e. if you are getting intimate in your chatter, you might want to perhaps go to the next group of messages and capture them.

Whilst I'm sure that the ECO really doesn't care about the content, it might not necessarily be appropriate to be sending in content that is meant to remain in the realm of the boudoir or your private email account.

On the same vein, you might want to make sure that the tabs you have up in your browser aren't untoward either... I once randomly posted a screen shot on FaceBook and one of my friends asked why I was looking at a particular website - the open tab was totally innocent, but one of the other tabs I had open wasn't one that I really wanted the world to see.
 
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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Hello Everyone,

I so much appreciate all your comment. Its has been very helping and made me gather more document to support our rel is genuine. However I still have 3 question I need answer to as I have only got one week before I appeal.

Questions:

1) Under what appropriate ground can I appeal considering refusal reasons and documents I submitted.

2) If I complete online appeal, do I need to send the new support documents after completing the online application

3) Do I only send new support document dated before the date of original application or I have to send all support documents I submitted for the original application?


Kind regards
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
I think I am clear on the ground of appeal now as I have read the immigration rule over and over again and relevant sections and paragraphs.

Can anyone please tell me if I need to send all support documents attached with the old application or just new evidence to support my appeal?

Any advice on online appeal will also be useful.



Regards
 

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Only new documents which were available at the time of original application but weren't submitted.
You can scan them and send as email attachment.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Only new documents which were available at the time of original application but weren't submitted.
You can scan them and send as email attachment.

The ECO said the search he/she had carried out revealed that I am not listed on the electoral roll. He also stated that my ex-wife who doesn't even know where I live at the moment is listed on this property. This is incorrect as I attached a letter dated 10th of June stating that I will be listed on that property on 5th of July. My immediate though was he ignored it because as far as he's concerned the letter didn't say I was already on the electoral roll or he simply was an oversight.

In this instance I have recently received a letter from the Electoral board asking me to update my record. The letter clearly shows that I am the only one currently listed on the property from July till present. In this instance can I make a copy of the new letter and the old one and attach it to prove I am listed?
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
The ECO said the search he/she had carried out revealed that I am not listed on the electoral roll of my flat. He also stated that my ex-wife who doesn't even know where I live at the moment is listed on this property. This is incorrect, I attached a letter from the electoral board dated 10th of June stating that I will be listed on the property on 5th of July. My immediate though was he ignored it because as far as he's concerned the letter didn't say I was already on the electoral roll or he simply was an oversight.


He stated that I supplied a tenancy agreement showing I live in a one bedroom flat and he found my ex-wife is listed on the electoral roll of this flat. He therefore reckons Me, my ex-wife, and my new wife intend to live together at this flat so he is not satisfied that me and my new wife intend to live together permanently. He then refuse her application under paragraph E-ECP 2.10. Now I think this is wrong application of paragraph E-ECP 2.10. His search is either inadequate or inaccurate. My ex wife has no clue where I stay an has never step a foot at my door let alone be listed on the electoral roll. So I intend to appeal on the ground of wrong application of E-ECP .2.10. I also intend to appeal on the ground the the ECO could have used his discretion to request for the missing June bank statement (Financial requirement appendix 2 of FM)


I have recently received a letter from the Electoral board asking me to update my record. The letter clearly shows that I am the only one currently listed on the property from July till present. I have also requested an Experian Statutory report showing I am listed on this property. In this instance can I make a copy of the new letter from the electoral board and the Experian statutory report and the old letter I attach with the old application (he didnt take a note f or disregarded) to prove I am listed on the electoral roll and live alone in the property?
 
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