Question for people who are living in the UK

8689 Views 92 Replies 21 Participants Last post by bob_bob, May 24, 2012

Pesky Wesky

Discussion Starter · May 14, 2012

This is a genuine question - I'm not trying to prove a point - for people who are living in the UK - people like Jojo, or newbies who are asking about moving to Spain.
Is there any news on tv, radio or newspapers about what is happening in Spain ie more than 5 million unemployed, cuts in health and education, Spaniards emigrating to look for work, more than 50% of the under 25's without work etc etc? Or is it just largely ignored?
I'm just wondering why people are still asking about moving to Spain with family in tow to look for work, especially people with no qualifications and no language skills. There has to be a reason more than bad weather.

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Wannabe Expat

· #2 · May 14, 2012

Reasons for moving to Spain!

Pesky Wesky said:
This is a genuine question - I'm not trying to prove a point - for people who are living in the UK - people like Jojo, or newbies who are asking about moving to Spain.
Is there any news on tv, radio or newspapers about what is happening in Spain ie more than 5 million unemployed, cuts in health and education, Spaniards emigrating to look for work, more than 50% of the under 25's without work etc etc? Or is it just largely ignored?
I'm just wondering why people are still asking about moving to Spain with family in tow to look for work, especially people with no qualifications and no language skills. There has to be a reason more than bad weather.

The weather sure doesn't help! It's rained every day since I got back from Oliva about a month ago and this week we're back to 8-9C. There is in fact quite a lot of coverage about the unemployment in Spain on the TV and in newspapers as well as online, but obviously the people who need jobs who are still thinking of moving to Spain don't see them.

I think people are attracted (after the weather of course) by the sun, sea and the sand, the laid back lifestyle, the cheap vino and the cheap eating out. I would think there's less anti-social behaviour problems in Spain when compared to the UK as well. Also I think older people are shown more respect in countries like Spain and Italy than here in the UK and the cost of living does still seem cheap to me in Spain if you take a typically Spanish town irather than an ex-pat enclave on the Costa del Sol

Muddy

· #3 · May 14, 2012

Pesky Wesky said:
This is a genuine question - I'm not trying to prove a point - for people who are living in the UK - people like Jojo, or newbies who are asking about moving to Spain.
Is there any news on tv, radio or newspapers about what is happening in Spain ie more than 5 million unemployed, cuts in health and education, Spaniards emigrating to look for work, more than 50% of the under 25's without work etc etc? Or is it just largely ignored?
I'm just wondering why people are still asking about moving to Spain with family in tow to look for work, especially people with no qualifications and no language skills. There has to be a reason more than bad weather.

Hi there
Well it is a good question considering the situation in Spain.
I think there is so much bad news around in Europe as far as the news channels go maybe Spain doesn't get as much of a mention as you might expect!
Greece keeps steeling the limelight so to speak these days and for some time. Every 15 mins it gets a mention. Right now it seems to be all the news channels are talking about.
Spain does get a mention but I've seen annalists just last week when interviewed saying Spain isn't anywhere in such a bad spot as Greece is.
I agree with that but it depends on your point of view and situation.
Me I still want to move to Spain as I've been thinking and looking for such a long time. So the economic mess isn't going to make me change my plans hopefully.
Online news is covering Spain better think, but you still have to look for it. There are more football stories I can see right now even than Spain and Greece together!! That's the news for you..! Doom, gloom and football, and IMO not very balanced across a wider field of subjects.

It is surprising to see the odd question when people seem not to have done much news watching regarding jobs in Spain, like setting up a bar etc!
I personally plan to leave enough cash in the bank so I can survive for a few years, helpfully setup my own business which I've done in the UK before.
I think all the doom and gloom in the UK news can just make you think (I want out) and ASAP! So perhaps this and the lure of sun and sand will be enough for some to take a very big risk!

To recap, I've seen the news mention about the Spanish bonds, just over 6% now which made more of a splash before when it was approaching 6%!!
Unemployment has been mentioned also. But like I said Greece keeps getting much more focus as it looks more likely to default as it looks none of the parties can agree. That means time has pretty much run out for them to get the next load of wonga!

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mrypg9

· #4 · May 14, 2012

The 'gloom and doom ' in the UK is nothing like that in Spain. UK unemployment at under 9%, Spanish unemployment at 25%, over 34% in some areas...no comparison.
BBC 2 Newsnight and the quality press frequently run pieces about the Spanish economic meltdown.
There was an hour-long programme on BBC 4 Radio 4 this morning.
Most serious analysts will report that Spain is in a very bad state indeed.

Claire la richarde

· #5 · May 14, 2012

I think it depends on what news media you read or watch. I'm a Guardian reader (don't everybody start) and the Guardian/Observer have carried plenty of stories about the economic situation in Spain. The Sun and the Mirror, very few. And, of course, there are people who only read the Daily Star...

Also, there are people who deliberately don't watch the news on telly, "Oh, no, it's too depressing", and change channels when a news programme comes on - and that's if they're not permanently tuned to channels that don't carry news programmes at all. So they don't see those few stories on the main channels' news programmes about the Spanish economy.

I wonder, too, whether there's an element of swallowing the message, much promulgated by the Government here, that everyone who's unemployed is just too lazy to go and get a job. So people who have this belief, even if they know there are millions of people jobless in Spain, may well believe that they can jack in their job in the UK and go and get one in Spain because they're "hard-working" and "willing to turn their hand to anything", unlike the workshy unemployed.

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Wannabe Expat

· #6 · May 14, 2012

Claire la richarde said:
I think it depends on what news media you read or watch. I'm a Guardian reader (don't everybody start) and the Guardian/Observer have carried plenty of stories about the economic situation in Spain. The Sun and the Mirror, very few. And, of course, there are people who only read the Daily Star...

Also, there are people who deliberately don't watch the news on telly, "Oh, no, it's too depressing", and change channels when a news programme comes on - and that's if they're not permanently tuned to channels that don't carry news programmes at all. So they don't see those few stories on the main channels' news programmes about the Spanish economy.

I wonder, too, whether there's an element of swallowing the message, much promulgated by the Government here, that everyone who's unemployed is just too lazy to go and get a job. So people who have this belief, even if they know there are millions of people jobless in Spain, may well believe that they can jack in their job in the UK and go and get one in Spain because they're "hard-working" and "willing to turn their hand to anything", unlike the workshy unemployed.

Hi Claire

I think there's a lot of truth in your post.

bob_bob

· #7 · May 14, 2012

It is mentioned but not really front page news. For a lot its the 'dream' of working a few hours then back to the villa and sipping a few pinucoolarders or dackareees, as Del would say. Not reality is it.

To be honest why would anyone without specific skills/qualifications, speak Spanish and have a firm job want to move to Spain for anyway, certainly those with children what do they think Harry and Joan will do in the future. A move to an English speaking country yes, go for it but Spain, Portugal etc? Only when the pension kicks in IMHO.

Seb*

· #8 · May 14, 2012

I will let you know in two weeks :clap2:

As mentioned before I think it really depends on the media you consume. I had a quick look at the ITV news last night and there was nothing about the European economy. BBC 1 news cover more, but as mentioned before Greece seems to get a lot of time at the moment.

So the "more shallow" media seems to ignore the European economy as much as possible. The other thing is the bad state of the UK economy gets totally exaggerated IMHO. If you read some papers you might think the UK is heading straight towards a depression and half the population is unemployed. Compared to many other countries the UK is in a rather good position and there is a good chance of growth in the near future, but people get told the opposite.

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Pesky Wesky

Discussion Starter · #9 · May 14, 2012

Well, that's been interesting reading for me anyway, so thanks to those of you who have posted.
It's amazing how incorrect national images last and last. Just when is the picture of everything British being run well and efficiently (British Rail??), British politeness and reserve (ever been to Magaluf, Ibiza or Benidorm at 3:00am??) going to hit reality??
Well, the same goes for Spain. Sun, sea and sangria just doesn't do it anymore. Things change and my goodness how things have changed in Spain, but not everyone's keeping up with it.
As people have mentioned here, my impression is that news about Spain is not front page in the UK, so you might have to search for it, but if you're interested, you can find it. So... if you'r e thinking of coming to Spain search Google or a variety of newspapers for everything to do with Spain before even entertaining the idea of moving.

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Lucie123

· #10 · May 14, 2012

Been alot on the news the last few weeks. Not much before that. I guess i could be sterotypical and say the sort of ppl who still want to move and need work etc dont get that sort of news in the press they watch and read. ie sun etc

calahonda

· #11 · May 14, 2012

It may sound like a cliche but the weather is a huge draw for me and many others. Since I moved back to the UK we haven't had any decent weather to speak of, its just cold and wet and everyone just stays indoors. Its really quite depressing. As you have been living in Spain for the last 17 years you wont have experienced the numbing cold for months on end, a few days of bright weather then back to clound and rain.
You take it for granted waking up and seeing the sun, feeling its warmth.
Plus if you are struggling to make it happen in the UK, why not give it a go and move to Spain, there are opertunities like everywhere, but that golden disc in the sky makes all the difference to me. People are happier, frendlier and more outgoing.
I don't think people are coming to Spain with their eyes shut, just want to try somewhere new. Believe me there are parts of the UK with worst unemployment figures than Spain, and its cold and miserable.......Its a no-brainer really.

Lucie123

· #12 · May 14, 2012

Yeah i agree re the weather. it is very depressing. dark gloom day after day and then when you do get some half decent weather you cant go anywhere cause the countries so overpopulated you are continually stuck in traffic and everywheres packed. even on a crap day my main city park is full of cars and dont even bother trying on a half decent weekend

i think alot of people think if they have nothing to lose in the uk then why not give it a go. if it doesnt work you come back here and live off benefits etc. which is what they are probably doing now. theres alot of desperate people

thrax

· #13 · May 14, 2012

Clearly as the above posts illustrate the weather is an integral part of wanting to move over here. However, I wanted to say on this thread that it perhaps isn't quite the doom and gloom everywhere in Spain. I know others live in the area I live in but honestly, go to Mercadona, Eroski, Supersol etc and you really wouldn't think there was a problem. The shopping centres are always packed and people are leaving with bags and bags of shopping. And they aren't getting it all on credit which is really difficult to get. I teach here and all of the parents I know have full time jobs and they have hope for their kids futures (albeit they recognise they need to be able to speak English when it comes to getting a job). Of course and just as in UK it is different in different regions but down here in the Eastern bit of Andalucia it isn't all doom and gloom. My daughter, who lives in UK, is really struggling to find work - there isn't any and she lives in London. There is a huge increase in street crime, regardless of Government figures, and she doesn't feel safe going out after dark (and believe me this is a kid (23) who is pretty streetwise), she hates the weather, the culture of not being able to do anything without being questioned etc etc etc. Haqving said that she still loves UK and isn't up for leaving yet (perhaps because she can come visit and have some good weather an no problems for a few weeks whenever she needs it). Yes things are bad in Spain and in some areas absolutely dreadful, but just like everywhere else in the world, it isn't happening absolutely everywhere. Thought I'd mention it. Sorry if I cause any offence (sic).

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Pesky Wesky

Discussion Starter · #14 · May 14, 2012

calahonda said:
It may sound like a cliche but the weather is a huge draw for me and many others. Since I moved back to the UK we haven't had any decent weather to speak of, its just cold and wet and everyone just stays indoors. Its really quite depressing. As you have been living in Spain for the last 17 years you wont have experienced the numbing cold for months on end, a few days of bright weather then back to clound and rain.
You take it for granted waking up and seeing the sun, feeling its warmth.
Plus if you are struggling to make it happen in the UK, why not give it a go and move to Spain, there are opertunities like everywhere, but that golden disc in the sky makes all the difference to me. People are happier, frendlier and more outgoing.
I don't think people are coming to Spain with their eyes shut, just want to try somewhere new. Believe me there are parts of the UK with worst unemployment figures than Spain, and its cold and miserable.......Its a no-brainer really.

18 actually now, I have to change the thingy!
I do still appreciate the better weather here and I do realise it raises my quality of life. I would find it hard to cope in England now, but not only for the weather. The people, the attitudes towards one another, the grumpiness and grottiness and dinginess that I see when I go back.
But that's me and it's another thing.
So the weather issue is something I understand - to a certain extent, but unless you suffer from SAD, really suffer from it I mean it's not a strong enough basis to build a life in another country I don't think.
When you say

if you are struggling to make it happen in the UK, why not give it a go and move to Spain, there are opertunities like everywhere,

This is where people are making a mistake, time and time again IMO, and I know a few people here who'd agree with me. It's much tougher to make a go of it in a place where you don't speak the language and where the culture and customs are different, where you don't have friends and family around you, where there are no benefits paid into your account every month and where very likely (but not with 100% assurance admitedly) you will not find work and you will have to deal with money/family/possibly health problems arising from this.

All this for a bit of sun because you didn't find out the real story before you decided to upsticks?

And where are the opportunities everywhere in Spain?

And where is unemployment as bad in the UK as in Spain's Andalucia at 35%?

This from April 2012

PS - I don't mean you, I mean British people in general

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jojo

· #15 · May 14, 2012

Pesky Wesky said:
This is a genuine question - I'm not trying to prove a point - for people who are living in the UK - people like Jojo, or newbies who are asking about moving to Spain.
Is there any news on tv, radio or newspapers about what is happening in Spain ie more than 5 million unemployed, cuts in health and education, Spaniards emigrating to look for work, more than 50% of the under 25's without work etc etc? Or is it just largely ignored?
I'm just wondering why people are still asking about moving to Spain with family in tow to look for work, especially people with no qualifications and no language skills. There has to be a reason more than bad weather.

The UK media, news etc is so rapped up in its own doom and gloom, that it doesnt really get involved in Spain, other than the odd mention of strikes or Europe is in a financial mess. But the British public are used to it and I'm sure are so bogged down with it all (me included) Then theres the weather, drought, floods, violence, yobs, benefit cheats, PC stuff, price rises, job losses.... Around them everyone is miserable and stressed, they just want to get out.

Then there is that memory of the care free, sunny holiday in Spain. Wouldnt it be nice to just get the hell out of the miserable UK and open a bar/get a job in Spain- nothing fancy, just enough to live on, lots of sunshine, vino, relaxing by the pool.

Jo xxx

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Seb*

· #16 · May 14, 2012

calahonda said:
Plus if you are struggling to make it happen in the UK, why not give it a go and move to Spain, there are opertunities like everywhere, but that golden disc in the sky makes all the difference to me.

Sorry to be the party pooper, but if you can't make it in the UK there is no chance in hell you can make it in Spain under current conditions. What is going on in people's minds? If you can't find work in the UK with a relatively low unemployment rate, what makes you think you can find something in Spain? BTW: "you" like people in general, no reference to any posters

And just my personal experience with the weather after three years: the weather is nice several months of the year. But you know, it rains in Spain as well ... actually the first year we've been here we had non-stop rain for like 6 weeks and when I say non-stop I mean non-stop. Literally it can rain for weeks without a break. Ah yeah don't forget the massive winds that messed up our fencing a lot lol.
There are some lovely months, but the summers can get really hot. Working 8-12 hours a day with temperatures of up to 40º and high humidity is no fun. We ended up not leaving the house whenever we could during the high summer time and had to hide in our airconned room.
Then there are the really cold and wet winters you have to suffer, cause most homes are not insulated and not many have decent heating. Heating is expensive and not very efficient down here.
Right now is a lovely time of the year, 25-28º and sunshine - it's great. Soon it will get really hot and believe me working in that heat is tough! Mañana and siestas don't really exist anymore - there goes the dream of the laid back lifestyle - it's just not feasable anymore

I know my ramblings are not helping people who have set their minds on coming down here and want to live the dream - they have to experience it themselves

Just some warning words, sunshine is not everything and it does not turn a sucky existence into something great

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calahonda

· #17 · May 14, 2012

Pesky Wesky said:
18 actually now, I have to change the thingy!
I do still appreciate the better weather here and I do realise it raises my quality of life. I would find it hard to cope in England now, but not only for the weather. The people, the attitudes towards one another, the grumpiness and grottiness and dinginess that I see when I go back.
But that's me and it's another thing.
So the weather issue is something I understand - to a certain extent, but unless you suffer from SAD, really suffer from it I mean it's not a strong enough basis to build a life in another country I don't think.
When you say
This is where people are making a mistake, time and time again IMO, and I know a few people here who'd agree with me. It's much tougher to make a go of it in a place where you don't speak the language and where the culture and customs are different, where you don't have friends and family around you, where there are no benefits paid into your account every month and where very likely (but not with 100% assurance admitedly) you will not find work and you will have to deal with money/family/possibly health problems arising from this.

All this for a bit of sun because you didn't find out the real story before you decided to upsticks?

And where are the opportunities everywhere in Spain?

And where is unemployment as bad in the UK as in Spain's Andalucia at 35%?

This from April 2012

PS - I don't mean you, I mean British people in general

Haha, so lets recap.....what you don't like about the UK is the rubbish weather, people all have poor attitudes, they are grumpy and the place is grotty and dingy. Hmmm, why would people want to leave ???
As for your comments about language etc, in the CDS ? More a dialect problem down there, scouse, cockney, Brummy...take your pick. I agree there customs are not quite what I'd expected, but you will get used to them !! haha......really, if I hadn't lived there before you would certainly put me off. I have noticed that the people who have lived in Spain the longest are the worst for putting people off. You love the country, and have made a go of it, why can't they ???

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Lucie123

· #18 · May 14, 2012

Personally i dont think trying to put a downer on spanish weather is really gonna work with people living in the uk and putting up with the weather here its funny if nothing else. of course its not dry and sunny all the time. but its a thousands time better than the uk and the non excistant summers we have had for the last five years and the freezing winters. ive just been working tonight outside im sat here freezing even though i had my thermals on hat and gloves. it was cold and raining and i was stood in one spot for five hrs. im now sat here with two hotwater bottles trying to defrost. it wont be much different in the next couple of months either.

calahonda

· #19 · May 14, 2012

Seb* said:
Sorry to be the party pooper, but if you can't make it in the UK there is no chance in hell you can make it in Spain under current conditions. What is going on in people's minds? If you can't find work in the UK with a relatively low unemployment rate, what makes you think you can find something in Spain? BTW: "you" like people in general, no reference to any posters

And just my personal experience with the weather after three years: the weather is nice several months of the year. But you know, it rains in Spain as well ... actually the first year we've been here we had non-stop rain for like 6 weeks and when I say non-stop I mean non-stop. Literally it can rain for weeks without a break. Ah yeah don't forget the massive winds that messed up our fencing a lot lol.
There are some lovely months, but the summers can get really hot. Working 8-12 hours a day with temperatures of up to 40º and high humidity is no fun. We ended up not leaving the house whenever we could during the high summer time and had to hide in our airconned room.
Then there are the really cold and wet winters you have to suffer, cause most homes are not insulated and not many have decent heating. Heating is expensive and not very efficient down here.
Right now is a lovely time of the year, 25-28º and sunshine - it's great. Soon it will get really hot and believe me working in that heat is tough! Mañana and siestas don't really exist anymore - there goes the dream of the laid back lifestyle - it's just not feasable anymore

I know my ramblings are not helping people who have set their minds on coming down here and want to live the dream - they have to experience it themselves Just some warning words, sunshine is not everything and it does not turn a sucky existence into something great

Hi Seb, my comment about making it happen in Spain as opposed to the UK has been taken a bit too literally. Just making ends meet in the UK can be a bit grim, but I know lots of people who make ends meet but have great outdoor lives in Spain, make the most of the beach, being outdoors. Its a different lifestyle. I don't mean people turn up and hardly work and somehow get a great life style, we are talking about sensible people who realise they will have to work. Maybe they try something completely new which they wouldn't in the UK.
I don't think anyone will decide to move to Spain on anything I've said, but it is a brilliant country to live in given the right area and a bit of luck. Can't understand why everyone is so down on others doing what they have already done ?

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Pesky Wesky

Discussion Starter · #20 · May 14, 2012 (Edited)

calahonda said:
Haha, so lets recap.....what you don't like about the UK is the rubbish weather, people all have poor attitudes, they are grumpy and the place is grotty and dingy. Hmmm, why would people want to leave ???
As for your comments about language etc, in the CDS ? More a dialect problem down there, scouse, cockney, Brummy...take your pick. I agree there customs are not quite what I'd expected, but you will get used to them !! haha......really, if I hadn't lived there before you would certainly put me off. I have noticed that the people who have lived in Spain the longest are the worst for putting people off. You love the country, and have made a go of it, why can't they ???

Because that was then and this is now!!!

Because I came with a job to go to, even then.

Because I learnt the language

Because I never relied on the Brits in Spain for my living, as many people who post on here wanting to move want to do

But above all because of Spain now.

My aim is NOT to put people off coming. Why would it worry me if people I have never met come to Spain or not? I gain nothing from it - nothing.

I merely, from the experience I have from living, working and forming a family here think I can pass on an idea of what Spain is living through now, what it means to come to Spain in 2012, not 1980 something when I came here.

Most of my posts about this kind of thing are in response to people asking for advice. This isn't - it's a thread I opened myself.

This my reply to another poster who also though we were trying to "burst people's bubbles"
As far as bursting people's bubbles I would advise you to think for a moment about that. Why do you imagine we would do that? What possible interest could a (large) group of foreigners have for putting off other foreigners? There might be one weird, twisted old git on here who has a ulterior motive behind advising immigrants to stay at home, but so many of us??? People of all ages, economic backgrounds, politics. From completely different work profiles, areas of the UK and even musical tastes?? Just why would we do that?? To many it would be advantageous to have more Brits here. More people to install satellite dishes for, to do their gardening for and to serve beer to.

Finally, many who are thinking of coming to Spain are doing it to find work. Now why in the world would you come from a country of 8.4% unemployment to a country of over 20% unemployment with in most cases no or rudimentary Spanish, unrecognised or no qualifications and expect to find a job ?. You say that people know about the unemployment in Spain and I would again say read the posts. Many, not some, many people are genuinely surprised to find that unemployment is higher in Spain, that they will not have health care until they've paid in to the system, that the Spanish, qualified and unqualified, are going to the UK for work etc. Another shocker is that there are several languages in Spain! Many many people who are in the first stages of making a move frankly have no idea about Spain at all, so don't judge the posts by what you know. Think about the original poster.

...a lot of people are desperately looking for better opportunities, a better life, a better future for themselves and their families. How many would make it in today's Spain?

Yes, this is negative. I live here and have lived here for a very long time. I'm worried about my future with a health service that's shrinking, education cuts and businesses closing down left right and centre, and if people ask I will keep telling them the same, as it happens to be the truth.

See the whole thread herehttp://www.expatforum.com/expats/la-tasca/104570-forum-politics.html#post726233

However if you are confident you're not going to muck up your life nor that of the people around you by making the move, and think you can be happy and successful here, come on down - Spain could do with your money!

BTW I live here for a number of different reasons, but I don't think I live in Spain because I don't like certain things in the UK.

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