I'll give it a try if you tell me why I'd want to? I have an RFC and a CURP, do I need anything else?

 

I'll admit to the ice being thin, but beginning this year you (a resident of Mexico) need to generate your "constancia de situacion fiscal". Having an RFC (and CURP) isn't quite enough now. It seems like they are trying to make it a little easier than the IRS and filing a tax return. But - you need to validate your financial situation with SAT - principally using online tools developed by some savy web developers. So you need to provide your RFC, a scanned image of your credential and an email address, you need to enable the speaker and camera on your computer and provide a video of yourself reading a phrase - and when you pass over all those hurdles you need to "sign" your application (apparently using your mouse). That signature needs to be close to the one on the credential you provided. Then within 5 days you should receive a password which you will use to log into your SAT account and confirm the information they have been provided. This is supposed to be done in the month of April.

I had 2 Mexican women (both with PhDs) help me through the process the other day. We put 2 hours into it and finally the application was accepted. Accepted but not approved. I was rejected because the signature I provided looked like that of a 3 year old.

Edit : Here is a link to an interesting video...

 

My very modest income these days comes from two pensions I receive from the States: one from US Social Security and the other from the last job I held there. Why would I need to deal with this new regulation?

 

I am also unsure about that. If I sell real estate there might be an application for this, but I don't know. Maybe someone else does....lots or rumors

 

Well I have interest bearing accounts in Mexico. I also recently 'inherited' my wife's 50% of the house (and paid taxes on that). Maybe it is something which should not be simply ignored IF your utility providers (Telmex, Telcel, CFE, Izzi etc) start requiring this new information of you. I will tell you - you do not want to go through the 'pain" of setting this up, in a hurry. (Kind of like putting the storm shutters up when the palm trees are losing their fronds). It is a little stressful. I would suspect that those with fideicomisos should take note - but I have no idea... I've been told that once you have it all setup, it only takes a few minutes to confirm your SAT data.

I tried again early this morning to create my SAT password. It really is a very 'tech heavy' process. You need to have scanned in your credential (both sides), have enabled your microphone and camera on your computer (you need to submit a video where you repeat a phrase) and, for me anyway, the most difficult part is to 'sign' your application using your mouse/keypad such that it resembles the signature on the back of your credential. Also, sometimes my connectivity (internet and cellphone) can be a bit iffy. At one point they will email you a confirmation 'token' which you have to feed back to them. They start a timer and give you 60 seconds to respond. I have had to ask to have the token sent again because I was not prompt enough. I guess they either expect everyone has the technology available or that OfficeDepot/OfficeMax are going to provide a service. I don't think you want to brave a visit to your local SAT office...

 

I guess they either expect everyone has the technology available or that OfficeDepot/OfficeMax are going to provide a service. I don't think you want to brave a visit to your local SAT office.

If you have a Mexican accountant, they can do this for you. And I'm not sure what you mean about "braving" a visit to the local SAT office. I have always found them to be extremely helpful.

And did you not have an RFC number and password before? If so, there is no need to create a new password to generate a recent Constancia. I've had an RFC and been registered with SAT for years. My accountant got the Constancia for me, no problem.

 

My comment about "braving a visit to the local SAT office" had to do with the hordes of people waiting outside to get in, nothing to do with the employees.

No, I don't have a Mexican accountant. I've never had any "earned income" in Mexico.Just passive income.

Within the last 5 - 6 months I 'discovered' I had a 'real' RFC while at a notary's office. When I was asked for my RFC I mentioned the RFC that had been on my bank statements for years. It was something like X0X1.... It was a generic RFC which I believe was assigned to people such as myself (ourselves). Foreigners with passive income. Anyway - the notary said - here is your 'new' RFC. I never did anything to obtain this RFC. I assume it was created for me by the folks at Citibanamex.

In 2018 we made an appointment and visited the SAT office. We were very open with them and the woman we met sent us home believing that we were doing the right thing. She did not create an RFC for us. We followed that up with a 'free' consultation with a local Mexican accountant (PKF Intl). He looked at our financials and confirmed we were doing the right thing. We offered to make him our accountant but he declined. He looked at our paperwork in front of him on the table and said - you have nothing here, this is not a lot of money... (We thought we had done pretty well for ourselves...). But remember, Mexico (and most of the world except the US) look at 'real' (post-inflation) earnings.

I'm not sure it is SAT's intention that all of us that now have these new RFCs run out today and get Mexican accountants to generate passwords for our accounts. And in closing - I suspect that at this point most residents of Mexico have a CURP (we had to ask that they be generated for us - a seperate visit to INM). I think that given your CURP you can find (online) your RFC.

 

I'm not sure it is SAT's intention that all of us that now have these new RFCs run out today and get Mexican accountants to generate passwords for our accounts

I wasn't suggesting that, just that if you already had an accountant, they could do that for you.

As far as "hoards of people" at the SAT office, before COVID hit, the way it worked, at least at my local SAT office, was that the mornings were reserved for those who had appointments, which you make online on their website, so there was no waiting in line. The afternoons were for walk-ins, first come first served, so yes, that could mean a long line-up.

Then when their offices closed up or had really limited hours and less staff due to Covid regs, they went to appt. only, but it became virtually impossible to get an appointment- they only opened the calendar two weeks ahead, and it didn't seem to matter what time of day you tried to find an empty slot on the calendar, they were all taken.

I don't know how it is working now, because I just recently hired an accountant so as not to have to deal with any of that myself. (I run a small business so have always paid taxes, but as the tax system changed this year, it got too complicated for me to want to figure out myself)

 

Bancomer here got in trouble 20 years ago and had to have RFC for all their customers so they gave us all a RFC on the statement.. When the computer got more sofisticated at SAT they kicked out the RFC we had for years and we had to get a new one...Beware of curp and rfc made up by banks and other institution.. Some are valid and some are not.

 

So, after being in Mexico "awhile", and when I had time after finishing my phd (another story), after 10 years, I went to the hacienda office here in town. It blew me away there was an office here, en el medio de la nada. So, yes there were a few people waiting, not a big deal. The señorita, in just a few minutes, gave me my constancia de situación fiscal, or whatever it's called.

All good, but why do I need it exactly?

Many things that required an rfc before, I was able to do. They just invented an rfc for me and the invented rfcs are all incorrect, about 80% correct.

 

Well I think you will need it for things that are about to change. My two friends (with phds of their own) literally insisted that I establish my account with SAT, generate the password and get ahold of my constancia. (You did record your password, right ?) They are not stupid / silly people. They now would like me to validate my declarations - for which I may need their help. I poked around a little on my own and it looks like one of my banks has submitted my interest against this new RFC.

But for giggles let's compare some basic info on our constancias (if you want). What does it show for your "Fecha inicio de operaciones" ? Mine is 18th of August 2021. I believe that is also the date I was assigned my 'real' RFC. Next - under regimes - what do you see ? Mine says "Sin obligaciones fiscales".

I have two Mexican bank accounts (to backup each other). One bank has already called and asked me for my constancia. Interestingly - my other bank has not yet asked for it - BUT - last weekend my account was locked (yet again). So I took my INE, INAPAM card and my driver's license and tried to get my account unlocked. This bank was one which had created a fictitious RFC for me when I created the account (like 12 years ago). So we looked at the information their computer had for me. They had my new RFC and for some reason, they took my old bogus RFC and slapped it into the field for my CURP. That wasn't nice. So I had to return the next day with my US passport, my Mexican passport and just for the heck of it I printed off my official CURP page. I think I am all squared away at this point (until next time).

I know a few Mexican people who are a little concerned about some things they see going on around them...

 

It sounds like big brother is taking over..so much for the live and let live Mexico.

 

When I was in college my best friend came from a family which had a very properous family business - in a niche market - for 3 generations. So my friend went on to get his MBA, took over the family business from this father and made all the changes he was told to make in business school - the first being - put everything on computers (this was back in the day when Sperry Univac was very popular).

I think we are seeing a generational shift in Mexico. I think the kids are taking over.

 

no kidding I just called my neighbors kid who is 18 to help me with this new mess...

 

Let me know if I can help.

 

Thanks I will see the accountant Tuesday so he should be able to do it, just in case I made an appointment to get a new constancia de situación fiscal.. wrong timing as all the foreigners are going to clog the offices in Guadalajara but if I do not get in in June I will make it in Chiapas in July . I have a virtual ficha not an appointment per say so it could take some time.

 

So I maybe have an RFC. I didn't do anything directly to get it, but I got auto insurance through my bank, and the form they gave me has my address, phone number and below that a field marked R.F.C. with something that looks like it might be valid.

The first two letters are the first two letters of my last name, and the next two letters are NJ (extrajanero?) and then there are six digits, two letters, and another digit.

How do I tell if this is correct?

Is there some web site I can go to and get a printout like I did for the CURP that gives me an official-type piece of paper with my RFC on it?

 

I was looking up the rules for construction the RFC, and the form from my auto insurance where they put it. My name on that policy is written as
First Middle Last NI (there's an NI following my last name). Can anybody guess where that came from? It looks like they just filled that in for my maternal surname, then generated an RFC based on that. Assuming my maternal surname was Ni, then the construction of the RFC is correct. My surname ends in "IN", so it's as if they just started writing it backwards.

Could this all be a data entry error that generated an incorrect RFC that I'm now going to have to expend a lot of effort to unravel?

 

I was looking up the rules for construction the RFC, and the form from my auto insurance where they put it. My name on that policy is written as
First Middle Last NI (there's an NI following my last name). Can anybody guess where that came from? It looks like they just filled that in for my maternal surname, then generated an RFC based on that. Assuming my maternal surname was Ni, then the construction of the RFC is correct. My surname ends in "IN", so it's as if they just started writing it backwards.

Could this all be a data entry error that generated an incorrect RFC that I'm now going to have to expend a lot of effort to unravel?

You could have a look at this video :

Your description of your RFC does not match my RFC very well at all.
The first four characters are alpha and do contain the first initials of my first and last names. I have no idea where the other two characters came from.
The next six digits are my birthdate.
That is followed by three digits which I do not know the meaning of.

In terms of the items mentioned in the video. I'd bet the date of the creation of your RFC was 2021.
I really don't know how they obtained my cell number but they have it and it is correct.
So - unless my cell phone company registered my RFC - it must have been my bank.
You could start at your bank and ask them what RFC they have on file for you - and don't go by any RFC found on say a statement. Ask a human at the bank to look at your account information on their monitor. If they don't respond with an RFC which kind of resembles the format I laid out - you are going to have to update them at some point anyway,

Let us know what you find out...

Edit : But the first two characters ARE in my last name and the next two characters ARE in my first name. So maybe you have your RFC ?

 

So this being Sunday morning I regularly update my finances. I have a Mexican account which I essentially closed in January (I withdrew all funds leaving a 0 balance). Today I pulled down the statements for Jan - Apr for my records. There is a 13 character RFC on that account which in fact looks great. It has the 1st 2 chars of my last name, the first 2 chars of my first name, my date of birth, followed by what is likely a 3 char checksum. I almost wish that WERE my true RFC because that would mean I'd only need to memorize the checksum and I would always know my RFC. Unfortunately that is not the case. The constancia (which matches my CURP to an RFC has a different RFC).

And I'll just throw out this piece of trivia - every citizen / resident has one and only 1 CURP. There is a flag in your CURP which indicates if you are an extranjero. When I became a citizen I figured I would need a new CURP. I was wrong. Once you are an extranjero you are always an extranjero (and you will only ever have one CURP, and I guess now there will only be one valid RFC associated with that CURP). I'm not saying the US is perfect / better, but at least you only have a SSN....

@eastwind - do you use Jr (junior) in your name ?

 

what is the flag that indicate that you are a foreigner? The x because you do not have a second last name as a rule (although it is not true in some countries like Spain)? Is there another flag?

In my RFC the first 4 letters are different from the CURP and they should not be The RFC was redone 3 years ago by SAT in Tuxtla so it should be correct but as I do not have a second last name they took the first 2 letters from my name so who knows..

 

Only the first two characters are the same between my RFC and my CURP.

I'll take a stab at the algorithm for the RFC characters...

• First letter of the paternal surname
  [*]First internal vowel of the paternal surname
  [*]First letter of the given name
  [*]First internal vowel of the given name
  [*]YYMMDD of birthdate
  [*]a 3 character checksum - or some way to guarentee uniqueness (just a guess)

How does my algorithm work for your RFC ?

------------------------------

The "flag" is actually the two characters "NE".

I'm taking this breakdown of the CURP from the site : Breaking Down the Mexican National ID Number (CURP)

The Mexican National ID Number (CURP) is an eighteen character alphanumeric code. It is structured as follows:

• Four letters from the person’s legal name: – First letter of the paternal surname – First internal vowel of the paternal surname – First letter of the maternal surname – First letter of the given name
• Six numbers that are the person’s date of birth in YYMMDD format
• One letter describing the person’s gender: “H” for male (hombre) and “M” for female (mujer)
• Two letters that are the two-letter state abbreviation for the state where the person was born; if the person was born outside of Mexico, the abbreviation “NE” will be used for Nacido en el Extranjero (born abroad)
• Three letters from the person’s legal name: – First internal consonant of the paternal surname – First internal consonant of the maternal surname – First internal consonant of the given name
• One character to avoid duplicate CURPs among people who have similar names, places of birth, and dates of birth; the character is a number that ranges from zero to nine for people born before 2000 and a letter from A to Z for people born since 2000
• One character that is a checksum

 

the only thing that does not check is the RFC third letter which in my case is a of my name and not a vowel but a consonant.. Yes I see your point in the NE good way to sort out the bi nationals or foreigners.

 

The third letter of your RFC should simply be the 1st character of your given name - I'm not sure it matters if it is a vowel or a consonant. But I'm just guessing.

I have a friend whose birthdate is different in her RFC and her CURP (off by a few days). She has a legit reason for this. One bank would not let me set her as a beneficiary because of this.

This RFC is supposed to be a sacred / protected thing. Like a SSN for someone from the US. Yet we can see how relatively easy it is to guess. Perhaps that is the reason they have made it such a 'hurdle' to associate a password with your SAT account. If you go through the process you will understand what I am saying.

 

sorry I meant to say 4th letter of my name on my RFC is a consonant not a vowel on my RFC..
my name is Brigitte and on the RFC they used BR not BI , the rule according to what you posted should be the first internal vowel of the given name so either they screwed up my RFC or the rule for the fourth letter is incorrect.. I guess it could be either or both..

 

I believe the RFC you are looking at is not a real RFC. I say that because of what I mentioned in post #21 above. I had a bank account which had the 1st 2 chars of my last name + 1st 2 chars of my first name. THAT was not a good RFC.

Are you taking that RFC from your constancia ?

Edit : Please remember - I am just guessing...

 

So what happens if you don't get one?

 

If I do not get it done I cannot get the escritura on my house done and cannot sell the house.. Not a detail.. For people who have no insurance who want facturas, no bank account no property.. etc I have no idea.. I guess the first time they need a RFC they will have to go and get one..

 

If you have nothing to lose nothing will happen unless they require it on your visa otherwise who knows..If they want to turn on the screws they can , they are part of the government looking for money so good luck.

 

My guess is that an RFC will be required on death certificates, so if you don't have one you can't die.

@Mango: nope, no junior in my name. I'm going to assume that one is fake, generated by the bank (banamex) when they put together the paperwork for my insurance policy. But I'll try the thing in the video to see if there's one associated with my curp just in case.

The video (the second one) shows a place where you can supply your RFC or your curp, and qroo paul uses the curp, to see if you have an rfc. But can you use that rfc alternative to test your rfc for validity if you have a potentially fake one?

 

The four letters at the start of an RFC work like this: 1. First letter of your (paternal) surname. 2. First vowel within your (paternal) surname (i.e. it’s the first vowel unless the surname starts with a vowel, then it’s the second vowel). 3. First letter of your maternal surname (if you don’t have a maternal surname, then it’s “X”). 4. First letter of your (first) given name.
This link explains it, and explains the exceptions.

Edited to add: Oops, I didn’t see that there was a whole second page in this thread, and this has already been explained.

 

Those rules do not appear to generate the RFC on my constancia.
My RFC has two characters from my last name and two characters from my first name. No X characters.

Maybe I am missing something...

Actually - I think those rules generate the RFC I mentioned in post #21 above - which does not appear to be valid any longer.

Edit : Is anyone else getting this weather today ? I was worried the tiles were going to start coming off the roof...

 

well maesona then my rfc is an exception or a screw up because it is correct..and does not follow those rules or the exceptions. My husband is correct but not mine, my luck

 

Well look what I found ;-)
Consultar, sacar e imprimir el RFC en México

Click on the button at the bottom right, complete the robot test and then validate your RFC.
I tried an old one from a bank and it failed.
I tried the one on constancia and it passed.

And you all ??

 

mine passed

 

Well I think we have beaten this topic enough.

I do think citali that in your situation the reason your RFC differs from your husband's is in the layout of the first four characters of your CURP. I think that the CURP is actually used as a template in constructing the RFC.

For example : the third character in my CURP is an X which causes the RFC generator to pull the two characters; 1st char and 1st vowel from my given name.