[RagsToRich]

Hi,

I'm faily new here but I posted a few things on the Teaching English stick thread...

I am looking to receive productive advise on how to make my plan happen.

I'm planning on moving to Spain between August and October - the extra time allowance is if things don't quite go as planned. The plan is aiming for August.

I'll be selling all of my possessions in England, and leaving my job, but not burning all my bridges. So there will be a route back for me, but it won't be very appealing and I'd be horribly loathed to take it. But if I should end up an alcoholic on the streets of Barcelona, lets just say that I have a rather minor "get out of jail free" card.

The decision to go somewhere else was made over a year ago, the decision for that place to (initially at least) be spain was made last month. I am travelling with a friend, so there's two of us. He's at least as set on this as I am - he tends to be more of a nonchallant idealist and I am more of a visionary realist.

My Income: Before I leave the country I will almost certainly have set-up a web design business with another friend. This venture could bring in the entire living income that I'll need - it'll be a UK VAT registered busiess and all my work will be done via a laptop. Or it could only provide part of my income.

If it only provides part of my income then I will need a job in spain. Things I am considering right now: Teaching English, or Bar-work (part time, I won't entertain service industry work for any longer than 25 hours a week).

Our skill in Spanish? Right now - zero. We need to start learning soon.

Why Spain? Out of our options it seems the easiest place to potentially get settled in as well as meeting all our other criteria.

What happens if Spain doesn't work out? We move to Cyprus where we'd have a free place to stay for two months and could hopefully get established in that time.

It's also note worthy that I am taking my car - we're going to drive to Spain.

What are we looking for?

I'm going to be completely honest here. This is an adventure, a party lifestyle, and a complete rejection of my horrid (but well paid) 9-5 office job and the ever more gloomy outlook of things in blighty.

We're both party animals. As such we're going to be within transit distance of a big party centre or resort - but probably not live in one.

This is not an attempt to expand my career, or make a new life, or anything like that.

I've recently turned 27, and as far as I'm concerned I'm just warming up. Now is the perfect time for me to escape from the 40 hours work a week lifetime jail sentence.

I've worked abroad before (Canada) and I've travelled a lot, so I have a fair bit of experience in doing this.

Up until now most of our work has been planning and decision making - but pretty soon we're going to have to do some actual work. I'm going to make a checklist now in rough order of priority

If anyone has additions or ammendments please let me know.

Checklist

TEFL/CELTA Course
- work out plausibility of taking one and relative financial worth
- find an appropriate one
- enroll

Learning Basic Spanish
- Start working through a good book
- Talk to Spanish friends about some help
- Consider a basic course

Exact Location and Accomadation
- Determine a couple of exact locations where we could live.
- Investigate cost of living and accomdation availability.
- Decide on exact destination

Other Documents
- Investigate other documents which may be needed. Health forms, residential permits, etc.
- Get them.

The Car
- Learn all the things I need to do with the car to be legally driving in spain
- Do them
- Book the car in for a full service.

Cultural Integration
- Investigate and read about Spannish culture.
- Pre-make friends with people living in area using internet.

Bank & Phone
- Set-up a Spanish bank account, before I leave if possible.
- Work out best option with mobile phone (I still have 18 months on my UK contract.)

UK Stuff
- Sell UK stuff

 

[jojo]

You seem to have thought and planned it thoroughly - well done its the only way! HOWEVER, two points I'd add

1. Be prepared at all times to change or rethink any of your plans! My husband was like you and was very methodical and researched everything - then the credit crunch happened and other things, which meant everything had to change and is still changing. But evenso, things you think you'll do you wont and things you dont think you'll do, you will LOL, so be flexible and prepared

2. If you live in Spain for more than 183 days a year, then you will have to pay your taxes here. So you may need to be in touch with a Gestor who will talk you thru all your options.

Keep us posted tho, a "progress report" and the like


Jo xxx

 

[nigele2]

RagsToRich you're totally mad. Parties, learn a bit of Spanish in 6 months, earn enough from a web design business, maintain a brit car, live a bit outside but near to the hot spots, teach English ... yup raving mad.

But with that type of 'I'll have a crack at it' atitude I bet you end up 33 years old, rich in memories, experiences and friends, but stony broke. Then go back home and make a fortune. But rich or broke you'll never be boring. Enjoy the adventure

 

[VFR]

Sell the car before you leave as it ain't worth 2 bob here secondhand and will be illegal at some stage in the future.
To drive the car here is not cheap regardless of the route you take, so fly down & save this amount.
You will have to pay for health care, so be mindful of this.

Good luck on the move here !

 

[RagsToRich]

Sell the car before you leave as it ain't worth 2 bob here secondhand and will be illegal at some stage in the future.
To drive the car here is not cheap regardless of the route you take, so fly down & save this amount.
You will have to pay for health care, so be mindful of this.

Good luck on the move here !

You sure about that mate?

The thing is - this car will last. Why will it eventually become illegal in spain?

This car will last another good 3-4 years. But anyone I sell this too will never know that, so they won't understand its value.

If on the other hand I sell it, and buy a new one - I am playing pot-luck in a country where I'll be barely competent with the language. The last thing I want is to be in a Spanish garage trying to work out why it's costing me £500 to fix the dodgy Spanish car I bought for £300.

 

[RagsToRich]

RagsToRich you're totally mad. Parties, learn a bit of Spanish in 6 months, earn enough from a web design business, maintain a brit car, live a bit outside but near to the hot spots, teach English ... yup raving mad.

But with that type of 'I'll have a crack at it' atitude I bet you end up 33 years old, rich in memories, experiences and friends, but stony broke. Then go back home and make a fortune. But rich or broke you'll never be boring. Enjoy the adventure

I totally agree with you.

Apart from the broke part.

I'll always be Rich

- Rich

 

[jojo]

You sure about that mate?

The thing is - this car will last. Why will it eventually become illegal in spain?

This car will last another good 3-4 years. But anyone I sell this too will never know that, so they won't understand its value.

If on the other hand I sell it, and buy a new one - I am playing pot-luck in a country where I'll be barely competent with the language. The last thing I want is to be in a Spanish garage trying to work out why it's costing me £500 to fix the dodgy Spanish car I bought for £300.

If you bring your car to spain you will have to get it matriculated, which is costly, usually around 10% of its value I believe. If you dont it will be illegal after 30 days once you are a resident.

You'll also find there are plenty of British garages in Spain who'll charge you infinately more than the Spanish ones and probably not do such a good job either - well so far thats my experience. That said, second had spanish cars are more expensive than the same in the UK - altho I suspect thats about to change. Buyting a car in Spain can be complicated and you generally need the assistance of a Gestor or lawyer to get the paperwork right - that said its by far and away the safest and the legal option. As in another thread, they guardia are cracking down hard on RHD vehicles here at the mo and they dont mess about if they find you're driving a car that isnt "legal"

Jo xxxx

 

[jojo]

....The other piece of advise I would give is that you come over and have a good look around before you finally make the move - You need to see what its like here and how you would achieve your goals

Jo xxx

 

[lofthouse]

i am driving over and staying for 5 months, i thought this was ok, are the Spanish police targeting RHD cars, even the legal ones ? surely there is some 'give or take' with the Spanish old bill, we are not all their enemies !

 

[jojo]

i am driving over and staying for 5 months, i thought this was ok, are the Spanish police targeting RHD cars, even the legal ones ? surely there is some 'give or take' with the Spanish old bill, we are not all their enemies !

As a tourist you should be alright, you can drive a RHD car for up to 9 months. The apparently Spanish Guardia have recently started purge on RHD cars. There are squillions of them, most arent legal as such, in other words they dont have UK road tax, MoTs etc, nor have they been matriculated. Its not about us being enemies, I think "in general" alot of Brits have simply been taking the p*** for too long and the bottom line is the Spanish are wanting those people to pay their dues to Spain! I've been really surprised at, not only the number of Brits who are still driving around in UK cars, but how many of them will turn round and say - "why should I change it, I've been driving it around here for years and never been caught"

So IMO, if it is true that they're targeting RHD cars and it seems to be the case, then good! If the car is legal and above board then theres nowt to hide!

Heres a post from earlier - it gets a bit confused, but the general gist is there

http://www.expatforum.com/expats/spain-expat-forum-expats-living-spain/39452-british-cars-spain.html



Jo xxx

 

[Tallulah]

You sure about that mate?

The thing is - this car will last. Why will it eventually become illegal in spain?

This car will last another good 3-4 years. But anyone I sell this too will never know that, so they won't understand its value.

If on the other hand I sell it, and buy a new one - I am playing pot-luck in a country where I'll be barely competent with the language. The last thing I want is to be in a Spanish garage trying to work out why it's costing me £500 to fix the dodgy Spanish car I bought for £300.

If you do bring your car over and your intention is to become resident in Spain, then one of the first things you should do either via an Asesoria or directly, is get yourself a gestor who is experienced with the rematriculation of EU vehicles in Spain. The process, even if you speak the language fluently, is not to be recommended simply because the words that come out from a gestor's mouth sound different for some reason to, for example, the local ITV technician and admin staff, than the same words sound coming from your mouth.

Personally, my OH thinks it's a case of treading on the toes of the local professionals when you try to do it yourself and so that which should take a couple of weeks can take months and untold stress and headaches.

We finally went the gestor route with one of our cars (UK plated at the time of moving here) and matriculated it and paid somewhere in the region of 500 euros as my OH is a retornado (Spaniard returning to Spain) there was a tax of about 900 euros he did not have to pay. I think this is referred to as "impuesto de matriculacion" but don't quote me on that.

A friend of ours has a son who is coming over to live here shortly and is bringing his UK vehicle with him. He has done most of the running around for his son in preparation for his arrival - including signing up a gestoria and he has quotes of just a little short of 1500 euros all inclusive. As a UK citizen coming to live in Spain, he does not get any sort of grants or discounts in the process, unfortunately.

One big thing we have noticed over here - coincidentally perhaps, but in case it is the norm - both my OH and said friend's son above have found that headlights to convert a car to right hand traffic beam are almost to the pound twice as much to buy here than to import from the UK or indeed have them fitted before you come out. This is just the difference in price at the dealers. Being a bit of a DIYer, especially with cars, my OH fitted ours and I'm not sure if above friend's son will pay to have them fitted. But either way, it's no great shakes - so the main cost differential will be on the cost of the item - worth considering if you do intend to bring your car over here.

As a point of interest, we were stopped literally last week in the RHD car by the GC. There was no mention of any LHD or RHD problems and there were cars before and after us being stopped - the agent simply asked for driving licence and car papers. It's worth knowing at such times what is meant by car papers, as this is not always as it would seem logical - eg the bank receipt showing road tax payment is one of the requirements. Any doubts on this can be resolved by a visit to this site - a handy bit of info from an information piece by your friendly local supermarket.

Los papeles del coche: Pocos pero imprescindibles | Revista | CONSUMER EROSKI

Not sure how good your Spanish is, but suffice to say that it states amongst many other things that if you can't demonstrate that you've paid your road tax, the fine can vary from 150€ to 900€. Don't ask me why that should be, 2nd offence perhaps, who knows, but definately worth keeping the receipt of payment with you. Similar for insurance etc.

Personally I think the issue of bringing a car over is a very personal one - in my case for example I feel 100% safer on our RHD car than when I drive our LHD car - I don't tend to do much overtaking anyway as the roads and traffic conditions where we live don't really require it. But there's nothing worse for me when driving down the country lanes here to keep remembering that the gear shift is on the right and not to get too close to the hedge or the passenger might end up eating half of it!!! It isn't just a case of overtaking safely - it's also a case of what you've been used to all your driving life. Mind you, I do say this is my own personal finding - if I have to then I have no real problems with the LHD car, but as I said, I feel much more at home and in second nature mode in the RHD. And of course, the RHD is a 7-seater MPV which helped us enormously on the move over here, plus now carting around three kids, mother-in-law, two dogs, shopping etc!!!


Perhaps Jo could enlighten me on this as maybe it is happening down south, but when you say, Jo, that the GC are pulling over RHD cars, I assume it is those vehicles that are showing non-Spanish plates? Otherwise it would be profiling!!!




Tallulah.x

 

[Pesky Wesky]

Sell the car before you leave as it ain't worth 2 bob here secondhand and will be illegal at some stage in the future.
To drive the car here is not cheap regardless of the route you take, so fly down & save this amount.
You will have to pay for health care, so be mindful of this.

Good luck on the move here !

I second that. (Cars, flying, healthcare)
The subject of cars has been done to death on the forum (just search cars or uk cars or smth like that). I've never owned a British car, so obviously have never imported one, (I learnt to drive here - scary!!) but it just sounds so expensive and complicated - however, I do understand what you say about buying a car in a foreign language. Time to make a decision again. Perhaps it depends on where you're going. You don't need a car in Madrid, or Bilbao or probably in Valencia..
Looks like you've got lots of good things on your check list. All you've got to do now is start doing them.
When you're 27 and you're in Spain, I would say partying is definitely part of the scene, but don't forget - it all costs money and if you've got a job you need to keep it.
Enjoy while you can!!

 

[jojo]

Perhaps Jo could enlighten me on this as maybe it is happening down south, but when you say, Jo, that the GC are pulling over RHD cars, I assume it is those vehicles that are showing non-Spanish plates? Otherwise it would be profiling!!!




Tallulah.x

Its more rumour and word of rumour really. There has been a significant rise in the number of guardia doing "spot" checks around here in the last few weeks for sure. It just seems that everyone I know, knows someone who has been stopped in a RHD car and so the rumours start, but I wouldnt be surprised if they were doing it, there are so many. When I was stopped in a RHD car the other day (a friends car), there were also LHD cars being stopped - so its not an obvious target

Jo xxx

 

[Stravinsky]

As a tourist you should be alright, you can drive a RHD car for up to 9 months. The apparently Spanish Guardia have recently started purge on RHD cars.

Six months aint it? .
Keep your ferry tickets to prove when you came over, make sure your road tax and MOT are in order for the full time you are here.

 

[jojo]

Six months aint it? .
Keep your ferry tickets to prove when you came over, make sure your road tax and MOT are in order for the full time you are here.

6 months then LOL I couldnt remember, I know its longer for a tourist than a resident

Jo xxx

 

[RagsToRich]

Tallulah.x

This is a fantastic post - thank you very much.

Unfortunately it's pretty much all information I don't want to hear and has put serious doubts on my idea to take the car.

And that would change a few other things too... Hmmm.

 

[SteveHall]

Load the car, take it and scrap it once you are settled? Sell it to somebody going back for a few hundred .... there is ALWAYS somebody going back!

 

[RagsToRich]

Load the car, take it and scrap it once you are settled? Sell it to somebody going back for a few hundred .... there is ALWAYS somebody going back!

Great advice Steve... afterall, why should I think I'll get any less for it in Spain than the UK right? :clap2:

I've had another thought... what is the plausibility of me not declaring residency, working for 3-4 months, and then making the call on my car.

I'd be fine to drive it with only UK tax, and plus, as far as I'm aware, I should be legal to work in Spain as a "working holidayer"

This guise will work because I'll be renting and I'll have the possessions of a backpacker - not of a relocator.

If I were to do that, could it present me with difficulties when I DO later declare residency?

 

[SteveHall]

Spain is a land of greys. There is rarely black and white. So many people are ¨lost¨in the system (or rather "from" the system) that all of us who have spent much time here KNOW that what you get told by one policeman today might very well be contradicted by another the next day. What one funcionario insists is a fact will be ignored by another. Spanish bureucracy is LEGEND!

I remember back in 2003/2004 when Spain brought in some high profile changes to road traffic offences. In particular all the expat forums were FULL of page after page of xxxx about how many warning triangles, you had to have and how many fluorescent jackets you had to have. This question was brought up at a Neighbourhood Watch meeting I was translating it. Two Policia Local officers were almost at blows with their interpretation of the new laws. I thought I was going to have to separate them! I was reminded of this a few weeks ago when I broke down in the centre of Granada twice within an hour. On NEITHER occasion was I asked for ANY paperwork and when I broke down on a very fast roundabout I forgot completely about putting a triangle out or a jacket on. The police did not ask or comment.

BUT

...on another day when I was pulled up at 4am with three absolutely paralytic teenagers who I had vacuumed out of a disco, the police went through absolutely every piece of paperwork with a toothcomb. They bagged me twice and when they got a zero reading, bad cop snarled, "Must be a mistake with the machine, do it again." When I said I had not had a drop of alcohol in 6/7 years he retorted "let´s see whether the machine makes you a liar.¨

At that moment, Viktoria saved the day by saying that if they did not let us go she was going to wet herself and Daniella then nearly got us all locked up by loudly offering to "look after" the young officer (good cop) who was more interested in her ample clevage than calibrating the unit. I have the distinct impression that he had heard the Norwegian for that particular sexual act at some stage ..... or was she miming it!!! He bade us farewell very promptly and even thanked me for scraping them off the streets of Benidorm.

Do NOT expect the black and white answers you would get in the UK.

 

[jojo]

Great advice Steve... afterall, why should I think I'll get any less for it in Spain than the UK right? :clap2:

I've had another thought... what is the plausibility of me not declaring residency, working for 3-4 months, and then making the call on my car.

I'd be fine to drive it with only UK tax, and plus, as far as I'm aware, I should be legal to work in Spain as a "working holidayer"

This guise will work because I'll be renting and I'll have the possessions of a backpacker - not of a relocator.

If I were to do that, could it present me with difficulties when I DO later declare residency?

Try it! I think you'll need to get an NIE number to rent long term and a spanish bank account, short term holiday rentals are usually more expensive. There are lots of expats who come over and dont register anything - but they're looking over their shoulder ands scratching around for a living. Spain used to be a cheap and easy destination. Sadly, its not much cheaper than the UK and the rules and regulations are tightening up`

Jo xxx