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Bev, Kyle has all the hallmarks of an indigent looser: high school drop out, unemployed and lives with his mom. Civil suits are generally about monetary compensation, but this kid doesn't have a pot to p*** in. Of course Fox News could always hire him as a correspondent :eek:
Fox News will come later. At this point, two Senators, one from Florida and one from Arizona would like to hire him as a Senate intern.
 

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Still what this defendant did and the legalities in the US are incomprehensible here, and likely more so to Brits and anyone from a country that has real gun laws.
I think BiF has hit it on the head here - the legal systems are very different in the US vs. France, the UK or many other countries. And the laws are different, as well as being differently perceived and understood within the relevant legal systems.

But just to put a little perspective on my lawyer friend's comment about not wishing to be judged by a jury... His concern is that juries can be influenced, due to the emotional impact of how trials are conducted in the US and how little lay people actually know about the law in their state. As I recall, he specifically said that if he was charged with something and was innocent, his preference would be to have a judge decide the case based strictly on the letter of the law. Jury members, not really knowing the law, nor how the law works (or is supposed to work) are too easily swayed based on emotional appeals or elaborate explanations by "experts" about factors that aren't part of the wording of the relevant laws but which appeal to public sentiment. (I do seem to recall him saying that if he were taken to court for something he had done, but wanted to avoid conviction, he'd probably go for a jury trial.)
 

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Fox News will come later. At this point, two Senators, one from Florida and one from Arizona would like to hire him as a Senate intern.
Yeah, which should prove interesting during the next Insurrection at the Capitol. Wonder if Kyle will wear his gun while he's working as an intern. Ah, may we live in "interesting" times...
 

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Actually it doesn't matter what actions he took before two convicted felons threatened his life with a gun because charges for his previous actions were not brought. It was either them or him. In other words -- Self Defense. Unless a person has a personal death wish, why would anyone in a similar situation take any other action? Did you expect him to beg the two armed, convicted felons not to kill him? Or would a rational person use his God given intelligence and not take that kind of risk and save himself instead? And it seems the jury agreed.
 

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Actually it doesn't matter what actions he took before two convicted felons threatened his life with a gun because charges for his previous actions were not brought. It was either them or him. In other words -- Self Defense. Unless a person has a personal death wish, why would anyone in a similar situation take any other action? Did you expect him to beg the two armed, convicted felons not to kill him? Or would a rational person use his God given intelligence and not take that kind of risk and save himself instead? And it seems the jury agreed.
I would have said he either had a personal death wish, or a wish for the death of rioters or demonstrators when he went out armed in that way. Of course I am not American and have never visited the country or had any desire to do so, but that is my view.
 

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Though one wonders how or whether he could have known that those guys were "convicted felons" at the time. However, the testimony of Travis McMichael (in the Ahmaud Arbery killing) was interesting when the prosecutor broke things down to basics. The three guys accused of killing Arbery were following Arbery, who never turned to confront them and never "threatened" them - hell, never spoke to the three men trailing him in their vehicles. It was only after Travis reached for his gun that Arbery put his hand on the gun (which sounds a bit like classic "self-defense" to me, but the murder victim doesn't get to invoke that after the fact).

With Kyle, it's disturbing that he was holding himself out as a "medic" come to help when he was only 17 and apparently had no training for that. Also carrying a gun he wasn't really legal to own and run around with on which he also had never been trained in its proper use. Automobiles are far more stringently controlled in the US than lethal firearms and that, I suspect, is the crux of the problem here.
 

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I would have said he either had a personal death wish, or a wish for the death of rioters or demonstrators when he went out armed in that way. Of course I am not American and have never visited the country or had any desire to do so, but that is my view.
Around the same time, two home-owners, husband and wife, appeared in their front yard both armed, when a mob of Black Lives Matter rioters entered their gated community and approached their home. This husband and wife were armed to protect their property, which they have every right to do, or even to protect their neighbor's property if deemed necessary, and there would be no proof whatsoever that they were armed because they were expecting to kill rioters. The father of Kyle Rittenhouse lived in Kenosha, WI. Kyle, like many other Americans had also watched helplessly as Black Lives Matters burned some of their cities down to the ground. So Kyle went to his father's town to stand at armed guard in hopes of also protecting that city from being burned to the ground. In the United States, private citizens ARE permitted to try to protect public property if deemed necessary and even to conduct citizen arrest if necessary. In so doing Kyle's life was threatened by armed felons and they lost their lives. That's it. Self defense.
 

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The self defense principle is a general and well understood doctrine in all systems and cultures.

The 'right to bear arms' laws of the 50 states are another matter altogether. I believe it is lawful to own and open carry a damn bazooka in some states.

My mother told me a story about black servicemen returning to Louisiana post WW2 with their army issued rifles. The random attacks by white thugs taking pot shots from their vehicles ceased after that. Perhaps its apochryphal.
 

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Interesting discussion on US TV today (CNN) where various experts mentioned that the verdict of the Kyle Rittenhouse case was actually never in doubt. Despite some reports at the time, the video of what happened does show that the kid was being chased when he fired the first shot - and so the self defense plea/defense is probably legitimate.

But what is happening now is that Fox News has been filming for a "documentary" they are preparing on the case and the kid - turning him into a hero, and a role model for others. That's the really dangerous stuff here.

Then, just exchange Kyle Rittenshouse and Ahmaud Arbery in their respective situations. Arbery (a young Black man) would never have survived to trial if he had been the one carrying a gun "for protection" in Kenosha. Whereas our "hero" Kyle would never have been bothered while jogging in Georgia, even if a local resident had called him in to the police for "resembling someone who may have broken into a house here recently."
 

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Did you expect him to beg the two armed, convicted felons not to kill him? Or would a rational person use his God given intelligence and not take that kind of risk and save himself instead?
A rational person would have stayed at home in Indiana and either watched the tumult on TV or stayed in his mom's basement playing games on his X-Box.
 

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A rational person would have stayed at home in Indiana and either watched the tumult on TV or stayed in his mom's basement playing games on his X-Box.
Yeah, but we're not talking about a "rational person" here - we're talking about a 17 year old boy. All sorts of studies and reports on how immature their brains are at that age. I think the real issue here are the strange turn the laws on guns, and gun ownership have taken over there - Stand Your Ground laws, Open Carry laws and no background checks, nor any need to have any sort of training in guns laws and/or the safe use of lethal weapons. I keep wondering if old Kyle even has a driver's license at this point - for which the testing, licensing and insurance requirements are so much stricter than for that "cool" weapon he was carrying when he ran into trouble.
 

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Interesting discussion on US TV today (CNN) where various experts mentioned that the verdict of the Kyle Rittenhouse case was actually never in doubt. Despite some reports at the time, the video of what happened does show that the kid was being chased when he fired the first shot - and so the self defense plea/defense is probably legitimate.

But what is happening now is that Fox News has been filming for a "documentary" they are preparing on the case and the kid - turning him into a hero, and a role model for others. That's the really dangerous stuff here.

Then, just exchange Kyle Rittenshouse and Ahmaud Arbery in their respective situations. Arbery (a young Black man) would never have survived to trial if he had been the one carrying a gun "for protection" in Kenosha. Whereas our "hero" Kyle would never have been bothered while jogging in Georgia, even if a local resident had called him in to the police for "resembling someone who may have broken into a house here recently."
And if Kyle Rittenhouse were Black, he would have been convicted tout de suite.
 

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Around the same time, two home-owners, husband and wife, appeared in their front yard both armed, when a mob of Black Lives Matter rioters entered their gated community and approached their home. This husband and wife were armed to protect their property, which they have every right to do, or even to protect their neighbor's property if deemed necessary, and there would be no proof whatsoever that they were armed because they were expecting to kill rioters. The father of Kyle Rittenhouse lived in Kenosha, WI. Kyle, like many other Americans had also watched helplessly as Black Lives Matters burned some of their cities down to the ground. So Kyle went to his father's town to stand at armed guard in hopes of also protecting that city from being burned to the ground. In the United States, private citizens ARE permitted to try to protect public property if deemed necessary and even to conduct citizen arrest if necessary. In so doing Kyle's life was threatened by armed felons and they lost their lives.
The BLM protesters were simply walking through, they were not rioting. Please list the cities that were burnt to the ground or did you just hear that on FOX news or read it on the label of your bottle of Ivermectin?
A 17 yr old should not be in possession of that weapon - it is illegal. His mother should have kept him at home. Maybe you want to live in a world where 17 yr old high school drop outs act as vigilantes in the street but I'd prefer people who are both qualified & capable to enforce the law.
As sangfroid stated, if Rittenhouse was black, he would have been convicted of murder. The weapons charge would not have been dropped. The old double standard once again and you wonder why people take to the streets? If there was even a modicum of justice for people of color in the US, this would never have happened.
 
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