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Definitely a good thing. I'd be a criminal to reproduce and pass on my genetic disorders to anyone. Plus, family life is not combinable with the lifestyle I wish to lead. I enjoy debating and ranting, and if there's anything annoying about kids is that you can't have a serious chat with them ...
i can't comment on the first part of your post - i have no idea what personal demons you have to fight. but i have to disagree with what you think it's annoying about kids: you can have the most serious chat with them, and they are far more perceptive than adults.

again, i may be wrong... is there regret i sense in your words? you wrote about music with passion, but you suddenly toned down when you wrote about kids..
 

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Definitely a good thing. I'd be a criminal to reproduce and pass on my genetic disorders to anyone. Plus, family life is not combinable with the lifestyle I wish to lead. I enjoy debating and ranting, and if there's anything annoying about kids is that you can't have a serious chat with them ...
... or some adults. (In reality that is. This forum doesn't count. :D)

I like what you said. Far more eloquent than my short offerings.
 

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Our job is to look after our children if we wish to have them. You are the one forcing your outlook on others now!
Er....... forcing???? Sorry, I'll put my gun away Gerrit!!! ...... and there was me thinking I was simply expressing my own, insignificant little opinion lol!!!! Just like EVERY OTHER CREATURE on the planet we are meant to reproduce!? Each time we're supposed to reproduce stronger, better, slightly adapted versions of the species so it doesnt die out! IMO! How the heck you can expect everyone to think like you do and claim your version of "the perfect world" is beyond me, you see we're all so different!


Back to the song "Imagine" According to my OH John Lennon wrote the words "...and NO religion too" , but America didnt like that and felt it was blasphemous, so in some versions of the song the words were change to ".... and ONE religion too"???? Well both of those versions speak volumes to my mind - Only in my very humble opinion, no gun in my hand lol!!!!!

Jo xxxx
 

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Lennon would have been nothing without McCartney and vice-versa.

The Beatles were (and are) probably the most over-rated band ever.

With the possible exception of Sigue, Sigue Sputnik.
 

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Back to the song "Imagine" According to my OH John Lennon wrote the words "...and NO religion too" , but America didnt like that and felt it was blasphemous, so in some versions of the song the words were change to ".... and ONE religion too"???? Well both of those versions speak volumes to my mind - Only in my very humble opinion, no gun in my hand lol!!!!!

Jo xxxx
Imagine no religion, no countries, no possessions - all the things people fight over.

But he didn't say "imagine there's no money". He had far too much of it himself to get away with that!

The Woodie Gutrhie song that all American schoolchildren sing, "This land is your land, this land is my land" also suffered from censorship. These two verses were chopped:

"There was a big high wall there that tried to stop me;
Sign was painted, it said private property;
But on the back side it didn't say nothing;
That side was made for you and me.

In the shadow of the steeple I saw my people,
By the relief office I seen my people;
As they stood there hungry, I stood there asking
Is this land made for you and me? "

Governments are all too aware of the power of music!
 

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Imagine no religion, no countries, no possessions - all the things people fight over.

But he didn't say "imagine there's no money". He had far too much of it himself to get away with that!

The Woodie Gutrhie song that all American schoolchildren sing, "This land is your land, this land is my land" also suffered from censorship. These two verses were chopped:

"There was a big high wall there that tried to stop me;
Sign was painted, it said private property;
But on the back side it didn't say nothing;
That side was made for you and me.

In the shadow of the steeple I saw my people,
By the relief office I seen my people;
As they stood there hungry, I stood there asking
Is this land made for you and me? "

Governments are all too aware of the power of music!
Quite! But America was apparently offended by the "NO religion" reference and had it changed to "ONE religion"?! I've been trying to find some lyrics with the latter on, but cant!?????

Jo xxx
 

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Quite! But America was apparently offended by the "NO religion" reference and had it changed to "ONE religion"?! I've been trying to find some lyrics with the latter on, but cant!?????

Jo xxx
I googled this and apparently some Christian fundamentalist radio stations in the US used to fudge that line while it was playing so you couldn't hear the words. Lots more banned it altogether.

How many people here are offended by the lyrics of John Lennon's "Imagine"? - Yahoo!7 Answers
 

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No, but it does prove once again that people in power are afraid of the influence that music can have!

Mind control, censorship, propaganda, insults...... Whatever you call it and whichever way you look at it, none of that is a particularly pleasant side to human nature!

Jo xxx
 

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Mind control, censorship, propaganda, insults...... Whatever you call it and whichever way you look at it, none of that is a particularly pleasant side to human nature!

Jo xxx
Quite true.

But one of the nicest things humans can do is sing or play music together. We were doing that last night with an Israeli couple who are staying in our village; we got the instruments out and played some songs and tunes, ranging from blues to flamenco! Wherever you travel, if you can find people to make music with, you will be fine.
 

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i can't comment on the first part of your post - i have no idea what personal demons you have to fight. but i have to disagree with what you think it's annoying about kids: you can have the most serious chat with them, and they are far more perceptive than adults.

again, i may be wrong... is there regret i sense in your words? you wrote about music with passion, but you suddenly toned down when you wrote about kids..
No regret, just different interests. Music is my biggest passion along with travel, I can talk for hours about it. Kids leave me indifferent, hence the difference in tone.

The demons I have to fight are OCD, anxiety disorder and depression (I refuse to call autism a demon even though I indeed am autistic). If I would reproduce, chances of the kids having it as well is 50% or higher (depending if the girl would also have it - even if not, still 50%). I think it wouldn't be nice to reproduce when you know your child risks a life full of struggles. I rather try to make most of my own life instead. :)




Jo: music isn't mind control or propaganda. It offers a theme for thought, an opinion. You then think about it, and either agree or disagree with the lyrics. Music isn't propaganda, it does put some issues in the limelight and thereby makes people think and sometimes that leads to people taking actions. Literature and film can have the same domino effect by the way.

I would call it putting certain issues out of the taboo atmosphere and into public attention, but certainly not propaganda or mind controlling.

A while ago some Croat christian fundamentalists tried to ban a Marilyn Manson concert because they couldn't take the fact that his songs made people think in a critical way about religion. Marilyn's answer was brilliant in all its simplicity: "If a simple rock singer can make people doubt about their faith, then their faith must be based on very loose fundaments"
 

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PS I agree with Andy Capp. The Beatles, without saying they're bad or without saying they weren't renewing, are extremely overrated. They were renewing back then, for sure. But to say that this means they are forever the undisputed nr 1 band is like saying the wheel was the greatest invention ever at that time and thus everything invented later doesn't count. They had some decent albums but especially their early releases were quite bad IMO. Velvet Underground, The Doors, The Moody Blues, The Rolling Stones, early Pink Floyd with Syd... That's quality sixties music.

Well, just my opinion obviously. I'm sure my father, if he'd read this, would get angry about this as he is one of those Beatles fans that leaves no chance unused to praise them.
 

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PS I agree with Andy Capp. The Beatles, without saying they're bad or without saying they weren't renewing, are extremely overrated. They were renewing back then, for sure. But to say that this means they are forever the undisputed nr 1 band is like saying the wheel was the greatest invention ever at that time and thus everything invented later doesn't count. They had some decent albums but especially their early releases were quite bad IMO. Velvet Underground, The Doors, The Moody Blues, The Rolling Stones, early Pink Floyd with Syd... That's quality sixties music.

Well, just my opinion obviously. I'm sure my father, if he'd read this, would get angry about this as he is one of those Beatles fans that leaves no chance unused to praise them.
Without the Beatles, there would be no Oasis, Radiohead, Supergrass ...
The Beatles in turn were influenced by Buddy Holly, Chuck Berry, Chet Atkins ...

The beat goes on.
 

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Obviously. My favourite ever band, Echo & The Bunnymen, never denied their work being influenced by David Bowie and The Beatles and the Velvet Underground (that said, I think they improved that style and then developed it into their own, but that's just my biased opinion as a fan)

However, some sorts of music just came without specific precedent. We're probably going into the more extreme sorts then but for example early Swans was unlike anything else before. The Virgin Prunes was a good example of a band who moved the boundaries of music too. And so there's many examples. Everyone is influenced by someone or something, the great artists are those who use that influence to create their own distinctive style.

By the way, Oasis was never that great IMO. The Verve were by far superior when it came to the whole Britpop hype in the nineties (although IMO the tag did not suit a band like The Verve). Songs such as "Bittersweet symphony", "Sonnet", "Slide Away" and "The Drugs Don't Work" ... pure genius. When I think of Oasis I think about "Don't look back in anger" and there it stops. Their work being influenced by the Beatles was just too obvious. The nineties did have a wide range of superb alternative bands. The God Machine, Rage Against The Machine, Soundgarden, Smashing Pumpkins, ...
 
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