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Guy Behind the 8 Ball, Advice Please

7880 Views 63 Replies 7 Participants Last post by  TumblingDice, 
T
Hi all,
OK, heart on my sleeve here: this is my first post on the forum, though I've considered moving to Australia for years now. Problem is that I have been caught up in some of this economic stuff over the past few years- job offshored several times, more unemployment than employment, totally trashed credit, hopelessly high debt from student loans for degree that never landed a job...

I figure that if I even try to go through the 'normal route' to a visa that my application will be laughed off of the table. But then there's another side that tells me that if a person was really successful at home it would actually give them less of a chance of succeeding in a foreign land. Whereas I feel the more different the land from my own, the better the chance that I'll succeed. And therefore they should actually let me in simply because I am such a miserable failure :)

More info if this helps: I've worked ten years in IT, but never got a degree or programming skills. I worked in QA, back when that was a real and respected field in its own right. Now QA is the same as programming and my skill set no longer wanted in this country. Debt from my first (wasted) degree in business has kept me from affording going back to school again, getting certified, and being able to compete with all the foreigners, who of course do all have degrees and programming skills. I hear that education is affordable in Australia, and this is my real dream- to obtain a degree in my field, and get my job back in QA as I've always loved the work- and frankly it's all that I know. It would be a sweet bonus to have health care for once, and to 'start' saving for retirement as my American Social Security statements basically say that I'll have nothing (inflation adjusted) if I do retire in this country despite all the years that I actually did have work. Also I'm a white male so I basically qualify for no assistance of any kind, education or otherwise. Hopefully Australia is a little kinder to the white man. Anyway, its not like I have anything left to lose here.

First question: do you think they will actually see this logic or just brush me off as a hopeless loser? As far as my US record- they'd be right.

Second question: what would be the easiest way for someone like me to get in and just prove myself on the ground abroad? All I'm really looking for is a fresh start in a very different environment. So which visa would be the 'easiest' to obtain? Maybe something short term?

Third question: this may sound a little risky, but I'm actually considering just moving over on some kind of tourist visa, making some contacts when I arrive and hopefully getting a company to sponsor me. Would this help? I mean if I actually had a job first before getting the visa?

Finally: I've basically lost everything that I had here at home, car, house, furniture, you name it- it's gone, and I have no family left here, so I have no ties, and really do have nothing to lose in trying something radically new and moving abroad. How 'out of the box' am I going to have to get (due to my circumstances and record) to make this happen?

Lots of info, so thanks for taking the time reading, and thanks in advance for any advice for the guy behind the 8 ball :)

Jeff
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amaslam
Hi Jeff:

Welcome to the forum.

I won't comment too much on the 'loser' stuff, but for the most part Immi doesn't care one way or the other as you're not evaluated on that.

Basically Immi evaluates on this:
1. Skills you have
2. Clean criminal background (so no convictions, arrests)
3. Are healthy

***
First I would start by reading the Sticky links at the top of the forum. They will give you alot of info you need to consider before making such a move.

Next visit the Immi website and go through their visa wizard.

***
Now how can you come here:
1. Skills: You'd first get evaluated based on work experience by the ACS and the RPL route (go to ACS (Australian Computer Society) - Membership, Professionalism and Leadership for ICT Professionals and the ICT Community to find out more about these terms).
If successful then you'd apply for one of the skilled visa categories. Processing time anywhere from 6 months - 18 months depending on whether the skill is in demand (two lists you want to view at the Immi website: MODL and CSL).

2. Student, you could enter as a student to an AU University and pursue or complete a degree. Once you did that you could then apply for one the temp visa --> permanent visa categories that are available to students

***
Q1:
They won't really consider 'loser' or 'help me'. It's just the facts with them, skills, health, background check.

Q2:
Skills option or Education option. See above

Q3:
Not worth it, most AU employers do not consider you unless you have a valid visa to work. It would just waste your time and money to try it that way. AU Immi is quite strict as well about working on visitor so if they even suspect you're here to do that they just won't let you into the country.

You won't really have to get 'out of box' but certainly will need to improve your skills and self esteem a bit to have a good chance of success here. Also you have to build up some decent amount of savings before coming here. AU is not inexpensive to live in and especially not the first few months.

***
Have you considered Canada or New Zealand? They may be easier to get into and also have those social benefits you're looking at.


TumblingDice said:
Hi all,
OK, heart on my sleeve here: this is my first post on the forum, though I've considered moving to Australia for years now. Problem is that I have been caught up in some of this economic stuff over the past few years- job offshored several times, more unemployment than employment, totally trashed credit, hopelessly high debt from student loans for degree that never landed a job...

I figure that if I even try to go through the 'normal route' to a visa that my application will be laughed off of the table. But then there's another side that tells me that if a person was really successful at home it would actually give them less of a chance of succeeding in a foreign land. Whereas I feel the more different the land from my own, the better the chance that I'll succeed. And therefore they should actually let me in simply because I am such a miserable failure :)

More info if this helps: I've worked ten years in IT, but never got a degree or programming skills. I worked in QA, back when that was a real and respected field in its own right. Now QA is the same as programming and my skill set no longer wanted in this country. Debt from my first (wasted) degree in business has kept me from affording going back to school again, getting certified, and being able to compete with all the foreigners, who of course do all have degrees and programming skills. I hear that education is affordable in Australia, and this is my real dream- to obtain a degree in my field, and get my job back in QA as I've always loved the work- and frankly it's all that I know. It would be a sweet bonus to have health care for once, and to 'start' saving for retirement as my American Social Security statements basically say that I'll have nothing (inflation adjusted) if I do retire in this country despite all the years that I actually did have work. Also I'm a white male so I basically qualify for no assistance of any kind, education or otherwise. Hopefully Australia is a little kinder to the white man. Anyway, its not like I have anything left to lose here.

First question: do you think they will actually see this logic or just brush me off as a hopeless loser? As far as my US record- they'd be right.

Second question: what would be the easiest way for someone like me to get in and just prove myself on the ground abroad? All I'm really looking for is a fresh start in a very different environment. So which visa would be the 'easiest' to obtain? Maybe something short term?

Third question: this may sound a little risky, but I'm actually considering just moving over on some kind of tourist visa, making some contacts when I arrive and hopefully getting a company to sponsor me. Would this help? I mean if I actually had a job first before getting the visa?

Finally: I've basically lost everything that I had here at home, car, house, furniture, you name it- it's gone, and I have no family left here, so I have no ties, and really do have nothing to lose in trying something radically new and moving abroad. How 'out of the box' am I going to have to get (due to my circumstances and record) to make this happen?

Lots of info, so thanks for taking the time reading, and thanks in advance for any advice for the guy behind the 8 ball :)

Jeff
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Amaslam,
Thanks for the reply. I've now read through most of the links in the 'sticky' section- good stuff. And I suppose it is good news to hear that they won't care about my credit and recent work (read: unemployment) background. A huge relief actually. But really not good news if Q3 will not work. I pretty much saw this as my only hope due to my lack of globally competitive skills. A non-programming QA background wouldn't actually still be considered a skill in Australia would it?

BTW, what about the company sponsored visa? I think it was 457 or something. Couldn't I make some contacts, get a job there, and then get a visa on that? Maybe I don't understand this one correctly?

Having been repeatedly offshored, one job after the next for 4 years now, I seriously doubt that I have the IT skills (without a degree and programming) to compete globally. Being an American these days actually is competing globally and look where that has gotten me. Which brings us to the education option. You mention coming in as a student then applying for PR. This sounds promising. Are there any schools, reasonably priced (for non citizens) that you can recommend? I have no idea how much I would have to save in advance for this option? Would this be my best chance? BTW, while studying, would I be able to take on any part time on-campus jobs or anything to mitigate the costs?

Lastly, Canada is out, but New Zealand sounds appealing. Seems that I read somewhere that NZ residents are allowed to work in Australia. Is this true? Maybe NZ is my 'back door' to Australia? In the end it's Melbourne where I am aiming to land. But I would be delighted to take advantage of a reasonably priced education in NZ if such a thing exists for foreigners?

As far as self esteem goes, you're totally correct. But I am sure that an affordable education (an oxymoron in my state) and having skills to compete in my field again would change all that. I can't imagine that anyone feels lower than the offshored and unemployable in the 'land of opportunity'. Esp when this country would rather wholesale send our jobs abroad than retrain our own people to compete. This country has gone downhill. But that's another story, and hopefully not my problem much longer...

Thanks again for the thoughtful response,

Jeff
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amaslam
You could certainly make contacts, but that's not an easy task and takes time, also note you can not work here on any type of visitor visa (except Working Holiday Visa), most companies in AU will show you door as soon as you ask about something like that. The non-programming QA doesn't count as a skill. IT skill is some sort of specialisation these days (i.e. CISSP, Java, C#, SAP, Siebel) and then doing that professionally for 4 yrs at least.

NZ Citizens can work in AU, but not NZ PRs. You might find you like NZ long enough to stay there 5 yrs and get NZ Citizenship, then you may come into AU at any time after that.

Company sponsored 457 is always an option, but again you must convince some company to pick you over both local AU candidates and other foreign candidates.

I don't know much about the Universities here but look at Google and search their websites. Alot of students in AU and they are concentrated in Brisbane, Sydney, and Melbourne. You can work part-time (upto 20 hrs per week) while a student. Also if you come in as a graduate student (i.e. Masters) I believe there are some student visas that don't have the 20 hour limit.

After reading up a bit on the visa types and then deciding on one course of action why don't you ask a migration agent about options. Usually first consultations are free.

TumblingDice said:
Amaslam,
Thanks for the reply. I've now read through most of the links in the 'sticky' section- good stuff. And I suppose it is good news to hear that they won't care about my credit and recent work (read: unemployment) background. A huge relief actually. But really not good news if Q3 will not work. I pretty much saw this as my only hope due to my lack of globally competitive skills. A non-programming QA background wouldn't actually still be considered a skill in Australia would it?

BTW, what about the company sponsored visa? I think it was 457 or something. Couldn't I make some contacts, get a job there, and then get a visa on that? Maybe I don't understand this one correctly?

Having been repeatedly offshored, one job after the next for 4 years now, I seriously doubt that I have the IT skills (without a degree and programming) to compete globally. Being an American these days actually is competing globally and look where that has gotten me. Which brings us to the education option. You mention coming in as a student then applying for PR. This sounds promising. Are there any schools, reasonably priced (for non citizens) that you can recommend? I have no idea how much I would have to save in advance for this option? Would this be my best chance? BTW, while studying, would I be able to take on any part time on-campus jobs or anything to mitigate the costs?

Lastly, Canada is out, but New Zealand sounds appealing. Seems that I read somewhere that NZ residents are allowed to work in Australia. Is this true? Maybe NZ is my 'back door' to Australia? In the end it's Melbourne where I am aiming to land. But I would be delighted to take advantage of a reasonably priced education in NZ if such a thing exists for foreigners?

As far as self esteem goes, you're totally correct. But I am sure that an affordable education (an oxymoron in my state) and having skills to compete in my field again would change all that. I can't imagine that anyone feels lower than the offshored and unemployable in the 'land of opportunity'. Esp when this country would rather wholesale send our jobs abroad than retrain our own people to compete. This country has gone downhill. But that's another story, and hopefully not my problem much longer...

Thanks again for the thoughtful response,

Jeff
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amaslam said:
Company sponsored 457 is always an option, but again you must convince some company to pick you over both local AU candidates and other foreign candidates.
Click to expand...
Just out of curiosity, if I was lucky enough to land a job this way, would my visa be priority processed under 457, or do companies with hired employees still have to wait the 6 to 18 months for the new hires to begin. Seems that 457 would happen much faster given that the candidate already has a job...

amaslam said:
I don't know much about the Universities here but look at Google and search their websites. Alot of students in AU and they are concentrated in Brisbane, Sydney, and Melbourne. You can work part-time (upto 20 hrs per week) while a student. Also if you come in as a graduate student (i.e. Masters) I believe there are some student visas that don't have the 20 hour limit.
Click to expand...
Nice! This seems like it might be a good route to get in the door, as long as schools don't cost a fortune as obviously I don't have it. At the very least I could finally be qualified for a job back home if when I graduate they give me the boot. Worthy of a separate thread/further research. Hopefully its not like American schools that often charge non citizens 6-10x as much.

amaslam said:
After reading up a bit on the visa types and then deciding on one course of action why don't you ask a migration agent about options. Usually first consultations are free.
Click to expand...
Another great tip. BTW can you refer a good agent? Is this someone in the Australian government with whom I can email?

Oh, BTW I think NZ is out as I am patient, but not 5 years patient.

Lastly, is the 4 years work experience rule waived for recent graduates in a field? Is the student route actually an easier/less stringent path to a visa or does a recent graduate from an Australian school have the same odds as someone applying from abroad. Does having lived and worked in Australia actually give better odds?

Thanks again,

Jeff
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amaslam
Hi Jeff:

1. Yes, 457 is priority processed, some have come through in a matter of weeks, but you have to be really on your game with the documentation to make that happen. 6 weeks is typical. As soon as it is approved and you get the sticker in your passport you may immediately start work.
2. The Unis do charge full fees but the fee levels aren't as high as the US. Also look at the AU TAFE system. This would be like a trade school in case you wanted to get certified in a trade (electrician, chef, plumber).
3. The 4 yr rule is for skilled visas, students don't have that requirement and use a different route to temporary then full PR visas. The main requirement is a degree/certificate in an AU University/College. You do get additional points for graduating from an AU institution. However no additional points are given for being in country.


TumblingDice said:
Just out of curiosity, if I was lucky enough to land a job this way, would my visa be priority processed under 457, or do companies with hired employees still have to wait the 6 to 18 months for the new hires to begin. Seems that 457 would happen much faster given that the candidate already has a job...


Nice! This seems like it might be a good route to get in the door, as long as schools don't cost a fortune as obviously I don't have it. At the very least I could finally be qualified for a job back home if when I graduate they give me the boot. Worthy of a separate thread/further research. Hopefully its not like American schools that often charge non citizens 6-10x as much.


Another great tip. BTW can you refer a good agent? Is this someone in the Australian government with whom I can email?

Oh, BTW I think NZ is out as I am patient, but not 5 years patient.

Lastly, is the 4 years work experience rule waived for recent graduates in a field? Is the student route actually an easier/less stringent path to a visa or does a recent graduate from an Australian school have the same odds as someone applying from abroad. Does having lived and worked in Australia actually give better odds?

Thanks again,

Jeff
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Amaslam,
Please see inline:

amaslam said:
Hi Jeff:
1. Yes, 457 is priority processed, some have come through in a matter of weeks, but you have to be really on your game with the documentation to make that happen. 6 weeks is typical. As soon as it is approved and you get the sticker in your passport you may immediately start work.
Click to expand...
Is there a list of all of the paperwork that will be required? I must have missed it in the stickies. Also, what is the typical route for the 457? As you mentioned, most jobs require a visa before even considering a candidate. So how does anyone get the 457?

amaslam said:
2. The Unis do charge full fees but the fee levels aren't as high as the US. Also look at the AU TAFE system. This would be like a trade school in case you wanted to get certified in a trade (electrician, chef, plumber).
Click to expand...
Wow, yeah I see that most schools are in the $17-20 thousand range for foreigners, definitely too rich for my blood right now. I'll look into the TAFE schools, hopefully this will provide a reasonable alternative.

amaslam said:
3. The 4 yr rule is for skilled visas, students don't have that requirement and use a different route to temporary then full PR visas. The main requirement is a degree/certificate in an AU University/College. You do get additional points for graduating from an AU institution. However no additional points are given for being in country.
Click to expand...
Good stuff. Thanks again for the detailed responses.
BTW, do the TAFE school degrees/certificates qualify for this path?


Jeff
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amaslam
Hi:

There are two things for a 457:
1. Company decides to sponsor you so they file a form. Immi decides on that and returns an OK letter to the company that they can sponsor you.
2. You then apply for a 457 and attach that letter.

Often this 457 is used for intra-company transfers where there is already an office in AU and the company needs you in country quickly.

***
It is most similar to an H1B visa in the US.

***
PR Visas (175/176) are most similar to US Green cards.

***
TAFE certificates/degrees do qualify for the Temp visa --> PR route for students.

At this time the most of the students applying through this route are from China, Southeast Asia, and India.

Start at this link to get to the docs and rules for the 457:
Temporary Business (Long Stay) - Standard Business Sponsorship (Subclass 457)

TumblingDice said:
Amaslam,
Please see inline:


Is there a list of all of the paperwork that will be required? I must have missed it in the stickies. Also, what is the typical route for the 457? As you mentioned, most jobs require a visa before even considering a candidate. So how does anyone get the 457?


Wow, yeah I see that most schools are in the $17-20 thousand range for foreigners, definitely too rich for my blood right now. I'll look into the TAFE schools, hopefully this will provide a reasonable alternative.


Good stuff. Thanks again for the detailed responses.
BTW, do the TAFE school degrees/certificates qualify for this path?


Jeff
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i remember checking out some unis like University of sydney and uni of melbourne, and i think I rem reading that you can have US FAFSA apply towards these schools. It might be worth it to check it out and see if that is the case and which schools will allow it. That will certainly take some of the costs out of your own pocket. Since you're a US citizen and youare wanting to go back to school, check out the US gov FAFSA site and see if they will pay or help for your schooling in foreign countries.
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matjones
tilla_07 said:
i remember checking out some unis like University of sydney and uni of melbourne, and i think I rem reading that you can have US FAFSA apply towards these schools. It might be worth it to check it out and see if that is the case and which schools will allow it. That will certainly take some of the costs out of your own pocket. Since you're a US citizen and youare wanting to go back to school, check out the US gov FAFSA site and see if they will pay or help for your schooling in foreign countries.
Click to expand...
I doubt that FAFSA will give you money if your plan is to stay in Australia. I'm pretty sure they would want you back in the US once they have paid for your education.

Regarding TAFE schools, one of the main ones in Melbourne is William Angliss, however you will find that International student fees for TAFE schools are also fairly high. For a 2 year Diploma course, expect to pay between 20-30K AUD.
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amaslam
Actually they will, take a look at this link (Sallie Mae funds a large number of loans):
Loans for U.S. students studying outside the United States



matjones said:
I doubt that FAFSA will give you money if your plan is to stay in Australia. I'm pretty sure they would want you back in the US once they have paid for your education.

Regarding TAFE schools, one of the main ones in Melbourne is William Angliss, however you will find that International student fees for TAFE schools are also fairly high. For a 2 year Diploma course, expect to pay between 20-30K AUD.
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Apotheosis
Mr. 8 ball allow me to offer my advice.

First of all...if you are trying to make this sort of move, then a negative disposition will get you nowhere fast.

I am 30 years old, in Miami, Florida and have yet to make this move, but it is on its way...been working out these details for almost a year now.

The one thing I have learned is to be as positive as possible...otherwise you will not make it through this process. Your post stinks of negativity, man, seriously. You should have a lot more confidence in your experience and abilities. I should know, I am in a VERY similar circumstance but I am extremely optimistic that I will have success in being accepted into Australia and have employment there. I am a business analyst in IT at a large international corporation and have my share of fears about moving/working down under.

Every situation is different, of course...but you need higher self-confidence to be a successful person...this goes for any industry, actually...abroad or at home in America.

I think there is a tremendous amount of information to learn on this forum...the best, actually! I've been reading (and occasionally posting) for a few months now (I plan to make the big move in Dec 09 or Jan 2010) but I've also come to learn a lot about how internally I am processing the concept of moving to Australia. I firmly believe that the smallest amount of negativity can destroy everything. So my advice is this:

Start contacting any IT recruiting agency that may (or may not!) have work in Australia. Be yourself, it is so important! Communicate what you do well, and make it sound like it's amazing. The underlying sentiment that you need to communicate is that whatever company/organization you are contacting...they NEED you there. The way I look at it is this...what harm can it do??? We live in a world these days where all it takes is a good email. You can send dozens of emails per day if you're motivated enough. Surely someone will respond positively?? It's so easy for us to literally do what we want these days, including moving to the other side of the world. I am trying to do exactly the same, this is why I feel so passionate about the advice that I am giving. Look up some industries that you're interested in and send them a well-crafted email. If you are committed, you will find a way. From your posts it sounds like you already believe that. But no more complaining about yourself! :)

And although no one else on this forum will say it...fark debt, fark student loans, fark other loans...no matter what, GO TO AUSTRALIA. Debt does not mean shiat! Get the holiday visa if all else fails. If you are good enough, someone will give you a job. I've come to find in my life that the unorthodox path is probably the right one. It is up to you and you alone to make your desires come true, no matter what your destination is.

There are definitely some wonderful people on this forum that have very logical advice for making your move, and I do not mean to discount anything that others have mentioned here. However, I hope that I can offer something different. I hope that I can help you realize that what is most important to do something like this is inside of you. No matter what obstacles are in front of you, none of them are a match for human intention. You just have to learn how to communicate that to the Australian organizations that quite possibly need you!

To me, it is very simple. It is up to you, and all the details that make us worry are just that...details. Like I said, my fate is still unknown. I'm still in Miami, trying to make this all happen...but I feel incredibly fortunate to understand the true mechanics of this process. And I am very confident that I will be living a a new and wonderful life with my girlfriend, cat and dog in Sydney in no time.

-Ryan
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amaslam said:
Hi:

There are two things for a 457:
1. Company decides to sponsor you so they file a form. Immi decides on that and returns an OK letter to the company that they can sponsor you.
2. You then apply for a 457 and attach that letter.

Often this 457 is used for intra-company transfers where there is already an office in AU and the company needs you in country quickly.

***
It is most similar to an H1B visa in the US.
Click to expand...
Research so far, not so good on finding affordable schools, so the 457 may just be my only longshot. Unless of course I save for a few years then go... Thanks for the info.

amaslam said:
***
PR Visas (175/176) are most similar to US Green cards.

***
TAFE certificates/degrees do qualify for the Temp visa --> PR route for students.

At this time the most of the students applying through this route are from China, Southeast Asia, and India.

Start at this link to get to the docs and rules for the 457:
Temporary Business (Long Stay) - Standard Business Sponsorship (Subclass 457)
Click to expand...
Thanks for the link. A great read, esp, the Q&A in the end to illustrate scenarios if the 457 is revoked. If I cannot find an affordable school (how in the world to all of the Asians you mention afford this? Probably from wealthy families :confused2:

I'll have to start another thread 'affordable schools for foreigners' or something. Not that they are any more expensive than schools here in the US (for a white male, read: 'grant free') Geez I wish I was born anywhere else. Anyway, chin up and all, if I don't find an affordable school, its on a flight to Auzland to plead my case in person. I guess those are my bottom line options.

BTW, I recall a list of 'most in demand skills' MODL I think. Since I'm off of the list, does that affect the 457 as it does the 175/176? Maybe I'll take some job most Aussies don't want (?) As long as a company sponsors me I'm in right?

I'll be just fine if I can just get a start...
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tilla_07 said:
i remember checking out some unis like University of sydney and uni of melbourne, and i think I rem reading that you can have US FAFSA apply towards these schools. It might be worth it to check it out and see if that is the case and which schools will allow it. That will certainly take some of the costs out of your own pocket. Since you're a US citizen and youare wanting to go back to school, check out the US gov FAFSA site and see if they will pay or help for your schooling in foreign countries.
Click to expand...
Not overlooking any possibility, I've followed up and filed the online application for the FAFSA today. I was told my expected family contribution was ten grand. What are these people smoking? Anyway, there is a Federal School Code that you have to input for all schools you are considering attending. I couldn't find the codes for any foreign schools at all. Any tips? I doubt that they will sponsor me to go to school in Australia, but it is certainly worth a follow up if such an opportunity exists. With my expected family contribution though, I'm not sure that this will actually matter in the end. The US would clearly rather offshore the jobs than retrain their own people to compete. My roommate is Hispanic and they are paying him $1600 a month to go to school. Go figure... Anyway, if you know the codes, please share!
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Apotheosis
Man, QA is no joke. I'm sure you have a sufficient amount of experience to get a job, you just need to find it!

I'm quite sure that the education route is not going to work for you...way too expensive! You have to look at that realistically...the Australian government will most likely give aid to Australian students. And FAFSA??? No way. Our government does not fund people that want to move to another country.
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matjones said:
I doubt that FAFSA will give you money if your plan is to stay in Australia. I'm pretty sure they would want you back in the US once they have paid for your education.

Regarding TAFE schools, one of the main ones in Melbourne is William Angliss, however you will find that International student fees for TAFE schools are also fairly high. For a 2 year Diploma course, expect to pay between 20-30K AUD.
Click to expand...
William Angliss: $1-3 per 'student contact hour'. I have no idea about this system or how many of these hours would equal full time schooling for a year. Will research further. Thanks for the tip.

Jeff
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amaslam said:
Actually they will, take a look at this link (Sallie Mae funds a large number of loans):
Loans for U.S. students studying outside the United States
Click to expand...
Hmm, tempting, but these are the *******s kept me in debt my whole life.
Sallie Mae is pure evil. Don't do it!
Truth in lending act doesn't apply.
They can attach your wages at any time WITHOUT A COURT ORDER, including times of disability, medical emergency, etc.
They are allowed to own their own collection agencies (unlike any other form of debt), to write off exorbitant collection fees, then wrap them all neatly back into your loan, from which even bankruptcy cannot give you relief.
Take Sallie Mae loans and you'd BETTER gamble correctly and make them pay or you'll wind up as screwed as me! Just a thought...

But again, thanks for the tip :)
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Apotheosis
TumblingDice said:
Hmm, tempting, but these are the *******s kept me in debt my whole life.
Sallie Mae is pure evil. Don't do it!
Truth in lending act doesn't apply.
They can attach your wages at any time WITHOUT A COURT ORDER, including times of disability, medical emergency, etc.
They are allowed to own their own collection agencies (unlike any other form of debt), to write off exorbitant collection fees, then wrap them all neatly back into your loan, from which even bankruptcy cannot give you relief.
Take Sallie Mae loans and you'd BETTER gamble correctly and make them pay or you'll wind up as screwed as me! Just a thought...

But again, thanks for the tip :)
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More complaints. Nobody wants a victim. Good luck.
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Apotheosis said:
Mr. 8 ball allow me to offer my advice.

First of all...if you are trying to make this sort of move, then a negative disposition will get you nowhere fast.

I am 30 years old, in Miami, Florida and have yet to make this move, but it is on its way...been working out these details for almost a year now.

The one thing I have learned is to be as positive as possible...otherwise you will not make it through this process. Your post stinks of negativity, man, seriously. You should have a lot more confidence in your experience and abilities. I should know, I am in a VERY similar circumstance but I am extremely optimistic that I will have success in being accepted into Australia and have employment there. I am a business analyst in IT at a large international corporation and have my share of fears about moving/working down under.

Every situation is different, of course...but you need higher self-confidence to be a successful person...this goes for any industry, actually...abroad or at home in America.

I think there is a tremendous amount of information to learn on this forum...the best, actually! I've been reading (and occasionally posting) for a few months now (I plan to make the big move in Dec 09 or Jan 2010) but I've also come to learn a lot about how internally I am processing the concept of moving to Australia. I firmly believe that the smallest amount of negativity can destroy everything. So my advice is this:

Start contacting any IT recruiting agency that may (or may not!) have work in Australia. Be yourself, it is so important! Communicate what you do well, and make it sound like it's amazing. The underlying sentiment that you need to communicate is that whatever company/organization you are contacting...they NEED you there. The way I look at it is this...what harm can it do??? We live in a world these days where all it takes is a good email. You can send dozens of emails per day if you're motivated enough. Surely someone will respond positively?? It's so easy for us to literally do what we want these days, including moving to the other side of the world. I am trying to do exactly the same, this is why I feel so passionate about the advice that I am giving. Look up some industries that you're interested in and send them a well-crafted email. If you are committed, you will find a way. From your posts it sounds like you already believe that. But no more complaining about yourself! :)

And although no one else on this forum will say it...fark debt, fark student loans, fark other loans...no matter what, GO TO AUSTRALIA. Debt does not mean shiat! Get the holiday visa if all else fails. If you are good enough, someone will give you a job. I've come to find in my life that the unorthodox path is probably the right one. It is up to you and you alone to make your desires come true, no matter what your destination is.

There are definitely some wonderful people on this forum that have very logical advice for making your move, and I do not mean to discount anything that others have mentioned here. However, I hope that I can offer something different. I hope that I can help you realize that what is most important to do something like this is inside of you. No matter what obstacles are in front of you, none of them are a match for human intention. You just have to learn how to communicate that to the Australian organizations that quite possibly need you!

To me, it is very simple. It is up to you, and all the details that make us worry are just that...details. Like I said, my fate is still unknown. I'm still in Miami, trying to make this all happen...but I feel incredibly fortunate to understand the true mechanics of this process. And I am very confident that I will be living a a new and wonderful life with my girlfriend, cat and dog in Sydney in no time.

-Ryan
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Ryan,
Thanks for the post man.
Yeah you are totally right. My attitude is crap at this moment, emotions a whirlwind, some days better than others, but most of the time crap anymore. After a lifetime of reverse racism, I'm more interested in getting out of the US than actually into Australia. My expectations aren't high. Ha- I'd take a janitor job for a shot at an affordable education someday, and some peace of mind for retirement. And health care, oh, just imagine! I just figure anything is worth a shot at this point. And you're right, I've got to find some positive feelings to hold onto or this is all doomed from the beginning.

Like you said, you are a business analyst, employed with a major international firm. I'm an 'ex' in a field that is 'ex'. My last three jobs were offshored to Indians, while I worked I was surrounded by Indians who looked down their noses at me. I was considered seriously skilled at one point, told I was a 'rock star' by my ER rep, who handed me an employee recognition award, but I would be dreaming if I thought manual QA had any value to anyone today. So its hard after these experiences to sell my past to anyone with positive energy.

Thanks for the reminder. I'm sure you're right. This will in the end be my biggest challenge, and the real key to any new success. Easier said than done, but I'm working on it :)

Jeff
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no i dont know the FAFSA code. yes, going to school in AU is very expensive. Just one year alone will cost akin to going to an Ivy league school for one year in the US. but there are scholarships that you could try for. You wonder how so many Asians can go to school in AU. While some are financially well off, they also strive to get scholarships to pay for their schooling.
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