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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello...

My task is to try and suss out how to apply for our carte vitale. My partner (we aren't yet married so we do confusingly have different surnames) and I moved to France about 3 wks ago. I have two children from a previous marriage who are 5 and 7.

My partner works as a freelancer and has YET to sort out paying tax into the french system, but the plan is he will do this asap. He has most of his work from England but will pay tax into the french system once we've seen the accountant.

I have given up full time work and so am a stay at home Mum now and won't be working in France.

I've read LOADS of things from books to online info about applying for this and when we went to the local doctor here for the kids medical certificate enabling them to start school he gave us a form each (not the kids) to go and apply for our carte vitale with his GP stamp etc etc on it.

My question is - as I'm not working here, do me and the kids come under my partners carte vitale as dependents (given that we're not legally married) or do I have to get my own? If it's the latter, how can I do this given that I'm not earning etc etc.

Apologies for so many questions but this is a COMPLETE nightmare to sort out - plus our french I'm afraid is rusty 'A' level albeit we're working hard to get better!!!

Thanks
Lizbeth
 

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OK, if you had health care coverage in the UK, you should have gotten the EHIC certificates before your left, which will give you reciprocal coverage in France for a few months at least. https://www.ehic.org.uk/Internet/home.do

Your partner needs to register his business in France under one of the various statuts here (auto-entrepreneur or an EURL, SARL or whatever other options are open to him according to what exactly he does). Normally he should be able to include you and the kids on his carte vitale, but they have been tightening up the regulations lately and you may want to look into PACS'ing if you run into problems.

Are you sure that what the GP gave you was for the carte vitale? It may have been the forms for declaring a "medicin traitant" which is something you need to do.

Check with your local mairie (town hall) to see if they have a representative from the sécu who visits on a regular basis (usually once a week). If they do, go in and see them. They can usually sort out the paperwork and get you set up, or at least tell you what documents you're missing.
Cheers,
Bev
 

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Hi Lizbeth, I am preparing to move to France permanently in the next few months and from I have found/been told perhaps you and your Husband could apply for E106's to cover some of your health care for a while? It depends on the amount of national insurance you have paid in the UK and I am not sure if you have to apply for it before you leave, but might be worth a go? I found them very helpful on the phone and this is a link to the form for information.

Sorry it seems I am not allow to put the internet link in this message! But it is HMRC, then E106, sorry wanted to make it easier!

Bonne chance.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Hi Bev - yes I've just looked at the forms and you're right it's 'Declaration de choix de medecin traitant' - so what's this then and does it have anything to do with the carte vitale process?

Still as clear as mud. However, the fact that there may well be a rep for all these things within our own Mairie's office is well worth investigating. It's a start...

Lizbeth
 

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Hi Bev - yes I've just looked at the forms and you're right it's 'Declaration de choix de medecin traitant' - so what's this then and does it have anything to do with the carte vitale process?

Still as clear as mud. However, the fact that there may well be a rep for all these things within our own Mairie's office is well worth investigating. It's a start...

Lizbeth
OK, the choice of your medecin traitant comes immediately after you sign up for the sécu. Basically you are declaring a doctor who will be your "main" doctor - keep all your records and be responsible for making referrals to specialists.

It isn't absolutely necessary to do this, but if you don't have a medecin traitant, you get reimbursed at a slightly lower rate for all your various medical costs. You also get reimbursed at the lower rate if you go see a specialist on your own, without getting referred by your m.t. (You can see any specialist you want - you only need the referral saying that you should see a certain type of specialist.)
Cheers,
Bev
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
OK, the choice of your medecin traitant comes immediately after you sign up for the sécu. Basically you are declaring a doctor who will be your "main" doctor - keep all your records and be responsible for making referrals to specialists.

It isn't absolutely necessary to do this, but if you don't have a medecin traitant, you get reimbursed at a slightly lower rate for all your various medical costs. You also get reimbursed at the lower rate if you go see a specialist on your own, without getting referred by your m.t. (You can see any specialist you want - you only need the referral saying that you should see a certain type of specialist.)
Cheers,
Bev
Ok that's useful. I'll repost when I get stumped at the next post! :)
 

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Hello Lizbeth,

Where to start !

To become affiliated to the French health system and get a CV you either have to be in possession of an E106 from UK or working in France for a French company and paying normal employee dues.

To qualify for an E106 you have to have paid UK class 1 NI contributions for 2 of the past 3 complete tax years so for you that would be April 2007 to April 2009. If that applies then you can apply for an E106 which nominally runs from December to January and lasts for 2 years however if you were to apply now it would actually run from now until January 2012, so 2 years and 3 months, after which you would have to take out private insurance. The E106 will cover your children also and if you were married your husband too but as you are not you cannot include him.

Normally you would apply for an E106 a month or so before you leave UK but you can apply any time during it's validity however remember the clock started ticking when you ceased paying NI as per above. Your application for an E106 would be to the DWP not HMRC BTW.

You ask if you can be covered under your partners CV but from what I'm reading I don't think he has one yet does he? Even if and when he does get one, or at least an attestation which is the first step towards it, I'm not as convinced as others that you will be allowed to benefit from it. Unfortunately different CPAM offices seem to apply the rules in their own way so you may need to formalise your relationship with a PACS.

Your partner being self employed in UK will not be entitled to an E106 so until he is properly set up as a business here then he will have to take out private health cover.

Note that unless you both have adequate health cover then you are not considered legitimately resident in France

Although the UK EHIC has been extended in it's range of services and you should have one it does NOT provide reciprocal services nor is it a substitute for proper health cover.
 

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Hello...

My task is to try and suss out how to apply for our carte vitale. My partner (we aren't yet married so we do confusingly have different surnames) and I moved to France about 3 wks ago. I have two children from a previous marriage who are 5 and 7.

My partner works as a freelancer and has YET to sort out paying tax into the french system, but the plan is he will do this asap. He has most of his work from England but will pay tax into the french system once we've seen the accountant.

I have given up full time work and so am a stay at home Mum now and won't be working in France.

I've read LOADS of things from books to online info about applying for this and when we went to the local doctor here for the kids medical certificate enabling them to start school he gave us a form each (not the kids) to go and apply for our carte vitale with his GP stamp etc etc on it.

My question is - as I'm not working here, do me and the kids come under my partners carte vitale as dependents (given that we're not legally married) or do I have to get my own? If it's the latter, how can I do this given that I'm not earning etc etc.

Apologies for so many questions but this is a COMPLETE nightmare to sort out - plus our french I'm afraid is rusty 'A' level albeit we're working hard to get better!!!

Thanks
Lizbeth
Hi.
I called the british embassy in Paris and the gave me the number of a healthcare agency in the UK (sorry I didn't keep hold of it) and they can provide you with the documents needed I think to take to the relevant bodies here. I think they can assess whether you are able to have an E106 form (hope that is the right name as like I said I don;t have the info to hand) that can provide you with healthcare here for maximum of 2 years. I wasn't able to have this as I haven't been living/working in the UK for the past few years so therefore contributions were not enough into the UK system...I know my info is vague but it gives you a few roadsto go down...mine was a dead end due to me living outside the UK for a while so I hope you have more luck !
 

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carte vitale and mutuelle

Hi! Ah fond memories of getting my carte vitale, but the JOY when it arrived at last!!

First it is really important so don't put it off. Take the form the doctor gave you to the Caisse Primaire Assurance Maladie nearest to you (ask at the Mairie of course, as everything.) You will need precise photos of your face denuded of glassess, fringe etc filling the space. lot of photo machines in France ask specifically if it is for a carte vitale. You will need a social security number for France. If neither of you is working, ask for them without delay - again at CPAM
(good advice to me was, go at 8 am to avoid queues)(take a French helper). Send everything off or take it in as soon as you can and filled in exactly correctly or they will send it back. Keep phoning or going in to check whether they have it. I'm not convinced this speeds them up but it made me feel better. You need one each. The children go on yours or his. Before you get your CV they will send an attestation. Do not lose this as you'll need it often for form filling. As soon as you have this, you can claim and get a mutuelle. Until you get your cv you will have to pay up front and claim, although my pharmacie accepted the attestation in lieu of the cv.

You will also need a mutuelle as soon as you can, mine is Prevadies who are super. This will provide complementary health care. The state only pays 35-75 % now and Sarkosi is reducing state support as we speak. 5 days after I got mine I was hospitalised and needed lots of injections and home nursing and god knows what, which would have cost me thousands of pounds. With the CV and mutuelle, it's all free.
my complementary includes full dental and optical stuff too. You will be able to calculate your own needs about this. You will need a French friend and go in to a shop don't try online, you need some friendly lady to help you.

Once you have your CV and Mutuelle, your life will be wonderful, you will have all tests and innoculations and so on, and will feel like royalty everywhere you go. I arrived in France in March, and it took 5 months to sort out. Good luck.



Hello...

My task is to try and suss out how to apply for our carte vitale. My partner (we aren't yet married so we do confusingly have different surnames) and I moved to France about 3 wks ago. I have two children from a previous marriage who are 5 and 7.

My partner works as a freelancer and has YET to sort out paying tax into the french system, but the plan is he will do this asap. He has most of his work from England but will pay tax into the french system once we've seen the accountant.

I have given up full time work and so am a stay at home Mum now and won't be working in France.

I've read LOADS of things from books to online info about applying for this and when we went to the local doctor here for the kids medical certificate enabling them to start school he gave us a form each (not the kids) to go and apply for our carte vitale with his GP stamp etc etc on it.

My question is - as I'm not working here, do me and the kids come under my partners carte vitale as dependents (given that we're not legally married) or do I have to get my own? If it's the latter, how can I do this given that I'm not earning etc etc.

Apologies for so many questions but this is a COMPLETE nightmare to sort out - plus our french I'm afraid is rusty 'A' level albeit we're working hard to get better!!!

Thanks
Lizbeth
 

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er yeah you do need a social security number for this and this means you should be working. Get PACsed
Just to clarify - if you aren't working and aren't otherwise eligible for a carte vitale on your own, make sure your partner (spouse or PACS'd partner) puts you on his or her card as a beneficiary. That allows you to receive health care on your partner's account. If you have children, the children need to be declared as beneficiaries on the parent's card or along with their parent on the partner's card.
Cheers,
Bev
 

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Lizbeth, your doctor has no way of knowing whether you are entitled to apply for a CV or not but whatever he/she has given you will have been predicated on an assumption that you are however from what you have told us so far it seems clear that you are not.

A further note regarding EHIC's:

Once you have left the UK with the intention of becoming resident elsewhere, without an E form your EHIC (assuming you have one) becomes invalid. In other words if you needed treatment in France then you would have to pay for it yourself in full and UK will not reimburse you as would normally happen.
 

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Carte Vitale questions for bevdeforges

Trying to send a msg to bevdeforges hoping she will read this & be able to offer some advice:

We have read your posts with great interest and are reaching out to you in hope that you may offer us some insight. My wife and I are really confused by the whole health care establishment and seem to get different answers depending on who we ask, even within the same organization. Our questions relate to two concepts: either her getting on the system or me:

1) Is my wife eligible for social security and benefits as an EU citizen once resident in France for 3 months?

2) If not, but I am as a non EU person with a carte de sejour, is it means tested? and if so, is the means testing determined by prior salary levels?

Background:

My wife is a dual Australian/Finnish citizen here on her Finnish passport, and I am a dual Australian/American, here on my Australian passport.

We relocated from Australia to France 6 weeks ago. En route via a 2 month visit to my family in the US, we learned that my wife is pregnant. She is now in her 5th month of pregnancy. We do not have health insurance as Australia has a medical social security system also. I am not working but looking for work actively. My wife is not working.

For question 1: Is my wife eligible for social security and benefits as an EU citizen once resident in France for 3 months?

The CPAM in Grasse told us that she was not eligible at all as EU citizen if she is not working, but if she had a carte de sejour, she could be regardless of work status.

The CPAM English speaking help line told us that she is eligible after three months resident regardless of work status, but that she would need to get a carte de sejour first, and that the carte de sejour must be applied for under her Australian passport, not her EU.

This is where question #1 applies. As an EU citizen in France not working, is my wife eligible for social security and benefits after three months of residence? Also, does she need to have a carte de sejour along with the 3 months residency? What difference does the EU versus Australian citizenship for the carte de sejour make? We are not even sure how she would go about getting the carte de sejour under he Australian passport anyway, especially considering the possible impacts to my current application and situation (I will now to explain Q 2).

For question 2: If not, but I am as a non EU person with a carte de sejour, is it means tested? and if so, is the means testing determined by prior salary levels?

I have applied for and am awaiting receipt of my carte de sejour formal notification letter. I have the 'recepisse' from the application request. I am not working but looking for work actively without formal receipt of my carte de sejour yet (which is another story I will leave for now about getting different carte de sejour and work permit instructions from the French consulate in Australia versus the authorities in France).

We were advised at the CPAM office that they would sign me up for the social security/carte vital, and put my wife on under my account, since I have my ‘recepisse’, and to complete the application , I need to provide CPAM with documentation of my last year’s salary in Australia. We have no issue with providing that documentation, but what concerns us is the ‘use’ of this salary figure. My salary in Australia last year was quite high, especially relative to French salaries.

Will CPAM use this salary figure as a ‘means test’ leveling to determine any payments into the system (i.e. once I am working in France). Also, will they use the Australian salary to determine social security:benefits allowance and claim amounts?

At this point, we are more than happy to put in the request under my name and carte de sejour, and put my wife onto it, but the implications from my prior salary are worrisome.

Any advice you can provide is greatly appreciated, as this is the last thing we need to worry about while my wife is pregnant!
 

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A couple of basic points whilst you wait for bevdeforges.

1) Is my wife eligible for social security and benefits as an EU citizen once resident in France for 3 months?

I know of no circumstances whereby any EU citizen is automatically accepted into the French health system by the simple expedient of being resident in France for 3 months. I don't know here you have got this information from. Are there any reciprocal health arrangements between Finland and France she could benefit from ?

2) If not, but I am as a non EU person with a carte de sejour, is it means tested? and if so, is the means testing determined by prior salary levels?

A Carte de Sejour is nothing to do with entry to the health system and AFAIK as a non EU citizen the only route for you into the French health system is via employment.
 

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Whoo boy, Liisa, you are definitely in an "interesting" and potentially pretty complicated situation.

1) Is my wife eligible for social security and benefits as an EU citizen once resident in France for 3 months?
Technically, no - but that's a qualified no. It depends a bit on the Finnish system of health care. If she is eligible for the Finnish health care system merely by being a Finnish national, she should contact them to get an EHIC (European Health Insurance Card) which will allow her reciprocal benefits while in France. Normally (and I know nothing about the Finnish health care system), eligibility for your home country system is based on having contributed to the system, usually by having worked there, for some minimum period of time over the last few years.

2) If not, but I am as a non EU person with a carte de sejour, is it means tested? and if so, is the means testing determined by prior salary levels?
This is one area where I think I am way out of my depth. Technically speaking, your carte de séjour is based on the visa with which you entered the country. If it was a work visa, they you have the right to work and as soon as you start working, you're covered by the national health care system, thanks to your contributions.

But to answer your actual question, no, eligibility for the health care system isn't means tested. Depending on what sort of carte de séjour you're up for, however, you may be eligible for CMU, which is a coverage based on your not having the means to get coverage any other way. The French are (rightfully) proud of their excellent maternity care, and they aren't likely to let a pregnant woman go without coverage.

Things vary by departement, but where I live, the prefecture won't give a carte de séjour to an EU national, since she already has the right to live in France. To get a carte de séjour with her Australian passport, she should have to return to Australia to apply for a visa and then re-enter France. (Though this IS France, and anything is possible.)

But it sounds as though the CPAM is working on getting your qualified under the CMU coverage, at least until you and/or your wife can find a job and thus establish regular coverage through contributions.
Cheers,
Bev
 

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Thanks a million Bev!

Thanks for your speedy response & we think you are probably spot on with your prediction that CPAM will submit under CMU for now so we will visit them tomorrow with all appropriate paperwork to hopefully get it all underway. We just got back from Grasse hospital & were quoted 1000 euros per day just for stay to give birth so we really don't have any time to waste on this! My husband just got his residence permit today (without authority to work unless I am first, yep the rules changed when we were en route to France on this one) so hopefully this will speed up the process a little.

Thanks to MataMata as well for your insights.

Whoo boy, Liisa, you are definitely in an "interesting" and potentially pretty complicated situation.



Technically, no - but that's a qualified no. It depends a bit on the Finnish system of health care. If she is eligible for the Finnish health care system merely by being a Finnish national, she should contact them to get an EHIC (European Health Insurance Card) which will allow her reciprocal benefits while in France. Normally (and I know nothing about the Finnish health care system), eligibility for your home country system is based on having contributed to the system, usually by having worked there, for some minimum period of time over the last few years.



This is one area where I think I am way out of my depth. Technically speaking, your carte de séjour is based on the visa with which you entered the country. If it was a work visa, they you have the right to work and as soon as you start working, you're covered by the national health care system, thanks to your contributions.

But to answer your actual question, no, eligibility for the health care system isn't means tested. Depending on what sort of carte de séjour you're up for, however, you may be eligible for CMU, which is a coverage based on your not having the means to get coverage any other way. The French are (rightfully) proud of their excellent maternity care, and they aren't likely to let a pregnant woman go without coverage.

Things vary by departement, but where I live, the prefecture won't give a carte de séjour to an EU national, since she already has the right to live in France. To get a carte de séjour with her Australian passport, she should have to return to Australia to apply for a visa and then re-enter France. (Though this IS France, and anything is possible.)

But it sounds as though the CPAM is working on getting your qualified under the CMU coverage, at least until you and/or your wife can find a job and thus establish regular coverage through contributions.
Cheers,
Bev
 

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In addition..

Just FYI Nice Prefecture have advised my husband to submit a letter requesting exception to the new ruling with me being so far along in my pregnancy already the likelihood of me securing a job before him would not be as easy.

Thanks again.

Whoo boy, Liisa, you are definitely in an "interesting" and potentially pretty complicated situation.



Technically, no - but that's a qualified no. It depends a bit on the Finnish system of health care. If she is eligible for the Finnish health care system merely by being a Finnish national, she should contact them to get an EHIC (European Health Insurance Card) which will allow her reciprocal benefits while in France. Normally (and I know nothing about the Finnish health care system), eligibility for your home country system is based on having contributed to the system, usually by having worked there, for some minimum period of time over the last few years.



This is one area where I think I am way out of my depth. Technically speaking, your carte de séjour is based on the visa with which you entered the country. If it was a work visa, they you have the right to work and as soon as you start working, you're covered by the national health care system, thanks to your contributions.

But to answer your actual question, no, eligibility for the health care system isn't means tested. Depending on what sort of carte de séjour you're up for, however, you may be eligible for CMU, which is a coverage based on your not having the means to get coverage any other way. The French are (rightfully) proud of their excellent maternity care, and they aren't likely to let a pregnant woman go without coverage.

Things vary by departement, but where I live, the prefecture won't give a carte de séjour to an EU national, since she already has the right to live in France. To get a carte de séjour with her Australian passport, she should have to return to Australia to apply for a visa and then re-enter France. (Though this IS France, and anything is possible.)

But it sounds as though the CPAM is working on getting your qualified under the CMU coverage, at least until you and/or your wife can find a job and thus establish regular coverage through contributions.
Cheers,
Bev
 

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How long do you need to be working before you are issued a permanent social security number? I still have a temporary one with only 10 numbers and need to apply for my carte vital.
 

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How long do you need to be working before you are issued a permanent social security number? I still have a temporary one with only 10 numbers and need to apply for my carte vital.
If you've got a temporary sécu number, it means the permanent number is in process and I would imagine that means you will be getting your carte vitale pretty soon.

Two things that may be delaying your card: First of all, the holidays - basically nothing is going to happen until after the first of the year in fonctionnaire-ville. But secondly, France is starting to convert over to a carte vitale that includes a photograph. If your departement is due to switch to the new photo cards soon, they may be delaying processing of your case so that you will get the new style card rather than issuing you an "old" card and then having to re-issue the photo one.

As long as you have the temporary number, you can use it - and sometimes using the temporary number may actually serve as "incentive" for them to start working on your file.
Cheers,
Bev
 
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