Well if you are an usual resident in Australia and spend a few months outside then it should be fine. Because they may ask you for documents for residence history when applying for 191.
Mate I guess I know what you are trying to do. Few things you gotta keep in mind.
1. Tfn letter is only sent to an Australian address
2. Having tfn doesn’t mean ato will issue you noa, they might send you non lodgement advice instead when you file taxes if you have no income.
3. When you have no residential proof for the application, it might not work in your favor.

Sorry to say but there will never be any confirmation on what you are looking for and even if there is any, will you trust some random confirmations on the internet? Best way to guarantee your application is to spend 3 years in Regional areas and work / study

 

I am the current 491 visa holder and want to apply 191 visa after three years when I meet the reuqirement of 191 visa.
My question is that can I live outside Australia. If I can, how long can I stay outside Australia.
I read the 491 visa condition carefully and the condition is that while you are in Australia, you must live, study and work in an area that is on the list of designated regional areas in an instrument. I think if I live outside Australia, it also meets the visa condition of 491 because it automatically guarantee that I don't live in Sydney,Melbourne or Brisbane.
There are 2 requirements of applying 191, one is holding 491 for three years and the other is get an NOA for three years within the five years. If I live outside Australia, I meet the first requirement and for the second requirement, if I have a TFN I can also get an NOA for three years. The TFN is easy to get. You just land to Australia and apply the TFN. The number will be mailed to you within 28 days.
So does anyone has the experience that you live outside Australia for a period and also be granted for 191 visa.
or someone can give the advice that can I live outside Australia when I hold the 491 visa and apply 191 visa successfully.

You need an assessment order from the ATO for 3 years
If you have a below taxable income, you will not get an assessment order as far as I know
If you can get the 191 without living in Australia, then the 491 is the worlds best PR enabling visa
Do your research properly and consult a Mara agent to be sure
Cheers

 

regarding appliying 491 visa, if the partner wants to be part of the applicaiton, should the partner be residing in the regional area too? and how about claiming 5 points for regional study requrements, should both be living in regional areas?

 

Hi,Based on the current framework for qualifying for 191 visa,you can apply for 191 visa even though you dont touch down to australia.You can apply for 191 visa if you are holding your 491 visa for 3 years.In parallels you can get the NOA on zero income (which qualifies to be put in the category of No minimum income requirement).If you have friend in Regional Australia you can apply your TFN based on his address. Once you get the TFN you can lodge your zero income tax return once you request ATO to create the obligation on their side (Leave it on a tax consultant they will charge you AUD 65 for per year return).However midway before you put your application for 191 if any legislation is introduced for the minimum income criteria then you may not qualify to apply.

 

May I ask if your comment is based on anecdotal experience ( someone who is granted 191 visa ) or from some other reputable source? Thank you

 

Its based on personal experience and currently the visa is lodged after completing all the required stipulated rules and fulfilling the edibility criteria on their website for 191.Will keep posted about the visa progress

 

Thanks for keeping us posted
Just want to know a few things if you don’t mind.
I suppose you were granted 491 visa back in around 2021 ( dating three years back from your 191 application)
1. How much time did you spend in Australia prior to 191 application?
2. You have no Australian income during last three years?
3. What documents did you submit for the residency and work exp in 191 application ?

 

Fortunately I have detailed answers to all your queries but considering that currently the visa is lodged and decision is pending i do not want to respond in open forum. Hope you understand the genuine reason as i do not want the process to be influenced by reveling the strategy here at this sensitive stage.

I would request you to just wait for a month and I will update you the details as the visa progresses till a decision is made.

 

Fortunately I have detailed answers to all your queries but considering that currently the visa is lodged and decision is pending i do not want to respond in open forum. Hope you understand the genuine reason as i do not want the process to be influenced by reveling the strategy here at this se
I would request you to just wait for a month and I will update you the details as the visa progresses till a decision is made.

Do you have any update on your application f

 

This is very much a bad idea.

One of the grant criteria for the 191 is Cl. 191.221(2), which says "The applicant complied with condition 8579 to which the regional provisional visa held by the applicant at the time of application was subject".

Condition 8579 says "the holder, while in Australia, must live, work and study only in a part of Australia that was a designated regional area at the time the visa was granted."

The 491 also has the 8578 condition "The holder must notify Immigration of a change to any of the following within 14 days after the change occurs: (a) the holder's residential address"

So you are obligated to tell the Department that you don't live in Regional Australia while holding your 491. While there is a technicality that you are compliant with 8579 (you were not in Australia so didn't have to live in the Regions) this is a glaring attempt at 'gaming' the system. Migration law and the Department decision making isn't like a courtroom drama that you see on TV. There is no "gotcha!" moment where the Judge suddenly realises that there is an obscure loophole that saves the day. The whole structure of these particular visa clauses is designed to ensure you live in - and can prove you lived in - Regional Australia. The Delegate deciding your case will instantly see through what you are trying to do. I would expect them to reject your visa as having not substantially complied with 8579.

I've said it before, I often see people who haven't taken professional advice trying to be 'clever' with applications, try to find and exploit loopholes or gaps. There are hundreds of thousands of applications a year and hundreds of thousands of qualified and paid legal professionals working in this space. Every possible gap has already been identified and, trust me, the Department has seen it all before. My advice is don't try and be too smart. Comply with the regulations and conditions and play a straight bat, you will have for more success

 

Thank you Andrew for your valuable response to my comment and I really appreciate your answer. I was having another query as I seen you are a registered MARA Agent and I believe you can answer my question. I have been granted with 491 visa regional sponsored by ACT. I am here since more than 2 months and couldn't find any job, However I found a good job opportunity in regional area of NSW. If you could suggest me weather can I accept that offer or I cannot as I have signed an commitment letter that I will stay in ACT region for two years. Please advise on this matter.

 

The days automatic extensions that occurred due to the difficulty entering the country during COVID are over...
Until there is another crisis that interrupts international movements on a global scale I don't think we will see similar again
I believe it was done to comply with natural justice requirements along with removing the administrative burden of processing applications

In any cast the zero income question is rather moot, because I don't think a tax return submitted through MyGov will accept a return that has no income declared.
I highly suspect that it will only accept a return with positive numbers.
Submitting a tax return with $1 of income simply to be able to file a tax return is probably something that should be frowned upon and, in a legalistic sense, one would be making a false declaration.. a criminal act

No minimum income is not the same as no income. If they didn't actually care if you worked on not they would have removed the requirement entirely. The requirement for a notice of assessment was kept because there is still a requirement to show that you have been working because economic contribution to regional Australia is the whole point of the visa.

Ultimately, if you want to understand those rules, regulations and conditions get a Legendcom account or you can access it through any major library that is part of the Commonwealth deposit scheme.

I don't think Andrew will, or even should, play these sorts of intellectual games in a public forum.

 

I don't think Andrew will, or even should, play these sorts of intellectual games in a public forum.

Correct as usual

I can provide generic advice and comments but on something that specific it qualifies as migration advice and will put me at risk from my Code of Conduct obligations.

My only (final) comment is that it should not be assumed that the general public have access to all of the documents and texts that are used in decision making. From memory the Procedural Instruction / Policy for processing the 491 runs to something like 17 sections (chapters, basically), each with sub sections and most of which have sub-sub sections. This is why the 'loopholes' that people find when reading through the Department website don't work. When doing your qualification in Migration Law the lecturers repeatedly stress how important it is not to use the Department website for that very reason.

 

191 Visa Residency Myths. The 191 visa has a residency requirement for only one stream, the HK one. (youtube.com)

 

Hi Only main applicant need to meet the eligibility requirement to apply for 191 right ? family members need to meet only character and health requirements ?

 

Yes any member of the family unit can apply/be qualified to apply for 191.

 

I've a question for 491.

What's the drawback of 491 apart from Living, working in regional area?

 

1. Jobs that require permanent or citizen status
2. Centre link
3. Buying a home
4. Private health insurance

 

I have a question:-
If my company is based in Sydney but I work remotely since last 1.5 years from Victoria, should I use by employer code associated with the main office or the one related to my home office address in the EOI?
My payslips has myVictoria home office address.

 

If you are planning to apply for VIc sponsorship, then give the Vic office employer code
Cheers

 

I have been looking for this answer for months. Once you get your decision, can you please email me at ------- forum rules------ Once again please confirm, that you did your first entry, stayed out of Australia for 3 years and then were able to lodge 191 application with either 0 income or by paying tax on whatever income you earned offshore. Is that correct?

 

yes your understanding is correct

 

Any update on your visa?

 

An update that i recieved S56 to provide AFP for my son.I have provided that today and will keep you posted for any further update.191 lodged on 16th June 2024

 

No as processing timelines have increased.But def will post here first once a decision is made

 

How you input your residential address in Australia and proof of reside (eg. electricity bills, etc)

 

@DUBAI N - waiting for your visa processing. Please keep us informed and good luck!

 

It is approved two days back and we got our PR

 

Congratulations @DUBAI N - could you now please confirm the following:
1. How long did you stay in Australia after your 491 grant?
2. Were all of your NOAs for 0 income?
3. Was there any s56 requested of you in your 191 application?

Your candid advise would be greatly helpful to me who is in a similar position.

 

Just seen the new video on Karl Conrad Youtube channel. He once again confirmed the 8579 condition of 191 visa. Dubai N was right. We don't have to be present in Australia but if you do it has to be designated area. So i guess 491 visa is not bad after all, it's just that the waiting period a bit long. 3 years for PR and another for citizenship