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-   -   Advice please: *might* be getting married. (https://www.expatforum.com/expats/thailand-expat-forum-expats-living-thailand/116874-advice-please-might-getting-married.html)

UKman1980 27th June 2012 08:00 PM

Advice please: *might* be getting married.
 
I say might because my family member and his missues (thai) are going through a bad patch...she has like a jeckl and hyde thing going on.

Anyway I am willing to commit quite a bit to this marriage, quit my job and relocate etc. I'm also planning on buying place to live with her & start a family so my question is this:

1) What claim on my property would she have if we were married in thailand

2) How would a divorce affect my marriage visa would I then only be able to stay on a tourist visa for 3 months + 3 months extension?

TomC 27th June 2012 11:23 PM

1) Rent, don't buy. 2) Sign up with a Thai language school to get on Ed visa. You need to learn Thai and not throwing your heart and money around if you're serious about living and surviving in Thailand.

UKman1980 28th June 2012 09:31 PM

sounds like a better plan!

But say I did get married what would happen then? Would she be entitled to the home, would i have to pay welfare and what of my marriage visa - i would hate not to be able to live with my children.

Newforestcat 29th June 2012 01:32 AM

It is very easy and cheap to get a divorce here, based on what I personally overheard how my primary school friend was getting his at the Ampur office.. It was like going to a Post Office with a long-ish queue!

Be patient ;)

I don't know what sort of assets split you will end up with, that is why you are warned at least twice not to buy a property yet. Besides, it is and has been generally more difficult to sell land and properties in Thailand than in UK possibly even now. If you end up with a divorce, it would be awful to be stuck with your ex, still, in the house that you invested a lot of money in.

I know the idea of having a much bigger house with lots of land and all the trimmings are very exciting. But you need to slow down. You are no longer a holiday-maker here. Take your time to get to know the people, culture and language for your own benefits. I know what I am talking about, I have lived and worked in England very happily and independently for many years, simply by doing all I mentioned.

If you want a farm with huge land, buy it in my name as I am Thai or hers! But both ideas are utterly silly! You will have to confirm in writting that you have no claim over the property in your wife's name. You might as well give her the money now and see if she stays. LOL

Also as a foreigner, without dangerously exploiting the loopholes of Thai property Laws, you cannot buy just anything you fancy, basically there is a tiny chance that you might be able to do it legally, but it involves relying on a lawyer, officials and some Thai people who need to be set up as your fictitious company shareholders. Besides, you plan goes out of the window quite easily if the govt here change the laws. That sounds VERY dangerous to me. As far as I remenber, in your situation, it is not worth it! Renting is dirt cheap. It is the best way to get to know if you love somewhere enough to stay and leave as soon as you start to hate it. Young and free, you and your Thai GF/wife can keep going until you are very happy somewhere. Not a great idea to live too near her family if your relationship is not yet very solid. They can be the very reason you get a divorce.

You can only buy a leasehold property in your name subject to the existing share percentage of foreign ownership. Thai govt are always very paranoid that farangs will buy every plot of land in Thailand or have a majority ownership of every leasehold property. If a block of apartments has a lot of farang owners already, you might have to find somewhere else to buy.

You can own a certain amount of land through inheritance. The law does not say if you have to be related by blood or by law or not. I would not exploit this if I were you!

If you have a child born in Thailand then, he or she will be Thai. I am not certain about what rights unmarried fathers have though. The Thai law is not very clear about if a child can own a property. I think a child can at least be nominated to receive taxable income from a property his parent/anyone else owns. Even if a child certainly can own a property with the permission of the parents, again because you are a farang, unsure if it means you have to sign some similar document To waive your right to ownership again. Even if you don't have to sign such document, be aware that if a property is in your child's name, you cannot sell or mortgage it without permission from the Court of Law.

You sound very unsure about how long your marriage to this Thai lady will last, based on your relative's bad experience with a completely different woman or your inner thoughts or fear of transciency? Or am I being dumb here? I think you should slow down. Do what Tomc advised you and see where your love is heading before getting married.

It is relatively cheap in Thailand, but it is catching up fast with other countries, thanks to inflation, etc. Money goes so fast, if you have 10 K to spend apart from your house funds, get some income ASAP. 10K only lasts as long as you keep your hands well away from it!

Losing everthing abroad is one of the worst experiences, I remember how a wealthy Japanese guy got everything taken from him by the Thai wife he really trusted, I saw him sleeping on pavements near my dorm. I did not have much money or anywhere for him to sleep. But I still remember the look on his face. I know there are women and men who will very badly treat some poor souls who love them the most. It is good to be careful. But we all are responsible for our own misfortunes and good lucks in some ways, they don't just fall down from the sky.

Seize the day, but be sensible!

Cer 1st July 2012 02:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UKman1980 (Post 825308)
I say might because my family member and his missues (thai) are going through a bad patch...she has like a jeckl and hyde thing going on.

Anyway I am willing to commit quite a bit to this marriage, quit my job and relocate etc. I'm also planning on buying place to live with her & start a family so my question is this:

1) What claim on my property would she have if we were married in thailand

2) How would a divorce affect my marriage visa would I then only be able to stay on a tourist visa for 3 months + 3 months extension?

All you own before marriage will still be yours.
After marriage it will be 50/50 unless you will arrange pre nuptial conditions.
As long as you are not sure a 100% about her state of mind,I would advise not to make such drastic steps like above mentioned.

iluvthai 14th July 2012 07:52 AM

I am of the same opinion, I would not buy in Thai....rent safer...who knows what can happen in the future ? , basic rule - spend only what you can afford to lose.

Cer 14th July 2012 08:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UKman1980 (Post 825308)
I say might because my family member and his missues (thai) are going through a bad patch...she has like a jeckl and hyde thing going on.

Anyway I am willing to commit quite a bit to this marriage, quit my job and relocate etc. I'm also planning on buying place to live with her & start a family so my question is this:

1) What claim on my property would she have if we were married in thailand

2) How would a divorce affect my marriage visa would I then only be able to stay on a tourist visa for 3 months + 3 months extension?

It takes two to tango.
As the situation is as it is now and you are not even married,I would consider to quit her instead of your job.

iluvthai 14th July 2012 08:05 AM

Agreed..your considering your divorce and what you could lose...before you marry ?...not a good place to be...be careful !!

bkk 6th August 2012 04:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iluvthai (Post 841475)
Agreed..your considering your divorce and what you could lose...before you marry ?...not a good place to be...be careful !!

Actually this is something everyone who gets married should consider. When I bought a new house I bought insurance to cover it against fire. That doesn't mean I expected it to burn down. It means I was protecting my assets in the unlikely event of a fire. Same with marriage - get a pre-nuptial agreement. It doesn't mean you are planning for it to fail, but just protecting yourself in case the worse happens.

thai-insights 22nd August 2012 12:31 PM

[/QUOTE]

Your two questions are ones that any foreigner who is considering getting married in Thailand should know the answers to.

1) What claim on my property would she have if we were married in Thailand?

The law in Thailand states that all property in any form which belongs to you prior to the marriage still belongs to you should you later divorce. Let's say you have 2mm baht in the bank before you get married. If you spend that 2mm baht to purchase a house and land after you are married, that property under Thai law belongs to you. There is also wording in the law which states that property which is acquired during the marriage which replaces property which you owned prior to the marriage is also considered your property.

However, the law also states that all income, including interest income, which either party earns during the marriage is equally owned by both the husband and the wife. This would technically include income generated from rental property, bank accounts, businesses, lottery winnings, etc. back home. Finally, the law states that in the event that evidence cannot be produced that the property which was acquired during the marriage was purchased with individual money, then the law presumes that the property is marital property. So you need to keep good records.

There is an enormous amount of misinformation floating around the internet on this subject and many Thai lawyers misinterpret the law as well. The root of this confusion stems from the wording of the thai law which reads everything which the couple "ได้" is marital property. "ได้" can be translated as "gets" or "obtains" and many casual readers of the law misinterpret this to mean that anything which the marital couple purchases during the marriage is thus automatically marital property, which must be divided equally if the couple divorces. This is totally incorrect.

2) How would a divorce affect my marriage visa would I then only be able to stay on a tourist visa for 3 months + 3 months extension?

If you are over 50 years old, you could easily convert your marriage visa to a retirement visa. The only change would be that the financial requirement for a bank deposit would be increased from 400,000 to 800,000 baht. Some people have questioned why Thailand requires more money for someone to retire than they require for someone to care for a family. I don't know this for sure, but I suspect that the reason is because an older retiree is more likely to have health problems and the Thai government doesn't want to be stuck with the bill if medical care is required. It's not because the Thai government is trying to discourage retirees from moving to Thailand.

If you are not over 50, and you cannot get a work visa, I think your only options are 90 day visa runs, but I am not 100% certain about this.

Regarding purchasing property (land) this is rife with moral hazard, as except for very few exceptions you cannot legally buy land in Thailand, and if you try to get around this law, you are going to have to register the land in someone else's name. If you decide to do this, my stern advice would be to keep the amount and cost of the land and any house to an amount you could walk away from if your marriage goes south. Trying to recover your investment is going to be next to impossible. For this reason, you would be far better off buying a condo in your name. I know this does not appeal to many people, including me, but at least that way the property would be registered in your name, and there wouldn't be any dispute about ownership in the event of divorce. If your situation is financially complicated or you have considerable income overseas which will continue during your marriage, I would recommend consulting with an attorney and making a pre-nuptual agreement.

I didn't pull out my file on Thai marital property law, but if anyone wants more specific legal reference information, I would be willing to provide it. Hope this helps.


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