Car advice needed please?

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Car advice needed please?


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Old 11th July 2011, 04:03 PM
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Default Car advice needed please?

My wife & I will be emigrating to Portugal in September.

I have a (registered) classic 4x4 here that has only done 120K kms since new, is easy to maintain because it has a simple engine without computers etc and is as reliable as most other cars. It also has all the things like air con etc and is very comfortable.

The car is left hand drive and so has limited resale value here in RSA & I reckon I'd only get about E35K for it here.

Assuming it costs about E2K (hopefully less) to ship over and bearing in mind I can import it into Portugal tax free, would I be better bringing it with me or is it a better idea to sell it here and buy something for about E5K over there...... and would E5K or so buy me a reasonably reliable vehicle?

I appreciate there's a hassle factor in getting it registered etc over there but I'd be willing to accept that if it'll save me money on purchase and also on lower insurance premiums as it's a classic.

FWIW, we'll be moving to central Portugal and hopefully will find somewhere slightly remote/without neighbours and I don't know if that might mean some dirt roads or not?

Also FWIW, If I do bring it, I'll probably then have a GLP conversion fitted to improve fuel consumption etc.

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Old 11th July 2011, 06:18 PM
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Hi,
Not sure but I thought it was only EU vehicles that qualified?

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Old 11th July 2011, 06:20 PM
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I was wrong.
Permanent Importation of Motor Vehicles
If you are transferring your residence to Portugal from another EU member state or from a third country, you may be able to import your motor vehicle tax-free, provided

• You are over 18;

• You have been resident in the country from where you are transferring for a minimum period of 12 months, consecutive or otherwise;

• You have held a valid driver’s licence in that country for a minimum of 12 months;

• You are transferring your normal place of residence to Portugal;

• Your vehicle was purchased fully-tax paid in the country of your former residence;

• You owned the vehicle in the country of your former residence for at least 12 months prior to transferring your residence to Portugal, from the date of issue of the vehicle registration document, or from the date on which the leasing contract was signed, as appropriate.

Importation Procedures
In order to import a vehicle, you should submit an application within six months of the date on which you transfer your residence to Portugal. The application should be made to your nearest Customs office.

The application should be submitted, together with:

a customs declaration relating to the vehicle
the vehicle’s registration certificate/logbook, as proof of ownership
your driver’s licence, valid for at least 12 months prior to the date on which you transferred your residence to Portugal
official residence certificate, issued by the competent authorities in the country of your former residence. If it is not possible to obtain this in your country of former residence, a certificate from the consulate is also acceptable. This will be issued once you have taken a statutory declaration and on presentation of your passport, tax-payer’s ID card, your residence certificate and vehicle registration document
documentary evidence of residence in the country from which you are transferring , such as rent receipts, utility bills, salary slips, proof of pension payments or national insurance contributions.
The Customs authority may request official translations of all documentary evidence.

A motor vehicle that has been imported in this way may not be sold, loaned, pledged or hired for a period of 12 months following the date on which the Portuguese registration number is attributed. In addition, in order to maintain eligibility for tax-free importation, you must continue to reside in Portugal for a minimum period of 12 months. Only one vehicle may be imported tax-free per person once every ten years.

If your application for tax-free importation is turned down, you will be notified by the Customs authority and have to declare to them, within a period of 30 days, what you intend to do with the vehicle. If you fail to do this, they will consider that the vehicle has been brought into Portugal illegally.

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Old 11th July 2011, 06:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by travelling-man View Post
My wife & I will be emigrating to Portugal in September.

I have a (registered) classic 4x4 here that has only done 120K kms since new, is easy to maintain because it has a simple engine without computers etc and is as reliable as most other cars. It also has all the things like air con etc and is very comfortable.

The car is left hand drive and so has limited resale value here in RSA & I reckon I'd only get about E35K for it here.

Assuming it costs about E2K (hopefully less) to ship over and bearing in mind I can import it into Portugal tax free, would I be better bringing it with me or is it a better idea to sell it here and buy something for about E5K over there...... and would E5K or so buy me a reasonably reliable vehicle?

I appreciate there's a hassle factor in getting it registered etc over there but I'd be willing to accept that if it'll save me money on purchase and also on lower insurance premiums as it's a classic.

FWIW, we'll be moving to central Portugal and hopefully will find somewhere slightly remote/without neighbours and I don't know if that might mean some dirt roads or not?

Also FWIW, If I do bring it, I'll probably then have a GLP conversion fitted to improve fuel consumption etc.
Hello

My view is that it's worth the hassle of bringing your own car over and going through the matriculation process if you can do so tax free. Cars are VERY expensive here and I doubt you'd be able to get anything that would withstand remote off road driving for €5K. This is a question that's asked a lot on these forums so if you do a search you'll find quite a lot of dicussion that should help you to come to an informed decision. Good luck!

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Old 11th July 2011, 06:24 PM
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€5,000 won't buy you very much. Maybe an 8 year old BMW 320d. I would look into matriculating your car, if you can get the parts for it here. Use an agent, it's worth it. I have one that I have used for friends, in the past, based in Caldas da Rainha, but she doesn't speak any English.

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Old 11th July 2011, 06:35 PM
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Great info but you should also check that you don't fall foul of 'type approval'.

You don't say whether its a make of vehicle that is currently distributed in Portugal, if it's not then you may have problems proving that it meets regulations.

This site explains (in English just as an example) and you should ask the question with customs here before you leave there as it may make a difference to the decision on whether to sell.

Type Approval for Cars

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Old 11th July 2011, 06:36 PM
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Thanks folks..... import rules for classic cars are easier than for others and emission standards etc are also considerably lower. The most important criteria seems to be that it has a FIVA registration and I've owned it more than a year and the car fulfills both of those.

I'd like very much to use an agent to help me with the import and registration etc but really need an English speaking one...... can anyone out there recommend such an agent please?

I think I should be able to get about as many spares there as I can here and if not, I can always order online from the States..... I sometimes have to do that here and it's not a problem at all.


Last edited by travelling-man; 11th July 2011 at 06:40 PM.
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Old 11th July 2011, 06:55 PM
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MrBife

According to the sites I've visited the FIVA registration document serves as type approval for vehicles over 25 years old and mine is 31 years, 7 months and 11 days old. The car is a 1980 Jeep Wagoneer/Cherokee/Laredo depending on the country you're in...... basically the same vehicle just different names and the engine is the good old AMC 5.7 V8...... a bit on the thirsty side but strong as hell and they go on forever.

Importing and Registering Classic Cars in Portugal

Classic cars can be driven freely into Portugal providing they are for personal, temporary use and have the necessary vehicle taxation, insurance, and documentation.

Those wishing to import a classic car permanently into Portugal may drive the car for four days before registering it with the customs (Alfândegas).

Vehicle tax (Imposto Automóvel) must be paid for all classic cars
Vehicles made before 1960 are taxed at a lower rate

Classic cars brought into Portugal on a permanent basis must meet the following legal requirements:

Be classified by the International Classic Car Federation (Fédération Internationale des Véhicule Anciens, FIVA)
Have a Classic Car Certificate (Certificado de Automóvel Antigo) from FIVA or ACP
Have a Technical Logbook/Manual (Ficha Técnica) from FIVA or other competent organisation
Have a colour photograph of the vehicle
Have a vehicle Logbook (Livrete) and Owner's Document (Título de Propridade) issued in the name of the owner/driver
Have the original and latest commercial purchase receipt (Factura Comercial)
Have an Authority to Circulate Document (Guia de Circulação) issued by Customs (Alfândegas)
Vehicles from the USA, Canada, South Africa, New Zealand, Australia, India or the UK must meet European Union homologation approval standards if the vehicle is less than 30 years old

Vehicles over 30 years old are classified as having cultural and historic interest to Portuguese State Heritage and do not need to undergo any kind of homologation adaptations.

As a European Union member state Portugal adheres to the Mutual Recognition Scheme which means that the IMTT needs to be sure that any vehicle imported into Portugal is suitable for use on Portuguese roads. The driver/owner must provide documentary evidence from FIVA or the manufacturer of any physical alterations made to the vehicle.
Import duty

A classic vehicle may be imported into Portugal tax-free provided:

The vehicle is for private use only
The registered owner of the vehicle is imported from another EU country where they have been resident for at least 185 days
The vehicle has been used by its registered owner in their former country for at least six months
DGV Certificate of Compliance Form Model 9 has been filled out and submitted to the DGV confirming the vehicle has undergone an inspection
The owner has submitted a copy of passport, driver's licence, residency (or application), tax details and number and at least three years' original tax returns
A certificate of cancellation of residence issued by the person's consulate

The Portuguese Classic Cars Club (Clube Português de Automóveis Antigos) has a lot of useful information (in Portuguese).



Last edited by travelling-man; 11th July 2011 at 06:59 PM.
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Old 11th July 2011, 06:55 PM
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You need to know which Port car will be imported to and where you intend to live, as you'd need to be a Registered Resident to import a vehicle, so you either need an agent in say Lisbon to act for you or where you intend to live.

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Old 11th July 2011, 07:28 PM
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Thanks for that..... It'll be imported via Lisbon and I'm hoping my moving company will have an agent there to handle it but if anyone can recommend anyone good, I'd be very grateful?

I'm a UK passport holder so have right of residency..... but do I need an address in Portugal before I can import the car and if so, could I use my friend's address in the Algarve as a temporary measure until I get settled?

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