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-   -   PRA Rules for homeowner (https://www.expatforum.com/expats/philippines-expat-forum/1502110-pra-rules-homeowner.html)

cereco 9th June 2020 08:48 AM

PRA Rules for homeowner
 
In 2017, I bought a new house and lot for cash, purchasing the lot in my Filipina partner's name and the house in my name.

We then got our attorney to draw up a 25 years lease between us, where I pay my partner PHP 3,000 per month to lease the lot from her.

I pay her a regular monthly allowance plus an extra PHP 3,000, to keep the contract legitimate.

When I applied for a PRA visa, I was told by the manager of the Angeles PRA office that the sum I was paying my partner was not enough to apply for a PRA visa, even though I paid PHP 3.45 million for the house allone.

She said I needed to create a new lease showing I was paying my partner the equivalent of $50,000 a year.

I think the PRA manager is wrong in her interpretation of the rules.

I was also shocked to be told that even if I did as she asked, they would still want to register a charge over the title deeds for me to get my $10,000 security deposit refunded.

Has anybody else bought a house (not a condominium) and (a) successfully applied for a PRA visa and (b) received their $10,000 deposit back?

Shadowman 9th June 2020 09:08 AM

I don't know the answer but you could turn your partner into a wife, then get a 13a Visa so you don't have to worry about these PRA Visa problems anymore.

bigpearl 9th June 2020 09:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cereco (Post 15113392)
In 2017, I bought a new house and lot for cash, purchasing the lot in my Filipina partner's name and the house in my name.

We then got our attorney to draw up a 25 years lease between us, where I pay my partner PHP 3,000 per month to lease the lot from her.

I pay her a regular monthly allowance plus an extra PHP 3,000, to keep the contract legitimate.

When I applied for a PRA visa, I was told by the manager of the Angeles PRA office that the sum I was paying my partner was not enough to apply for a PRA visa, even though I paid PHP 3.45 million for the house allone.

She said I needed to create a new lease showing I was paying my partner the equivalent of $50,000 a year.

I think the PRA manager is wrong in her interpretation of the rules.

I was also shocked to be told that even if I did as she asked, they would still want to register a charge over the title deeds for me to get my $10,000 security deposit refunded.

Has anybody else bought a house (not a condominium) and (a) successfully applied for a PRA visa and (b) received their $10,000 deposit back?

If you go down this path with the PRA to get your deposit released the lease as well as the title will have to be changed to include them on these documents (encumbered).
More cost and time and one I decided against.
If you search on here there is a lot of info that I and others have contributed in regards to your situation.

Cheers, Steve.

Hey_Joe 9th June 2020 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cereco (Post 15113392)
In 2017, I bought a new house and lot for cash, purchasing the lot in my Filipina partner's name and the house in my name.

We then got our attorney to draw up a 25 years lease between us, where I pay my partner PHP 3,000 per month to lease the lot from her.

I pay her a regular monthly allowance plus an extra PHP 3,000, to keep the contract legitimate.

When I applied for a PRA visa, I was told by the manager of the Angeles PRA office that the sum I was paying my partner was not enough to apply for a PRA visa, even though I paid PHP 3.45 million for the house allone.

She said I needed to create a new lease showing I was paying my partner the equivalent of $50,000 a year.

I think the PRA manager is wrong in her interpretation of the rules.

I was also shocked to be told that even if I did as she asked, they would still want to register a charge over the title deeds for me to get my $10,000 security deposit refunded.

Has anybody else bought a house (not a condominium) and (a) successfully applied for a PRA visa and (b) received their $10,000 deposit back?

Regarding: I paid PHP 3.45 million for the house alone.

Who paid for the lot and how much was it?

Regarding: I pay her a regular monthly allowance plus an extra PHP 3,000, per month to keep the contract legitimate.

P3k a month x 12months x 25 years is P900K, plus the monthly allowance? Why didn't you apply the 3.45 million as paid in full for that 25year lease and monthly allowance?

Additionally, although it's your partner, you could have the contract state that she must pay you for living in the house.

Did you consider what if clauses like if the relationship terminates, she is no longer permitted to live in the house, she can only inspect the lot on a monthly basis, or she must return the pre paid future rent on a pro rated basis (which will never happen) but it's additional leverage for you, etc. etc. You could have been creative.

You may consider acquiring the book of guidelines they are using on you, ask them to show you the law. I would change attorney's for who helped you write that contract. Do your own research, find the applicable laws. It will likely save you wheel barrels full of cash.

bigpearl 9th June 2020 01:34 PM

A couple of other things to add.
When you purchased the property did you have the title encumbered with a lien expressing your 25 year lease?
Is bequeathment and the ability to sell the lease written into it?
We also had written into the 25+25 year lease that the lessor was paid 5M pesos covering the full 50 years of lease which was what he used to purchase the land, this was also written into the sale contract and deed of sale.
Additionally it was clearly stated in the contracts the breakup cost of the lot in my better half's name and then the house, buildings and improvements (in my name)

Another thing I'm not clear on, others may know. firstly you cannot under Filipino law lease from your wife/husband as you are considered the same entity.
So while she is your partner that's probably fine but what happens to the lease legally if you marry your partner? Just a thought.

For myself and only what I am going to do is stay here on a tourist visa, when I decide to draw a pension from my superannuation in a few years I will then kiss US 10K away until my demise and my better half can haggle with them to get it back. 6 to 12 month procedure I believe.

Always here in this country, while you hope to have everything covered never be surprised if you lose the whole lot, fingers crossed but one never knows.

Cheers, Steve.

Hey_Joe 9th June 2020 09:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigpearl (Post 15113566)
A couple of other things to add.
When you purchased the property did you have the title encumbered with a lien expressing your 25 year lease?.

Excellent, very important addition. He can still add the current or an amended lease after the purchase to the title.

M.C.A. 9th June 2020 11:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cereco (Post 15113392)
In 2017, I bought a new house and lot for cash, purchasing the lot in my Filipina partner's name and the house in my name.

We then got our attorney to draw up a 25 years lease between us, where I pay my partner PHP 3,000 per month to lease the lot from her.

I pay her a regular monthly allowance plus an extra PHP 3,000, to keep the contract legitimate.

When I applied for a PRA visa, I was told by the manager of the Angeles PRA office that the sum I was paying my partner was not enough to apply for a PRA visa, even though I paid PHP 3.45 million for the house allone.

She said I needed to create a new lease showing I was paying my partner the equivalent of $50,000 a year.

I think the PRA manager is wrong in her interpretation of the rules.

I was also shocked to be told that even if I did as she asked, they would still want to register a charge over the title deeds for me to get my $10,000 security deposit refunded.

Has anybody else bought a house (not a condominium) and (a) successfully applied for a PRA visa and (b) received their $10,000 deposit back?

Welcome to the forum Cereco and what a first posting and a mess I don't think anyone of us would want to be in, so I hope you still have a nest egg to fall upon if all goes sour.

Hopefully you can work out the details because it's gonna get tougher to live in the Philippines and to make matters worse a long wait to come back here on a tourist visa. So far I haven't heard too many good stories from fellow expats trying to own homes on a SRRV. There's a man from the UK living on the island of Mindoro that is extremely knowledgeable with legalities and owning property here you might want to message him, his name is Sean and you can find him with search on YouTube by BADLADZ Beach & Dive Resort. :fingerscrossed:

Gary D 10th June 2020 05:25 AM

Isn't buying a house then going for an SRRV putting the cart before the horse.

Manitoba 10th June 2020 05:44 AM

I was always under the impression that you needed to pre-pay the complete long term lease amount up front to qualify as an SRRV lease.

Otherwise what's to stop someone from doing that, not making a deposit and then if they tire of the Philippines, just walking (or flying) away from their obligations here? If the lease is prepaid, you will lose your lease amount, if you have a deposit you will lose your deposit ( at least for a while until the lien on the lease can be lifted or the deposit released)

Tukaram 10th June 2020 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gary D (Post 15113932)
Isn't buying a house then going for an SRRV putting the cart before the horse.

Yeah, I think so too. Everything I have seen says to go to PRA before getting a house/condo. Getting it first seems to complicate matters a lot, especially if it does not qualify.


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