How to Start a Partnership

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How to Start a Partnership


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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 6th June 2013, 11:44 PM
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Hello,

I have been in a relationship with a New Zealand resident for the past 2 years. I have been to NZ 5 times since meeting him for a total stay of approximately 11 months intermittently. We love each other and are engaged to be married

I want to live with him in a partnership in NZ. The issue is that in order to obtain a Partnership Based Visa, we have to be living in a de facto partnership at the time the application for the Visa is made So I have to be physically in NZ to apply for such a Visa.

The only time I have "lived" with him is during my visits to NZ and I doubt that time can be counted as living together in a partnership.

I am retired and do not wish to work. I also have no interest in studying in NZ. I just want to be able to start a life with my Love. My fiance and I want to get married, but we are going to hold off to ensure that I can remain in NZ. He can't come to Canada so there is no possibility for him to relocate here with me.

I did contact INZ previously with my dilemma. I didn't get much advice. I was told that I could apply for a regular Visitor Visa to come to NZ (usually it is granted for 6 months initially) and then apply for a partnership Work Visa while in NZ to be able to remain there and live with my fiance.

I mentioned that if I did that I would not be considered a "bona fide" visitor and it would appear as deceptive... The Immigration Officer paused and then stated that "circumstances can change after you arrive in NZ, it happens all the time".

I would like to be able to go to NZ on a proper Visa in order to be able to start a partnership with my fiance BEFORE I leave Canada. I would have to give a notice for my rental unit, place my furniture in storage, etc., (lots to do before leaving). So I want to ensure that I can remain in NZ for some time to meet the 12 months of living together in a partnership before applying for residence BEFORE leaving Canada.

There are no provisions for people in my position it seems

Australian has what is called a "Fiance Visa" where the applicant has to get married within that 9 months and then they get a Visa for at least two years to stay in Australia with their new spouse. I wish INZ had the same thing...

Does the time I spent living with my fiance when I visited count towards "living together in a partnership"? We do have a rental agreement in both our names as I paid the bond for it in 2011...

Has anyone ever been in such a situation or does anyone have any advice to offer? Anything at all would be much appreciated! Thanks!

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Old 7th June 2013, 10:44 AM
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Hello,

I have been in a relationship with a New Zealand resident for the past 2 years. I have been to NZ 5 times since meeting him for a total stay of approximately 11 months intermittently. We love each other and are engaged to be married

I want to live with him in a partnership in NZ. The issue is that in order to obtain a Partnership Based Visa, we have to be living in a de facto partnership at the time the application for the Visa is made So I have to be physically in NZ to apply for such a Visa.

The only time I have "lived" with him is during my visits to NZ and I doubt that time can be counted as living together in a partnership.

I am retired and do not wish to work. I also have no interest in studying in NZ. I just want to be able to start a life with my Love. My fiance and I want to get married, but we are going to hold off to ensure that I can remain in NZ. He can't come to Canada so there is no possibility for him to relocate here with me.

I did contact INZ previously with my dilemma. I didn't get much advice. I was told that I could apply for a regular Visitor Visa to come to NZ (usually it is granted for 6 months initially) and then apply for a partnership Work Visa while in NZ to be able to remain there and live with my fiance.

I mentioned that if I did that I would not be considered a "bona fide" visitor and it would appear as deceptive... The Immigration Officer paused and then stated that "circumstances can change after you arrive in NZ, it happens all the time".

I would like to be able to go to NZ on a proper Visa in order to be able to start a partnership with my fiance BEFORE I leave Canada. I would have to give a notice for my rental unit, place my furniture in storage, etc., (lots to do before leaving). So I want to ensure that I can remain in NZ for some time to meet the 12 months of living together in a partnership before applying for residence BEFORE leaving Canada.

There are no provisions for people in my position it seems

Australian has what is called a "Fiance Visa" where the applicant has to get married within that 9 months and then they get a Visa for at least two years to stay in Australia with their new spouse. I wish INZ had the same thing...

Does the time I spent living with my fiance when I visited count towards "living together in a partnership"? We do have a rental agreement in both our names as I paid the bond for it in 2011...

Has anyone ever been in such a situation or does anyone have any advice to offer? Anything at all would be much appreciated! Thanks!
Hi,
Yes you do seem to be in a bit of a predicament.

So your intention would be to apply under the Family Partnership Category for a Residency class visa, which would be the sensible option.

First of all what about your fiancÚ ?
You say he's been in NZ for 2 years and is a Resident.
How did he come to be here in NZ....Was he the Principal Applicant on his own Residency Visa application, or did he have secondary applicants on there - maybe an ex partner etc, or was he a
Secondary Applicant himself ?
If you are to obtain the visa he must support your application and he must himself be eligible to support you - example....if he came here as the Principal Applicant with an ex partner and they've since split up, he's already got someone in as a Resident and now won't be eligible to assist someone else for a period of 5 years!

As you say the deciding factor is the relationship or partnership evidence.

http://www.immigration.govt.nz/migra...artnership.htm

Unsure where you have info from stating you have to be in NZ to apply ?
You can be outside of NZ to apply for this visa type.
I know it's more difficult to justify having a long distance relationship, but it is still a relationship and if you can prove it has commitment even with many miles between you then it satisfies the criteria.
I'm sure the time you have spent living together in NZ when you visited counts towards this committed relationship and hopefully you have evidence of your time together......photos, trips you have been on together, joint bills etc etc
Just be honest in your application, inform them of the periods spent apart and the reasons for this and maintain that even though there have been many miles between you on occasion it has still been a committed relationship.

Good luck
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Old 7th June 2013, 02:21 PM
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Thank you so much escapedtonz...

My fiance has been a resident of NZ for 35 years after coming here as a child with his mother. He is an Australian citizen, but has lived in NZ all this time, so there are no issues whatsoever for him meeting the sponsorship requirements. I am sorry I wasn't clear on that.

We both have been in a relationship for over 2 years now and that is when I started coming to NZ regularly to visit him, so we have been in a committed relationship for over 2 years.

I was told by the Immigration Officer that I had to physically be in NZ to apply for Partnership Visas. I have read the INZ Admin manual and it appears to say the same thing in the sense that we have to be in a de facto relationship to apply for such Visas. I guess if I can count the times of living with him when visiting as being in a de facto relationship then I could potentially apply for Partnership Visas out of NZ? It is so not clear to me and I found that INZ offers very little information when I have called them. It seems they don't know what to tell me or don't want to provide any information, so it is a frustrating process to say the least

The other concern I have is if I count the time as "living" with him when visiting, wouldn't that indicate deception since I was on a Visitor Visa at the times of my visits to NZ?

I would never lie to INZ and will be 150% honest as I have been throughout this process. I want my relationship with this wonderful man to continue and I will never jeopardize it. If I can't come to NZ and be with him, we won't be able to stay together I can't and don't even want to think about that at all....

We both meet all the requirements so there are no issues there...

Also as proof of our relationship, since I didn't keep copies of my plane tickets, wouldn't INZ have proof of my visits to NZ since I had to fill out arrival and departure cards when arriving and leaving NZ or must I provide copies of plane tickets to prove my visits there? I indicated my fiance's name and address as who I was visiting. Also how many screen shots of Facebook and Skype messages must I provide to prove daily communication between the two of us while apart? I have literally tons of them and I can't add them all so I am wondering how much should I provide? A couple for each month or several screenshots for every 3 days or one screenshot daily?

Again thank you so much for your response! I really appreciate it!

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Old 7th June 2013, 06:16 PM
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Originally Posted by moving for love View Post
....I did contact INZ previously with my dilemma. I didn't get much advice. I was told that I could apply for a regular Visitor Visa to come to NZ (usually it is granted for 6 months initially) and then apply for a partnership Work Visa while in NZ to be able to remain there and live with my fiance.

I mentioned that if I did that I would not be considered a "bona fide" visitor and it would appear as deceptive... The Immigration Officer paused and then stated that "circumstances can change after you arrive in NZ, it happens all the time"....
It seems to me that you spoke to a really nice immigration agent! There probably isn't an easy 'bona fide' way of you following all the rules - but our experience is that NZ culture in general allows for rules to be bent very slightly in certain circumstances (and I don't mean in the same 'bent' way that some corrupt cultures mean!)
IMHO he was suggesting as strongly as he wasn't allowed to how you might overcome your dilemma.

So - gather as much proof of your long-term relationship as possible. Photos, emails, letters, anything! Can you get 'references' to the fact from friends and acquaintances who know how long you've been coming over for? When you're here can you think of any joint things you've attended that might have your names on them? Any wedding invites for example...
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Old 7th June 2013, 08:33 PM
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Thank you Top Cat!

The immigration Officer was quite nice... She tried to help me but again, I guess they are limited on what they can say without seeming to offer advice!

I've ALWAYS done everything by the book. I find that there really are no provisions for migrants in my category

It appears as though I could count the time I have lived with my fiance while visiting him in NZ as being in a de facto relationship? Is that correct? Like I mentioned previously, we do have a tenancy agreement in both our names since September 2011. I have been paying for the Sky bill since June 2011...

We can definitely get letters from his friends in NZ confirming how long we have been in our relationship. He hasn't met my friends so I wouldn't be able to obtain letters from them except for what they have seen on Facebook. I wonder if INZ would consider posts from these online friends to confirm our relationship?

Also, my doctor has made notations from what I have told her about my relationship with my fiance. Would a letter confirming it from her be beneficial?

What about letters from family members? I have Skyped with my siblings and parents when in NZ and they met my fiance this way. Would letters from them be helpful?

I know, according to the INZ website, that letters from Government Officials have more substance than from friends and family.

I have been taking screen shots of numerous Facebook posts proving the length of our relationship and how we have maintained contact, etc, during times apart, including Skype entries (although the history only goes back one year)

I am pretty sure all this evidence can only assist us I have so much of it...

*****IMPORTANT QUESTION*****

Can I therefore apply for a Partnership Visa to go to NZ before I leave Canada?
[B]There isn't a requirement to be in NZ when I apply?

Thanks again!

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Old 8th June 2013, 01:25 AM
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"If you have been living together for less than 12 months, initially we can only grant you a work visa for up to 12 months. Later you can apply for a further work visa for a total stay of up to two years (including the time already granted on your initial partnership work visa) if:
you and your partner want to stay longer in New Zealand and can show us that you are still in a genuine and stable relationship, or
you apply for residence as a partner.
You can find information about applying for a residence class visa under our Partnership residence category section."

http://www.immigration.govt.nz/migra...milystream.htm
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Old 8th June 2013, 01:34 AM
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Originally Posted by moving for love View Post
Thank you Top Cat!

The immigration Officer was quite nice... She tried to help me but again, I guess they are limited on what they can say without seeming to offer advice!

I've ALWAYS done everything by the book. I find that there really are no provisions for migrants in my category

It appears as though I could count the time I have lived with my fiance while visiting him in NZ as being in a de facto relationship? Is that correct? Like I mentioned previously, we do have a tenancy agreement in both our names since September 2011. I have been paying for the Sky bill since June 2011...

We can definitely get letters from his friends in NZ confirming how long we have been in our relationship. He hasn't met my friends so I wouldn't be able to obtain letters from them except for what they have seen on Facebook. I wonder if INZ would consider posts from these online friends to confirm our relationship?

Also, my doctor has made notations from what I have told her about my relationship with my fiance. Would a letter confirming it from her be beneficial?

What about letters from family members? I have Skyped with my siblings and parents when in NZ and they met my fiance this way. Would letters from them be helpful?

I know, according to the INZ website, that letters from Government Officials have more substance than from friends and family.

I have been taking screen shots of numerous Facebook posts proving the length of our relationship and how we have maintained contact, etc, during times apart, including Skype entries (although the history only goes back one year)

I am pretty sure all this evidence can only assist us I have so much of it...

*****IMPORTANT QUESTION*****

Can I therefore apply for a Partnership Visa to go to NZ before I leave Canada? There isn't a requirement to be in NZ when I apply?

Thanks again!
Hi,
I've had a really good look through the Immigration NZ website and I can't find anything that states you must be in NZ to apply for Partnership Residency Visa.
Even looking at the notes which provide confirmation of partner, partnership, relationship etc.
None of them mention that you must be living together in NZ at application ?

I'm sure you should be able to count the time living together in NZ (whilst here as a visitor) towards the relationship evidence and also the time spent separated - as you were still in a relationship, but long distance. You just have to make Immigration understand your reasons for being separated and how you maintained the relationship whilst separated.

Any evidence letters you can get will count towards your relationship claim. It's always better to get as much info and evidence as possible. Way too much is better than not enough!

I would say yes, you can apply for the partnership based visa from Canada.

Why don't you try the application and see what Immigration come back with and cross the bridge if and when any issues or questions come back.
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Old 8th June 2013, 06:13 AM
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For my situation, it would be more difficult to prove since in the 2 years that I have been with my fiance, I have spent more time living in Canada then with him....

b. Factors that have a bearing on whether two people are living together in a partnership that is genuine and stable include but are not limited to:
i the duration of the parties relationship; (Over 2 years)
i the existence, nature, and extent of the parties' common residence;
(Tenancy agreement in both our names since September 2011)
iii the degree of financial dependence or interdependence, and any arrangements for financial support, between the parties; (None)
iv the common ownership, use, and acquisition of property by the parties; (I purchased furniture)
v the degree of commitment of the parties to a shared life; (Proved by number of visits and desire to live together)
vi children of the partnership, including the common care and support of such children by the parties; (No children)
vii the performance of common household duties by the partners; (We do share that when I visit)
and viii the reputation and public aspects of the relationship. (Well known by everyone who knows us)

F2.20.15 Evidence of living together in partnership that is genuine and stable
a. Evidence that the principal applicant and partner are living together may include but is not limited to original or certified copies of documents showing shared accommodation such as:
i joint ownership of residential property
(No)
ii joint tenancy agreement or rent book or rental receipts (We have a joint tenancy agreement since September 2011 but my fiance pays solely for it as I have my own to pay in Canada)
iii correspondence (including postmarked envelopes) addressed to both principal applicant and partner at the same address. (I have the Sky bill in my name mailed to the Address in NZ that I pay monthly)
b. If a couple has been living separately for any period during their partnership, they should provide evidence of the length of the periods of separation, the reasons for them, and how their relationship was maintained during the periods of separation, such as letters, itemised telephone accounts or e-mail messages. (Lots to provide here!)
c. Evidence about whether the partnership is genuine and stable may include but is not limited to, original or certified copies of documents and any other information such as:
i a marriage certificate for the parties;
(Not yet)
ii a civil union certificate for the parties; (No)
iii birth certificates of any children of the parties; (None)
iv evidence of communication between the parties; (Lots)
v photographs of the parties together; (Lots)
vi documents indicating public recognition of the partnership;( (From friends and family)
vii evidence of the parties being committed to each other both emotionally and exclusively such as evidence of:
 joint decision making and plans together
(We've been making plans for 2 years now but I don't know how to prove this)
 sharing of parental obligations (No)
 sharing of household activities (Cooking, cleaning, shopping, etc only when I am there)
 sharing of companionship/spare time (Even apart, we spend a lot of time on Skype)
 sharing of leisure and social activities (Only when we are together)
 presentation by the parties to outsiders as a couple (Absolutely)
viii evidence of being financially interdependent such as evidence of
 shared income
(No)
 joint bank accounts operated reasonably frequently over a reasonable time (No)
 joint assets (No)
 joint liabilities such as loans or credit to purchase real estate, cars, major home
appliances
(No)
 joint utilities accounts (electricity, gas, water, telephone) (No)
 mutually agreed financial arrangements. (No)
d. The presence or absence of any of the documents, information or evidence listed above is not determinative. Each case will be decided on the basis of all the evidence provided. Evidence about these matters may also be obtained at interview and can be considered up until the date of final decision.
[/COLOR]

I still reside in Canada so financially, I can't provide at all except when I am in NZ. I pay for groceries, and he pays for the rent. But otherwise, I can't provide until I am living there for good...

And I can only count the time living with him from the date of the joint Tenancy Agreement in September 2011 so basically, we "lived together" for approximately 7 1/2 months total... Although I visited him for approximately 4 1/2 months previously, but we had no joint Tenancy Agreement.

I apologize for the length of my posts... I want to ensure that I provide all the required information before proceeding with my application and if anyone has anything to add to assist me, it would be much appreciated!

And I did have a look again at the INZ Ops Manual... I don't have to apply in NZ for such Visas, but I have to be in a partnership so I assumed that I would need to be present since we have not lived together for more than 12 months. Also the Immigration Officer told me that I had to be in NZ when applying for the Partnership Work Visa. I did ask her specifically because I wanted to make a request BEFORE leaving Canada to ensure a stay of a specific time and not be obligated to leave NZ within 3 months, and she confirmed without a doubt that I had to be physically present in NZ.... I am not sure what the answer is now

Thank you again to everyone who has offered me information!

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Old 8th June 2013, 07:56 AM
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Originally Posted by moving for love View Post
For my situation, it would be more difficult to prove since in the 2 years that I have been with my fiance, I have spent more time living in Canada then with him....

b. Factors that have a bearing on whether two people are living together in a partnership that is genuine and stable include but are not limited to:
i the duration of the parties relationship; (Over 2 years)
i the existence, nature, and extent of the parties' common residence; (Tenancy agreement in both our names since September 2011)
iii the degree of financial dependence or interdependence, and any arrangements for financial support, between the parties; (None)
iv the common ownership, use, and acquisition of property by the parties; (I purchased furniture)
v the degree of commitment of the parties to a shared life; (Proved by number of visits and desire to live together)
vi children of the partnership, including the common care and support of such children by the parties; (No children)
vii the performance of common household duties by the partners; (We do share that when I visit)
and viii the reputation and public aspects of the relationship. (Well known by everyone who knows us)

F2.20.15 Evidence of living together in partnership that is genuine and stable
a. Evidence that the principal applicant and partner are living together may include but is not limited to original or certified copies of documents showing shared accommodation such as:
i joint ownership of residential property (No)
ii joint tenancy agreement or rent book or rental receipts (We have a joint tenancy agreement since September 2011 but my fiance pays solely for it as I have my own to pay in Canada)
iii correspondence (including postmarked envelopes) addressed to both principal applicant and partner at the same address. (I have the Sky bill in my name mailed to the Address in NZ that I pay monthly)
b. If a couple has been living separately for any period during their partnership, they should provide evidence of the length of the periods of separation, the reasons for them, and how their relationship was maintained during the periods of separation, such as letters, itemised telephone accounts or e-mail messages. (Lots to provide here!)
c. Evidence about whether the partnership is genuine and stable may include but is not limited to, original or certified copies of documents and any other information such as:
i a marriage certificate for the parties; (Not yet)
ii a civil union certificate for the parties; (No)
iii birth certificates of any children of the parties; (None)
iv evidence of communication between the parties; (Lots)
v photographs of the parties together; (Lots)
vi documents indicating public recognition of the partnership;( (From friends and family)
vii evidence of the parties being committed to each other both emotionally and exclusively such as evidence of:
 joint decision making and plans together (We've been making plans for 2 years now but I don't know how to prove this)
 sharing of parental obligations (No)
 sharing of household activities (Cooking, cleaning, shopping, etc only when I am there)
 sharing of companionship/spare time (Even apart, we spend a lot of time on Skype)
 sharing of leisure and social activities (Only when we are together)
 presentation by the parties to outsiders as a couple (Absolutely)
viii evidence of being financially interdependent such as evidence of
 shared income (No)
 joint bank accounts operated reasonably frequently over a reasonable time (No)
 joint assets (No)
 joint liabilities such as loans or credit to purchase real estate, cars, major home
appliances (No)
 joint utilities accounts (electricity, gas, water, telephone) (No)
 mutually agreed financial arrangements. (No)
d. The presence or absence of any of the documents, information or evidence listed above is not determinative. Each case will be decided on the basis of all the evidence provided. Evidence about these matters may also be obtained at interview and can be considered up until the date of final decision.


I still reside in Canada so financially, I can't provide at all except when I am in NZ. I pay for groceries, and he pays for the rent. But otherwise, I can't provide until I am living there for good...

And I can only count the time living with him from the date of the joint Tenancy Agreement in September 2011 so basically, we "lived together" for approximately 7 1/2 months total... Although I visited him for approximately 4 1/2 months previously, but we had no joint Tenancy Agreement.

I apologize for the length of my posts... I want to ensure that I provide all the required information before proceeding with my application and if anyone has anything to add to assist me, it would be much appreciated!

And I did have a look again at the INZ Ops Manual... I don't have to apply in NZ for such Visas, but I have to be in a partnership so I assumed that I would need to be present since we have not lived together for more than 12 months. Also the Immigration Officer told me that I had to be in NZ when applying for the Partnership Work Visa. I did ask her specifically because I wanted to make a request BEFORE leaving Canada to ensure a stay of a specific time and not be obligated to leave NZ within 3 months, and she confirmed without a doubt that I had to be physically present in NZ.... I am not sure what the answer is now

Thank you again to everyone who has offered me information!
Hi,

How about trying another way. Instead of trying to get Residency under the family partnership category, why don't you apply for a visitor visa specifically to join your partner in NZ ?

See attached link :-

http://www.immigration.govt.nz/NR/rd.../0/INZ1198.pdf

This shouldn't be an issue and will get you into the country on a temporary basis specifically to visit your partner.
You wouldn't be seen to be pulling the wool over Immigrations eyes being here as a visitor as the whole reason for this visa is to come to NZ to be with your partner.
Whilst here and after some time you could then apply for the Partnership Residency visa. Allows you to have more time living together and allows you to apply whilst you are both in NZ living together:
You will also find the assistance from Immigration to be more helpful and more personal as the officers here just aren't in as much demand from their customers as in other countries.

I understand its not straightforward, but its definitely a possibility.

Have a read through the whole application form and look at the supporting application guide to see if this route could be better for you ?

Regards,

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Old 8th June 2013, 04:25 PM
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Thank you very much Escapedtonz! You have been very helpful!

I was considering applying for a Partnership Visitor Visa, but I can only be in NZ for 9 months out of 18 months. Without getting into specifics, I can only go to NZ on this PVV (if granted) after 2013 since the amount of time I have been in NZ before this date would add up to more than 9 months out of 18 months

Again, it means waiting longer and not visiting NZ until 2014 to have at least 6 months on this PPV I am willing to do that but again, it gets more difficult into proving that my fiance and I are "living together in a partnership". Furthermore, the application clearly stipulates that we MUST be living in a genuine and stable partnership which again means we have to be living together. If INZ does not take into consideration the time I have spent with my fiance on my visits to NZ as "living together", we have therefore not lived together at all

I do not want to have any Visa I apply for declined, as applications for further Visas may be compromised if I was ever declined for a Visa.

I have to ensure that I do all this correctly so as not to jeopardize my chances of being able to live with my fiance. Again, if I can't move to NZ, since he cannot move to Canada, we can't be together. I love this man with all my heart and I want to be with him just as he wants to be with me. We've been doing this long distance relationship thing for over 2 years and every time I visit and leave, it just gets much more harder for both of us. If I could be living with him in NZ tomorrow, I would be there! These visits are proving to be very costly as I still have a place to pay for in Canada when visiting on top of the cost of airfare and everything else while in NZ

INZ is not clear and has no provisions for people in our positions unfortunately. It would be great if INZ would confirm that time visiting a loved one could count as "living together" in a partnership for people like me who meet a NZ citizen/resident while residing out of country. We can only be together when I visit... So how can we prove a partnership if the only time spent together was when I was visiting him. INZ really needs to do like Australia and get a "Fiance Visa" to allow people in my position at least 9 months to be able to live with their partner and then be able to marry and stay in the country longer.

Again, I am just sharing all the information I can. I have looked through INZ meticulously, over and over again, and it appears as though my only possible option is to request a regular Visitor Visa for 6 months, go and visit legitimately my fiance then after a few months while I am there, make application for a Partnership Work Visa to stay there at least for 12 months to meet the partnership criteria in order to apply for residency. That's what the Immigration Officer was inclining to suggest without spelling it out. And as I mentioned earlier, I do not wish to work and when I mentioned that to the Immigration Officer, she said that I didn't have to work on this Partnership Work Visa since the purpose of it is to be able to live with my fiance. Then I asked why couldn't I request the Partnership Visitor Visa and that's when I was told about the 9 months out of 18 months (I already was aware of it through reading INZ policies)...

So thank you EscapedtoNZ!!! I appreciate your input tremendously!

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