What has Trump got?

Go Back   Expat Forum For People Moving Overseas And Living Abroad > Europe > France Expat Forum for Expats Living in France > Le Bistro

Le Bistro This new forum is for socialising, networking and off topic discussions for all members either living in or moving to France.

Like Tree24Likes

What has Trump got?


Reply
 
Subscribe to this Thread Thread Tools
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 3rd March 2016, 07:15 AM
DejW's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Mountains - Pyrénées Orientales
Posts: 4,607
Rep Power: 1823
DejW has a reputation beyond reputeDejW has a reputation beyond reputeDejW has a reputation beyond reputeDejW has a reputation beyond reputeDejW has a reputation beyond reputeDejW has a reputation beyond reputeDejW has a reputation beyond reputeDejW has a reputation beyond reputeDejW has a reputation beyond reputeDejW has a reputation beyond reputeDejW has a reputation beyond repute
1784 likes received
1681 likes given

Users Flag! Originally from england. Users Flag! Expat in france.
Default What has Trump got?

I do not intend this thread to be a discussion of US politics. Certainly I am not sufficiently knowledgeable to make added value comments on the arguments involved.

However, I'm fascinated by the rise of the candidate Donald Trump. He seems to have found a way to attract votes. In theory he does not have a chance..
  • He's an outsider to US politics
  • He's never been voted into public office
  • He makes "text book" errors in his speeches - insults his electorate, makes clearly impossible promises (make Mexico pay for a wall etc).
  • He lacks coherent policies for the economy, foreign affairs etc.

However, the evidence is that he finds a way to gather votes in the primary elections, and it looks as if he will obtain his party nomination. Whether we like Trump and his policies/ techniques or not, we cannot ignore his rise in the democratic electoral system.

So far as I can see, Trump's appeal is his claim that he tells people "like it is". For many US people this is a refreshing change from the past (both Democrat and Republican governments).

So, what is it that Trump does to get into his successful position? Would an EU version of Trump blow a hole in the non democratic processes in Europe? All the EU politicians seem to be glued to the status quo?

Off we go........DejW

Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 3rd March 2016, 07:20 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: France
Posts: 2,027
Rep Power: 0
VERITE is on a distinguished road
1063 likes received
499 likes given

Users Flag! Originally from england. Users Flag! Expat in france.
Default

$$$$$$$$$?

Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 3rd March 2016, 07:23 AM
DejW's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Mountains - Pyrénées Orientales
Posts: 4,607
Rep Power: 1823
DejW has a reputation beyond reputeDejW has a reputation beyond reputeDejW has a reputation beyond reputeDejW has a reputation beyond reputeDejW has a reputation beyond reputeDejW has a reputation beyond reputeDejW has a reputation beyond reputeDejW has a reputation beyond reputeDejW has a reputation beyond reputeDejW has a reputation beyond reputeDejW has a reputation beyond repute
1784 likes received
1681 likes given

Users Flag! Originally from england. Users Flag! Expat in france.
Default

Well, yes! He's got lots of them, plus unending energy. But lots of other people do too.

He's got something, or he would have fallen at the first primary?

DejW

Quote:
Originally Posted by VERITE View Post
$$$$$$$$$?

Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 3rd March 2016, 07:33 AM
Bevdeforges's Avatar
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: deepest, darkest Essonne
Posts: 45,809
Rep Power: 23252
Bevdeforges has a reputation beyond reputeBevdeforges has a reputation beyond reputeBevdeforges has a reputation beyond reputeBevdeforges has a reputation beyond reputeBevdeforges has a reputation beyond reputeBevdeforges has a reputation beyond reputeBevdeforges has a reputation beyond reputeBevdeforges has a reputation beyond reputeBevdeforges has a reputation beyond reputeBevdeforges has a reputation beyond reputeBevdeforges has a reputation beyond repute
9523 likes received
1261 likes given

Users Flag! Originally from usa. Users Flag! Expat in france.
Default

Basically, the "EU" has already had its version of Trump, back in the 1930s - and yes, the comparisons have all been made already, not only to the obvious German candidate, but more explicitly to the Italian guy from back then. We all know how those turned out.

Americans have been raised with the myth that "any little boy can grow up to become President of the United States" and so they don't really require much in terms of experience or specific training from their candidates, never mind coherent policies or programs. Bluff, bluster and showmanship, plus outrageous wealth, seem to be enough.

Unfortunately, Hillary is a flawed candidate, and there are many, many folks out there who swear they will "never" vote for her, no matter who her opponent may be. If these folks stay home on election day, the US is in deep, deep excrement. And if Bernie were somehow to pull a rabbit out of a hat here, you'd have the same phenomenon - people who would just stay home rather than to vote for an avowed "socialist."

Hang on, we're in for a bumpy flight...
Cheers,
Bev
DejW, Cunégonde and jrendon like this.

Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 3rd March 2016, 08:12 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Asnières-sur-Seine
Posts: 480
Rep Power: 0
Cunégonde is on a distinguished road
212 likes received
156 likes given

Users Flag! Originally from usa. Users Flag! Expat in france.
Default

He uses tactics very similar to those of the Front National--exploit the very real and relevant economic concerns of economically disadvantaged, minimally-educated (I say this in a demographic sense, not in a intellectual snobbery sense) people in areas with little ethnic diversity. Lack of political doublespeak, even if it's to spew fascist hatred, really resonates with people who feel cheated by economic collapse, its consequences, and who have a limited understanding of how change can really be affected in a way that would benefit the maximum amount of people.

It makes me so angry how easily people can be convinced to vote against their best interests. It's pure exploitation.

Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 3rd March 2016, 08:42 AM
Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Pau
Posts: 14,046
Rep Power: 4554
EverHopeful has a reputation beyond reputeEverHopeful has a reputation beyond reputeEverHopeful has a reputation beyond reputeEverHopeful has a reputation beyond reputeEverHopeful has a reputation beyond reputeEverHopeful has a reputation beyond reputeEverHopeful has a reputation beyond reputeEverHopeful has a reputation beyond reputeEverHopeful has a reputation beyond reputeEverHopeful has a reputation beyond reputeEverHopeful has a reputation beyond repute
5401 likes received
8934 likes given

Users Flag! Originally from australia. Users Flag! Expat in france.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cunégonde View Post
He uses tactics very similar to those of the Front National--exploit the very real and relevant economic concerns of economically disadvantaged, minimally-educated (I say this in a demographic sense, not in a intellectual snobbery sense) people in areas with little ethnic diversity. Lack of political doublespeak, even if it's to spew fascist hatred, really resonates with people who feel cheated by economic collapse, its consequences, and who have a limited understanding of how change can really be affected in a way that would benefit the maximum amount of people.

It makes me so angry how easily people can be convinced to vote against their best interests. It's pure exploitation.
I agree, except that the FN does well in areas with ethnic diversity where they fire up racial hatred - that phenomenon could also occur in the US Interestingly, Trump and the FN play pretty much the same political game where truth has no real role and even outright lies go down well with many of the voting public

This phenomenon is not limited to the US or Europe, it seems to me that it's pretty much the case throughout the western democratic world.

As for having no political experience, there's nothing new in that in the US. Although I guess you could say that if you win the primaries you have just gained one heck of a lot of political experience, at least in terms of election campaigning, speech making, press interviews, etc. Though that alone certainly does not qualify anyone to run a country as powerful as the US.

What Trump does have is a high public profile and the important thing that he doesn't have is a failed or poor track record in politics (as part of either government or opposition).
Cunégonde likes this.

Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 3rd March 2016, 08:43 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: France
Posts: 2,027
Rep Power: 0
VERITE is on a distinguished road
1063 likes received
499 likes given

Users Flag! Originally from england. Users Flag! Expat in france.
Default

He is so outrageous that I don't think he was taken seriously even by his own party who are now waking up to the fact that it's too late to do much about it.

It will be interesting to see what if any tactics they may now use to stop his ascension in order to avoid handing the election to Hilary on a plate.

Unless of course...
Diane2263 likes this.

Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 3rd March 2016, 09:17 AM
Bevdeforges's Avatar
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: deepest, darkest Essonne
Posts: 45,809
Rep Power: 23252
Bevdeforges has a reputation beyond reputeBevdeforges has a reputation beyond reputeBevdeforges has a reputation beyond reputeBevdeforges has a reputation beyond reputeBevdeforges has a reputation beyond reputeBevdeforges has a reputation beyond reputeBevdeforges has a reputation beyond reputeBevdeforges has a reputation beyond reputeBevdeforges has a reputation beyond reputeBevdeforges has a reputation beyond reputeBevdeforges has a reputation beyond repute
9523 likes received
1261 likes given

Users Flag! Originally from usa. Users Flag! Expat in france.
Default

Quote:
exploit the very real and relevant economic concerns of economically disadvantaged, minimally-educated (I say this in a demographic sense, not in a intellectual snobbery sense) people in areas with little ethnic diversity.
Not sure if it's still the case here, but at one point I saw an analysis that said, in France, the Front actually does best in areas with no immigrants. I suppose it plays to the fears about "it could happen here" - whereas those who live in more integrated areas realize that folks is folks.

Unfortunately, the US has a long history of tricksters, hucksters and con artists - in politics and all other walks of life. I keep thinking of the musical The Music Man, with the song "We've got trouble, right here in River City."

They have also not suffered a real war on their own turf since the mid 1800s, so can get all "excited" by talk of fighting, carpet bombing and "taking out" the Bad Guys, as long as they are oceans away. There is this tough guy image to be maintained - and Trump plays that part particularly well, though if he were (God forbid!) to wind up as President, I think it won't take long for him to unravel. (Though they claim to respect each other, I suspect Putin would eat him for lunch pretty early on.)

And yet another "nightmare scenario" has the (other) billionaire, Mike Bloomberg, jumping in to "save the day" as a third party candidate. The problem with that is that, under the strange Electoral College voting scheme they have in the US, this could actually work in Trump's favor.

(Short explanation: the President is not elected by popular vote of the people, but rather by the delegates elected in each State, sort of like the primary process. There have been several times that the President elected is NOT the one who received the majority of the popular vote.)
Cheers (?),
Bev
SoleilCouchant likes this.

Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 3rd March 2016, 09:23 AM
Bevdeforges's Avatar
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: deepest, darkest Essonne
Posts: 45,809
Rep Power: 23252
Bevdeforges has a reputation beyond reputeBevdeforges has a reputation beyond reputeBevdeforges has a reputation beyond reputeBevdeforges has a reputation beyond reputeBevdeforges has a reputation beyond reputeBevdeforges has a reputation beyond reputeBevdeforges has a reputation beyond reputeBevdeforges has a reputation beyond reputeBevdeforges has a reputation beyond reputeBevdeforges has a reputation beyond reputeBevdeforges has a reputation beyond repute
9523 likes received
1261 likes given

Users Flag! Originally from usa. Users Flag! Expat in france.
Default

On a somewhat lighter note here:

Several weeks ago, someone tipped me off to the fact that there is a "Trump filter" available for Chrome (and by now perhaps for other browsers). I just had to get this - though I have it set for "mild" filtering.

Just after posting to this thread, I went back to check the New Posts and lo and behold, found this thread listed but without a title. The little filter that could!

It also eliminates headlines on news sites about Trump - though it usually leaves the photo. Highly recommended if you're getting tired of hearing about this guy. (And no, I have yet to try the "high test" setting on the filter.)
Cheers,
Bev

Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 3rd March 2016, 09:46 AM
DejW's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Mountains - Pyrénées Orientales
Posts: 4,607
Rep Power: 1823
DejW has a reputation beyond reputeDejW has a reputation beyond reputeDejW has a reputation beyond reputeDejW has a reputation beyond reputeDejW has a reputation beyond reputeDejW has a reputation beyond reputeDejW has a reputation beyond reputeDejW has a reputation beyond reputeDejW has a reputation beyond reputeDejW has a reputation beyond reputeDejW has a reputation beyond repute
1784 likes received
1681 likes given

Users Flag! Originally from england. Users Flag! Expat in france.
Default

Interestingly, Bev, a similiar situation occured in the UK too. In the 1950s (or 60s?)
over the country more people voted for party X, but due to the constituency voting system the country got, by a narrow majority, a government of party Y. I think the Wilson government was one of the parties......it's all a bit dim in my memory.

DejW

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bevdeforges View Post
snip....

(Short explanation: the President is not elected by popular vote of the people, but rather by the delegates elected in each State, sort of like the primary process. There have been several times that the President elected is NOT the one who received the majority of the popular vote.)
Cheers (?),
Bev

Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply


Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Expat Forum For People Moving Overseas And Living Abroad forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:
Location
Where you live
Expat From Country
Please select the country you originate from. This will appear as a flag when you make posts on the site.
Expat To Country
Please select the country you have either moved to or want to relocate to. This will be presented on the site when you make posts.

Log-in


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Trump for president Baywatch The Mouflon 55 30th June 2016 03:16 PM
Dump Drumpf!! Howler La Chatarrera 218 15th March 2016 01:50 AM
Donald Trump’s Presidential Bid pagbati Mabuhay Club Corner 29 15th September 2015 11:38 PM
!Trump como piñata! Isla Verde La Chatarrera 12 3rd August 2015 12:16 AM

FORUM PARTNERS

ExpatForum.com is owned and operated by VerticalScope Inc.

Retiring Overseas Guides | Moving Overseas Guides | Cost of Living | Health Care Guides


All times are GMT. The time now is 01:34 AM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.