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Should we move to France.

3K views 20 replies 14 participants last post by  Clic Clac 
#1 ·
Hello,

I'm looking some opinions from you lovely people.

I'll keep it as brief as i can.

I am From N.Ireland but hold an Irish passport. My wife is French. We are mid 30s.

We have often floated the idea of moving to France for many years now but 1 thing has happened that makes us look at it more seriously.. Brexit.

I know many people have many views regarding this which I/we respect, but for us, we would like to stay within the EU for a number of reasons.

Now,

This is where it gets a little complicated for me.

WORK: I work with my father in his business for the past 19 years. Just him and me.
He is approaching 73 years old this year and is slowing down a lot. I personally have lost the desire to continue the business. I just fell out of love of the work but i continue as it helps him pay the bills.
If i left for France, he would most certainly have to retire as it's a pretty physically demanding job. He hasn't got any savings so, by me leaving, he would get impacted financially too. This emotionally makes it difficult for me to actually leave.

WIFE: Last year 2018 was hell for us. She was diagnosed with Breast Cancer. She has since received her last treatment and is now all clear and very healthy but, she came close...
This experience of course, changes you. How you think, what you prioritise, it focuses the mind.
Although she has been happy in N.Ireland, learnt English, (too fluently if you ask me hehe) made lots of Friends, Learnt to drive, moved up quite a lot in her career and of course beat cancer. I personally see her truely happy, in her element when we go to France to visit her family. (plus she can get super tan in like a day.. jealous!)
I have no doubt she could find work back in France.

FINANCES: Our critical illness insurance payed off most of our house. The house has also gone up in price by a decent amount too so we are sitting on healthy equity. Other than the remaining small mortgage, we have no major debt.
By selling our house, we could effectively by a property outright in France and have some decent cash left over. Which is very tempting.

ME: Well, in regards to my level of French, it's basic. Better than holiday French but not by much, tho i am grinding the language at the moment and learning a lot quite fast surprisingly.
Work would be an issue for me as my job with my father is very specialised and a technical level of French would be better. Tho, i don't really want to do that any more. After 19 years wrecking myself from 6am to 8pm, i'd happily stack shelves in Tescos for the rest of my days. (other retailers are available)



We don't see much of a future in N.Ireland anymore. The wife suggested moving South to the Republic.

A sensible suggestion.

But that doesn't appeal to me for a number of reasons.. Plus, considering we drive to France, i'm growing tired of the ferries. I like the idea of being on the Mainland EU and then being able to drive where i want without ferries, trains etc.


So, That's basically the situation i find myself in.
I'd like to move to France but leaving my father makes it difficult for me as i would be forcing him into retirement and he doesn't want to retire.
The wife is happy what ever we do as she says "..as long as you are with me, i don't care where we live"

What would you do people?

Stay or say to hell it with it, and move?

Thank you for taking the time to read my post.
 
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#2 ·
Hello

Welcome to our forum. I'm sure you wil get a range of answers....the regular posters here a a varied lot!

Thank you for the details, but I think that to give agood answer there's a lot more info needed. However, here are some questions for you to ask yourself...I'm not suggesting you post the answers here.

1. Why France? What is it that attracts each of you to living in France? I think most people here would agree that you really have to LOVE France to make a go of it here.

2. If you move to France how do you see yourself (selves) in 10, 20 and 40 years time? This means thinking through finances, health care, pensions etc not only for now (and the Brexit situation), but long term.

3. What will the other one of you do when the other one dies? Grim subject, but you have think it through.

4. Where in France? Near your wife's family? Actually it's not important "where", but the reasons "why" for choosing a location are.

5. Related to the other questions above, what would moving to France give you that moving say 50 miles in NI would not give you? Or moving to Ireland or mainland UK?

Well, that's a start!

Personally, I see Brexit as a short term hiatus, with of course lots of screaming and shouting. In 10 years time there will probably be 2 scenarios....the UK remains in the EU and Brexit was just a blip along the way. Or, the UK goes its own way, probably succesfully and has a "good neighbour" relationship with the EU.

I'm interested to see how others reply to your very good and personal question.

DejW
 
#3 · (Edited by Moderator)
But that doesn't appeal to me for a number of reasons.. Plus, considering we drive to France, i'm growing tired of the ferries. I like the idea of being on the Mainland EU and then being able to drive where i want without ferries, trains etc.


.
Buy a car and park it in France.

But you can't really drive everywhere you might want in Europe. Large European cities aren't exactly welcoming to cars these days. Plus trains are much faster and when they aren't planes are.
 
#4 ·
Interesting questions - though as I'm sure you're well aware, no one can make the decision for you. Like Dej said, there is too much "background information" you need to consider that you probably shouldn't put out here on a public forum anyhow.

As far as the WORK side of things is concerned, your father most likely will not be able to continue working forever. Has he (or have you) sat down to figure what his retirement assets and entitlements are at this point? Not to mention what are his realistic health and fitness concerns in what you say is a demanding line of work. Then, too, there is the little matter of who else he has in the vicinity - friends, other family members, etc. You don't want to move to France only to find yourself constantly doing the back and forth again on the ferries to look after him.

WIFE: How long has she been gone from France? And what sort of work is she qualified to do? If you look back amongst the archives here, you'll see lots of mention about how in France most employers are mainly interested in your qualifications, not so much in what you're willing to do. And it may play a role whether she got her current qualifications in France or in NI - also where in France you settle, due to the availability and demand of those sorts of jobs.

As far as her health is concerned, you will also want to make sure you settle in a part of France that has all the necessary medical facilities and functions that she will need for follow up care. The issue of "medical deserts" is a very real one right now in France and you wouldn't want to wind up in an area where you have to drive an hour or more or wait months for an appointment with a specialist.

FINANCES: Again, this could depend on where in France you are planning on settling. Just be realistic about how long you'd be able to live off your savings before the issue of finding a job becomes critical.

ME (or rather YOU): Again, it could very easily come down to what you are qualified for in terms of work. Chances are, your French skills will improve fairly quickly once in France, as long as you put yourself out there and force yourself to interact with the local (no matter how bad you think your French is). But, finding a job (even "any job") can be difficult without proper qualifications - unless, perhaps, your wife's family have contacts and connections you can avail yourself of.

Just a few further points to consider. At least with your EU passports, you aren't forced into an immediate decision (well, before October 31st). Take your time and put together a do-able plan that leaves you options in either direction.
 
#5 ·
You are in a very difficult situation! It's not easy to give advice when we only have part of the picture. For instance, is your father on his own? Are there children involved? I am not asking for this information but it all has to be taken into account. If your father is on his own would you consider taking him with you?

I think you should draw up a picture of the best/worst case scenarios and involve your family in your decision which will affect you all.

Stacking shelves might seem an attractive occupation at the moment but it's not an ideal solution. At present you are more or less your own boss and make the decisions which many people would envy.

Your French is basic. You will therefore have to depend on your wife for many aspects of your life in France at least to begin with. This could lead to a great deal of frustration.

Perhaps you should give yourself a bit more time, sometimes things work themselves out and the way forward is clearer.

Good luck.
 
#6 ·
Perhaps you should give yourself a bit more time, sometimes things work themselves out and the way forward is clearer.
As Verité says, and Bev too.
I don't see how Brexit will impact on you. You will both still be EU citizens, even if NI isn't an EU state. Does your dad's company export to the EU or does your wife's work have a European dimension? If not, what'll change for you?
When you say you don't see much of a future in NI, why is that?
In economic terms, things might change of course but at present unemployment in NI is around 3% according to the BBC (that surprised me), and unemployment in France is coming down steadily but still over 8% nationally.
In terms of general environment, there's a lot of social unrest in France at present - anti-Macron feeling, gilets jaunes, strikes, support for Le Pen apparently on the rise, Frexit posters up on the billboards right at this moment. It might get worse yet before it gets better.

If it were me I'd wait until I felt easy in my mind about leaving dad. It's what I did except in my case it was my mum and there was no business involved, just I would have felt bad leaving the UK while my mum was frail, even though she was a massive Francophile herself and was all in favour of me moving. If you sit it out a while you will also have a clearer picture of how the Brexit charade will play out and what shape the aftermath will be. Brexit is shifting sand and you can't build on that.
 
#9 · (Edited)
The fact that your OH is French makes that so much easier.
Does it?
You still don't automatically get accepted into the social security system.
Things change while you're away from your native land, in everyday life and in the workplace. I feel like a numpty on a regular basis because I lost touch with UK life while I was in France. I don't know stuff that "everybody" knows, if I was a foreigner they wouldn't expect me to know but because I'm a Brit they do. The other week personnel contacted me to query my team's DOILs. I had to ask what a DOIL was. Day off in lieu, everybody knows that but I didn't. I wouldn't like to be responsible for integrating a foreign partner into UK life, I'm only just managing to reintegrate myself.

Conversely, I can't actually think of one way in which I would have found moving to France easier if I'd had a froggie spouse in tow. I think I might even have found it far less fulfilling and far less fun, in fact. But probably that's just me.

But
You move to France because you want to live in France. End of.
that bit I do agree with.
 
#10 ·
Sell up. Move to France take Dad with you. Buy yourself a nice place with a garden and a workshop. Dad can do a bit of what he likes doing.

We sold up and moved to Spain 10+years ago. We brought m-i-l with us. She (m-i-l) was a city girl and now she says that any time she wants a cheering up she just looks out of the window and sees green and mountains.

Don't worry about the language issue, with what you know already plus the wife speaking French, you will cope fine. Go for it!!!
 
#11 ·
Could you sell your share in the business? Your father could then work with the new partner and train them up. Then when you father wants to retire the business does not have to fold. In addition if you don't settle successfully you could buy yourself back in to the business by buying your father out and you would have a partner to work with.

Would you be happy working for somebody else, having run a business? Not everybody can do that.

Just a word of caution. It can be very hard for Anglo-French couples in France. The only other Brits in my village are in a similar position to your potential position one. They have bought their home outright and live midway between the French relatives' locations. The wife is French, and taught French in comprehensive schools for 22 years in the UK. However her qualifications are British and thus not recognised here. Even now, after 4 years, she can only get short term contracts teaching English in collèges. She often has to accept long commutes, just to get any work. Her husband was an engineer, with O level type French; now he delivers the publicity leaflets in town for 3 days a week but does all the term time childcare for their 10 year old bilingual daughter . I admire them for sticking with France and each other, especially as if they gave up and returned to the UK any comprehensive would snap her up and also pay her more.
 
#12 ·
TipsyBob -- We would move, but we're not you and yours , so our answer is meaningless. You've garnered quite a few very good responses to help in your decision making process. One quote, I've seen numerous times on this forum, is to consider "moving towards someplace, not moving away from somewhere."

Some questions to consider:

What do you want to do for your "2nd Act?" Can you prepare for your next vocation while working? Consider that your own ideas may change. Can you work for someone else after working with your father for so long -- many can't?" What are the requirements/qualification that France (or other alternatives) would place on you to become "operational," in any new business? Research, research, research -- then take action!

Nostalgia on you wife's part is an important consideration. Will France/moving work for you?

Are there adequate medical support? Something, we all have to consider, as we age.

Your father is 73, what are his/your retirement plans for him? Can he sell the business and recoup enough to cover his retirement with his old-age pension? Can you take him with you? Would he want to come? It's a desire of many to "retire in France," a mainstay of questions on this forum. His wishes may change over time. Have you and your father/wife talked? I have seen a couple of situations where the father continued to keep a business going, for the son -- you need to talk, if you haven't. I'm sure like most fathers, he would want what's best for you and your family.

Good luck with your decision, whether it's to move to France, stay in No. Ireland or a third, undetermined location! Cheers, 255
 
#13 · (Edited)
Everyone is different and will answer according to their situation and not yours, . You are the only ones that would know what todo.

Why do you want to move to France when you do not speak the language well and therefore will have lmted oportunities to get a decent job? You can start a business there but that will be tough. It is not easy to start something in France.

Working from 6am till 8pm everyday with a father has to be tough,. Do you fell burnt out? Maybe you need a change but not necessrilly to France.

You say your wife is happy in Ireland so why do you want to move from a situation where you have a job or can get one to a situation where you will have to rely on her for a long while?

I am French and my husband is from the US we had the same thoughts as you have in our thirties and we are happy we did not move to France.. We worked for 30 years in the US and then came retirement and the sme question came up and we decided to move to Mexico where we both started from scratch .

Good luck on whatever you decide-

Think long and hard before moving to a place where you will have to rely on your wife culturally if not fnancially.

I say if she is happy in Ireland, stay there and start another carreer. This way your father will have to plan his retirement one way or the other and if you are not far you can help him. You can always retire in France if you want to..It is very close, not like US /Mexico and France you are lucky, you can visit without major expense.
 
#15 ·
Another question is one that will always lurk in the back of your mind "What if...?"

We made our move to Spain and it was the best thing we could have done. Our "what if" is what if we'd stayed in UK answers include a perpetual financial struggle, damp dismal weather, three of us living in a top-floor (no possibility of a lift) small, unsuitable flat and with no prospect of being able to find a more suitable property if we sold it. Here we have a house spread over five floors with a chairlift. We three can live here without getting under each other's feet and each enjoy doing what she/he wishes. This place is fully paid for, we have a solar panel for hot water covering 10 months per year and are considering solar for electricity. We have a very nice climate and can afford one or two holidays per year on which we can even take our two (rescued) dogs.
 
#16 ·
A very interesting point, dear Baldi!

We have to understand the moving your life to France is a big event, with lots of risks. I'm very happy that it's worked for you (in Spain!), as it has for me, despite some upsets in my personal life that happened in France but not because of France.

However, I know several Brits for whom it has not worked out and they have sold up and gone back the the UK. There seem to be a large range of reasons for this which include

lack of faith in the Fr health care system
lack of real commitment to "live" here...they were on a long holiday.
Holiday France is not the same as 365 days a year France
caught out by £ / € exchange rates
family in the UK getting more and more distant, and / or ill.
Lack of French language skills meant a limited social life
....the list goes on

Anyway, as has been pointed out the original poster has received a range of advice. Let's hope it all works out for him. Please tell us what you decide!

DejW
 
#17 ·
You are young and I can see your frustration with the whole Brexit thing. Brexit is the domain of older Brits who hanker after a time in the U.K. which is pure fiction. For the working person it never existed. As you have said you have two main concerns the result for your father of severing the business partnership and your wife having recently had breast cancer. Moving house is listed by experts as so stressful it knocks a few years off your like. Moving house to a different country and culture no matter how much you think you know it is mega stressful. Having experience of cancer stress is to be avoided. France has problems and you have no experience of those problems. It is a difficult country to integrate into and at first exasperating. Not really my business but I am a lot older than you and have seen so many changes in life. My main worry at 14 was the Cuba crisis and the bomb! Still here many years later. I would suggest you suck up Brexit in NI for a while and when your wife has been clear for more years and your Dad retired then if you still want to move go for it.
 
#18 ·
You are young and I can see your frustration with the whole Brexit thing. Brexit is the domain of older Brits who hanker after a time in the U.K. which is pure fiction. For the working person it never existed. As you have said you have two main concerns the result for your father of severing the business partnership and your wife having recently had breast cancer. Moving house is listed by experts as so stressful it knocks a few years off your like. Moving house to a different country and culture no matter how much you think you know it is mega stressful. Having experience of cancer stress is to be avoided. France has problems and you have no experience of those problems. It is a difficult country to integrate into and at first exasperating. Not really my business but I am a lot older than you and have seen so many changes in life. My main worry at 14 was the Cuba crisis and the bomb! Still here many years later. I would suggest you suck up Brexit in NI for a while and when your wife has been clear for more years and your Dad retired then if you still want to move go for it.
I'm on my 22nd place in 32 years. :eek: Slightly worried now. :fingerscrossed:
 
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