Salary and offer/package questions - Part 2 - Page 100

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Salary and offer/package questions - Part 2 - Page 100


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  #991 (permalink)  
Old 3rd March 2014, 04:01 AM
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It's a very lousy offer, especially for the head of a company. To use as an example managers in my company make around 30K (and they're mostly young expats in their late 20s/early 30s without children). Senior managers are 40K+ and directors 50k+.

A single could live off the amount, as could a couple. But with children, no.

If you also received full school fees in addition to the package offer then it could be doable but definitely not lavish.

I don't know how much negotiations will be realistic. You really needed to be getting something around 50K a month to make it worth for your family to make the move to Dubai. 30K to 50K is a big jump.



Quote:
Originally Posted by AdamRus View Post
Thanks for the feedback. I got the offer and definitely quite surprised. Much time invested in interviews for weeks, back and forth, senior level position, and the offer seems very low.

Is it common business practice to low ball with the expectation it will be negotiated? Is this a common practice in Dubai?

Position: Head of X (media company)
Total: 28K-30K month
Base Salary: 14K / month
Housing: +$8K / month
Transport: +$5K a month

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  #992 (permalink)  
Old 3rd March 2014, 04:06 AM
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i have no idea what your roles are worth, however, i would say that you shouldn't get hung up about what allowances you get, or don't get, or how much they are.
You dont get allowances back home - you get a salary.
All that really matters is the TOTAL sum - the rest is semantics.

a really good package with no schooling allowance is better than a crap package with school allowance, if the total sum is less.

The only concern you should have about allowances is that only the BASE salary portion of any package is used to calculate your End of Service gratuity. Hence most employers provide allowances to approx 40% of total remuneration.

it's always amusing when someone moans about what they can or can't get for a specific housing allowance. This is irelevant. you might spend less, you might spend more, but it is still a percentage of the total cash you will receive, and up to you to work out if it is a good deal for you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TCKID View Post
Hello,

Hope everyone is having a good start to the week

I have a question regarding the sort of expat package my husband and I could expect if we apply for jobs in Dubai. Hopefully this is the right thread for something like this! My apologies if it isnít.

A little bit of background: My husband is a Management Accountant with experience mainly in construction and I am a Petroleum Geologist. We both have 7 years of experience with about 2-3 years of experience in the Middle East as well. Both of us intend to work in Dubai. I would prefer to work part-time so I can be with our children for at least part of the week, but understand that part-time roles are hard to come by there especially in my line of work.

We are a bit confused about how much to aim for as a target salary and also what sort of package deal we should expect for a family of four. I have tried to do as much research as I can into salary ranges in the UAE for my line, but the information is hard to come by and not very consistent. We have spoken to a couple of recruitment agencies and they all seem to want us to specify what we expect, so I donít want to risk quoting too high or too low.

Our children are only 2 years old so we wonít have to worry about school allowances for now, but we would need a part-time nanny or any other good childcare, so hopefully we can make enough to cover that.

In terms of living expenses, we would prefer to live in a villa in communities like Emirates Living or Arabian Ranches, so we would need some sort of rental allowance as well. Are these allowances usually included?

I realise that there are several factors that will affect our final salary package, but if any of you have similar job roles or are aware of the salary ranges in our industries, any help you could provide would be much appreciated!

Thanks in advance
AN
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  #993 (permalink)  
Old 3rd March 2014, 05:46 AM
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The total sum is the most important and you're right it's misleading to get hung up on designated benefits. But it can be useful to negotiate on how some of the designated benefits are paid.

Will the company offer the housing "allowance" in one cheque for the year? If so this gives you leverage in finding a place to live as most landlords are now demanding one cheque for a villa and often give a bit of a discount if you can pay in one cheque. Be careful, however, because a one-cheque housing allowance is often a lose it or use it benefit as you're not refunded the differential if your villa is cheaper than the allowance, whereas the allowance included in your monthly salary gives you full control over that sum of money. But people may find it easier to find a place and pay their rent via one cheque, especially when they're just starting out in Dubai.

Having school fees paid upfront makes it easier for families, particularly with multiple children. A very nice benefit is a package offer that includes school fees paid in full at any school of your choosing. This is increasingly rare but still occurs, particularly in O&G and major multinationals. Such a benefit also protects you from the yearly fee increases (see my note above about ASD's fees jumping from 75K to 100K for new families, in just one year!).

So while the total value of the package is the most important it is worthwhile to see how it's officially broken down and paid. If you're just moving to Dubai and getting paid everything monthly, it can be very difficult to be able to pay your rent and school fees upfront at the same time, before you've started building up savings.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vantage View Post
i have no idea what your roles are worth, however, i would say that you shouldn't get hung up about what allowances you get, or don't get, or how much they are.
You dont get allowances back home - you get a salary.
All that really matters is the TOTAL sum - the rest is semantics.

a really good package with no schooling allowance is better than a crap package with school allowance, if the total sum is less.

The only concern you should have about allowances is that only the BASE salary portion of any package is used to calculate your End of Service gratuity. Hence most employers provide allowances to approx 40% of total remuneration.

it's always amusing when someone moans about what they can or can't get for a specific housing allowance. This is irelevant. you might spend less, you might spend more, but it is still a percentage of the total cash you will receive, and up to you to work out if it is a good deal for you.

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  #994 (permalink)  
Old 3rd March 2014, 06:03 AM
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That is extremely helpful, thanks very much TallyHo!
I can't believe these massive hikes in rent and school fees! They are already quite high as it is. Will definitely mention that we would prefer the 'paid in full' options.

And yes, as you and vantage have mentioned, it is the total sum that matters at the end of the day and that will ultimately make or break the deal for us.

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  #995 (permalink)  
Old 3rd March 2014, 09:05 PM
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Hi,
I recently got a one year consulting contract (for software testing) in Dubai, for 25k pay (no other indemnities) and one vacation fly-back to Canada. What are your thoughts? Decent offer for a young couple with no kids just starting out?

Edit: For reference, I currently make 70k CAD per year.


Last edited by sleo; 3rd March 2014 at 09:20 PM.
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  #996 (permalink)  
Old 3rd March 2014, 11:43 PM
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OK, no replies so let's make our situation a bit more clear. This is the first time we're thinking of leaving country and we're excited about it, but just want to check whatever possible.
I've read through many threads here and I am amazed and thankful for this amount of information. It is really helpfull.

Ok, so right now we're making some 50k US$/yr, have our own apartment and that's enough for a decent albeit not luxury life. Let's say we have everything we need.

Here the school is free but it's also one of the reasons why we'd like to leave, as the school system is not on high level, so we're looking for better one.

To keep up the lifestyle we have now (one new and one used car, 2 bedroom spacious apartment, one skiing trip/year, summer holidays on boat for 2 weeks etc., what should we aim at in UAE?

I can see that there are really huge differences between close positions, and huge differences in a life expenses, so what do you guys think we'd be satisfied with to keep up this lifestyle?

Thanks in advance for any reply!




Quote:
Originally Posted by amiklic1 View Post
Hi there,
we're family with 2 kids, 11 and 14 yo, looking for th job in UAE.
I am in project management business as well as electric and my wife is graduated engineer of marine fishery, also with additional 7 years in project management business (we are running the company responsible for wind farms projects development)

We are thinking about moving in UAE, in particular Abu Dhabi (preferable) or Dubai so I'd like to ask, just initially, for how high salary and total income to aim in our situation. I know it all depends from one position to another, just want to know what others think we should put as alower limit.

To note also that we both plan to work there.

Thanks for any and all replies.

AM

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  #997 (permalink)  
Old 4th March 2014, 01:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by haibinhle View Post
Oh my god, I wish I were you!

13k$/month equals to 564k AED/year

A very quick expense calculation for you (in AED), these are all basic expenses
- Housing: 200k/year
- Schooling: 100k/year for your 2 children
- Groceries: 50k/year for your whole family (4k/month or 1k/week)

You should have a driving license (10k) and a car which would cost you around 100k but you can pay in instalments.

You still have around 200k/year for other expenses or saving! It could be an annual salary for some others, man!

Go for it!
thanks for your info @haibinhle meanwhile we still browsing for place to live and school now...

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  #998 (permalink)  
Old 4th March 2014, 01:52 AM
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Curious - is it 'EXPECTED' to negotiate a package from a Dubai company? Obviously I would always negotiate an offer, but curious if there is a cultural thing here for Dubai and negotiating business?

I've heard everything in UAE is negotiated, which I'm not a fan being Canadian. But specific to the employment package, I'm curious from locals what the business sentiment is around negotiating packages? Common, absolutely expect, etc.

Just noting I received a package offer from a dubai local company, after weeks of interviews, the package offer was shocking low, which as a Canadian I first become insulted! In Canada, while there is some negotiating, its generally expected business is a win-win and a fair offer is usually placed first, not a dirt low offer...but then again, I question is this a common practice in Dubai to negotiate in business where the 'expectation' is the first offer will be far to one side?

Locals? Thoughts?

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  #999 (permalink)  
Old 4th March 2014, 05:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AdamRus View Post
Just noting I received a package offer from a dubai local company, after weeks of interviews, the package offer was shocking low, which as a Canadian I first become insulted!
Well, if the offer is shocking low, I guess you're not going to take it. And since you don't have anything to lose, why don't you go back to them with a counter-proposal asking for far-far more than what you think you're worth. So either they will tell you to ... off, or they might start negotiating, and that might eventually get you where you wanted.

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  #1000 (permalink)  
Old 4th March 2014, 07:38 AM
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Hi All

Apologies for continuously asking but i didnt receive many replies for my offer. I have asked for an extension on my decision.

so without typing it all out again. 35k Dirhams a month. married with a baby. wife will not be working. flights home for family, 85% school fees paid etc

Is this a good salary for IT Project Manager with 7 years experience.
Will we live a good life and save?

This is a huge decision and would appreciate all feedback

thanks

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