Is it safe to invest in land???

[Daxk]

Seeker, in reverse order, you are a newbie in the country, a country that has a Judicial system that is open to bribes and civil claims take forever.
Let me hasten to add that this has nothing to do with the colour or race of the participants.
If you part with money for a farm that is not registered in your name but in that of a partnership, what are the limits of that partnership,if the other party defaults somewhere, can you be sure that their share of the venture is not set out as a guarantee etc.
If, it is registered solely in the other parties name as you are still awaiting your Perm residence(which can take 4 years) then you are totally in their hands.
A number of foreign investors, especially in the Western Cape have been caught this way. Google Noseweek, invest in a subscription, it tends to be pretty accurate.

Definite info about taking money out.
Sa Reserve Bank or SA Revenue service, both tend to answer their emails.
Unless things have changed in the last 24 hours, you can take out an equal amount that you brought in plus any profit you made less Income tax/Capital Gains tax.
You cannot take ANYTHING out without Income Tax clearance and SA reserve Bank Clearance.
And they will decide if you have paid enough tax.
lastly, why will I never live there again?
I dont wish to repeat that I was a victim of crime, search all posts by Daxk and read.
I also have a 9 year old daughter and a strong desire to live to a ripe old age.

Living on a farm? living the dream? yep.
Reality?
There is a strong feeling that people who live on SA farms are at extreme risk as more farmers as a profession get murdered than any other profession.(Source google farm murders za)
Because of the size of farms, especially ion the area you are looking at, Houses tend to be isolated and the SA Police Services are understaffed, under equipped and under motivated.
allied to the fact that your nearest SA police Station might be an hour away makes it difficult.
a lot of the farmers use marnet, which is a two way radio Netwerk,similar to to the Australian outback setup but the Govt frown on this.
in case of trouble everyone grabs a gun and heads over to whomever has called for help.
You will not have a firearm until at least two years after you have citizenship.
Google SA Firearm licences za

They also used to have a sort of Blockwatch self help system called the commandos which the government disbanded as they have this fear of white guys in Military uniforms with semi Automatic rifles.

They tried to replace it with a Police reserve but then expected the farmers to protect areas away from their wives and children.
That sort of killed that one.

As the majority of the criminals tend to be young, older, retired people are often seen as easy targets.

and the judicial sytem does not help.
at the last survey, 9% of all murders and 11% of all Rapes get solved and convicted.
There is an average of 50 murders and 150 rapes per day in South africa.
does that answer your question?
I dont care wether you go there or not, but go with your eyes open and informed.

[Deepdiver47]

The land issue is becoming thorny. After watching Zim we all said it wont happen here, but it is. There are current 'issues' about wine farms around Stellenbosch, Farming land in what used to be the Eastern Transvaal and ongoing drama in the KwaZulu midlands. I know this because I've just studied it at University.

My brother in law, good died-in-the-wool permanent optimist that he is is trying to buy a farm on the Breede riveer, but is having some trouble because of a land claim that has been suggested. You really dont want your dog in that fight.

The overall problem is that you may purchase only to find a claim lodged after purchase, and you lose your land. I would sooner try to find a way to enter using the cash as collateral instead of direct investment in land.

[seeker]

Deepdiver47,
We're hoping that having time to look around while we rent will give us the opportunity to research and avoid such a problem. Best of luck to your brother-in-law.

[seeker]

Just curious Daxk, where do you live now? I have read some of your other posts and you (and your friends and family) certainly have experienced more than your share of horrific incidents. I'm taken back to my "idyllic" youth in beautiful Monterey / Carmel CA where I was twice a victim of violent crime before I was 20 (knife and gun). Do you not think crime is everywhere, or am I being naive?

[Daxk]

Seeker, Crime is everywhere, I am neither naieve nor stupid,nor do I or my family have large "kick me" signs stuck to our backs.

If I were to wander around Central Park. Londons Dockland, Parts of SF, Marseilles etc, I am pretty certain that I would be mugged with either a gun or a knife as I was too in Central Johannessburg,in broad daylight in a lunchtime crowd.

In the same way, I could be hi-jacked with a fire arm anywhere in the world
removed forcibly from my car

However, if you have been reading up on your future home, on either
News24, South Africa's premier news source, provides breaking news on national, world, Africa, sport, entertainment, technology & more. or iol.co.za, both of which are reputable news media, you might have picked up that gratuitous violence, unneccessary violence ,quite often rape, happens AFTER the criminals have got what they came for.
That, and the frequency of it, is what makes SA stand out.

What did your attacker do after he had your wallet and watch?
stick around to cut your fingers off so he could get the wedding ring off?

Yes, Cape Town, perhaps because it is so far from illegal immigrant borders, seems to have a lower incidence of Hi-jackings and Armed home invasions, , small villages in the Farming areas do have a lower incidence of crime, you could, spend 40 years in SA and not experience personally any violent crime, but if you do, it tends to be a biggie.

I clearly said, I dont care wether you go or not, do your research , google farm murders and farm crime if you are going to live on a farm.

look at what other farmers, especially in your area ( Look at the incident Book at the Police station) do about protection and follow suit.

I also told you,I live in Galway,Ireland, I have a 9 year old daughter.
We have had two murders in 2 years.

Do whatever you wish, accept or ignore advice given to you.
You mentioned your husband was 60, have you looked at Medical care and ambulance services in the area you wish to move to ?

I am also of the age where heart attacks,strokes and various other age related dangers are very possible.
I suggest you find out where and what is available.

[Daxk]

Hey Seeker, Carte Blanche is a very good actuality programme in SA.

MNET - WHERE MAGIC LIVES
is part one of three parts of a broadcast.
or google Carte Blanche za look for video broadcasts.

I assume gloken and co will find it bilous too.

[Deepdiver47]

Hi Seeker.

I worked as a cop in the US and Canada whilst based in the West Indies for 8 years. I was shot at once. Since I've been here I've been shot at twice, involved (walking by, not participant!) in three armed robberies - one a bank and the subject of two armed car heists, both, due to presence of mind, I avoided.

But this is off topic. Your issue was property investment, which I hope we've helped a little with. As I've said before,you can go to the doom and gloom section yourself!

[seeker]

Daxk,
I was asking if I was being naive - not you. My purpose for being on this forum is to get as much information as I can so I can make an informed decision, so thank you for the news resources. I've only been looking at Mail & Guardian, as that's all I knew about.

Given the fact that my husband (although 60 he is VERY fit and a well trained ex British para) has his heart and mind set on making this move, I'm trying to learn what to be aware of and how to protect our finances and investments, as well as our lives!

[mmm]

Originally Posted by seeker

Given the fact that my husband (although 60 he is VERY fit and a well trained ex British para) has his heart and mind set on making this move, I'm trying to learn what to be aware of and how to protect our finances and investments, as well as our lives!

are you not as enthusiastic as you husband for the move?

[seeker]

mmm,

Intellectually, yes - emotionally, no. We have a beautiful home on 48 acres in the Shenandoah Valley of VA. I will be leaving my home, my country and my children (21 and 22). However, we are both slaves to supporting our home which is far too large and our kids have moved out. We will have to sell our propertry eventually anyway, as neither of us has much retirement, so it makes sense to do it now when we still have the health and energy to start a new life elsewhere. It's just a huge move. But I've never seen my husband happier or more relaxed than when he's in SA. That counts for more than anything else.