Is SA the crime centre of the world???

[Halo]

NationMaster - Murders (per capita) (most recent) by country
(This is now higher - I believe SA is now No.1)

NationMaster - Rapes (per capita) (most recent) by country

NationMaster - Gun violence > Homicides > Overall homicide rate > per 100,000 pop. (most recent) by country

Nice..... Top place to immigrate to.

[acassim]

^^ Amazing. And to quote a top government person - "there is NO crime problem in South Africa".

[Mickyxxx]

Well I have to say that I have lived in SA and now visit often, I have walked around Cape Town at night many times, I would not walk around London at night, my friend was badly beaten there last year by a gang of kids, my half brother has lived in Durban for many years and would not live anywhere else even though he has a house on the Isle Of Wight in England which he rents. The teenagers are polite, where I live here it's a nightmare with swearing nasty arrogant kids beating up old people and trashing the busses etc, and I live in a nice area. There is crime everwhere, you would not get out alive in lots of no-go areas in Florida etc. When I visit Cape Town, Durban and other towns I am amazed at the building thats going on, hotels, golf courses ,apartments, the roads are far better than here as are supermarkets and food etc, I do find that some whites living in SA are rather bitter and rather biased. I have holidayed in Italy where I was dragged along the road by a scooterist stealing my camera and in Paris my mobile was stolen and when I resisted was punched and kicked and no-one helped. Millions of tourist visit SA with no bother at all, I have many friends in SA and no-one I knowhas been murdered or mugged or raped, the beaches are crowded in Durban and Cape Town in the season. I am English and England has gone to the dogs hence hundreds of thousands leaving yearly ,some to SA

[Halo]

Then you don't know many South Africans.... Either you are naive or just very lucky as while that is your opinion, its simply not the case..... (if you want stats, just ask)

PS If you walk thought a mine field not knowing its one and survive you would think its the safest place on earth.

[Daxk]

Yes,Mickyxxx I know, I cant believe how badly the poms have screwed up their Child raising. Government and now, as a result of political correctness, their Society.

CT does appear to be safer than anywhere else in SA, Durban I grew up in does not exist anymore, and I'm not suprised you have'nt met anyone who has been raped or lost a family member through Murder.

or even an armed Home invasion.

Most of us leave as soon as we can after thats happened.
FRom your side, the Weather ,the scenery, the Cheap ifestyle and servants, its obviously a paradise.

Any idea why so many South Africans have left? a lot to the very dangerous, gloomy,Damp
UK you want so desparately to leave?
Not all stay in the UK, some do go back, others then use that as a stepping stone to get to Aus.
Figures Vary, but an accurate Guide is that 841,000 white South Africans left betwen two census points.
Now they dont publish those figures.a rough estimate is somewhere between 1 million and two million South Africans prefer to raise their children somewhere else?

Do you think they might know something abot dear old Africa that you dont?

[Mickyxxx]

When I was last in Cape Town there were lines of South Africans queuing up buy apartments as second homes and investments in developments like Cartwrights Corner , and in Durban, my brother said the same was happening, so why werent they investing overseas and why are there so many international hotel chains being built, golf courses etc if its so bad and why is tourism rising dramatically. Foreign investment of many billions of Rand from America, Japan, China the oil states etc are flowing into SA. Barclays and Chinese banks have spent billions buying up banks in SA, they are all wrong to do so?
And according to Pam Golding and other estate agents , many expates are investing in SA property, why?
Everwhere you go in SA there is change, new estates , cranes everywhere so all these countries and investors are all wrong are they?
Everyone knows there is a crime problem in SA as there is in most parts of the world.
I have driven all over SA had many holidays without any trouble, I dont go near townships and crime area's as I dont do in America Brazil and Europe.


I actually bought an apartment which was snapped up when I replaced it on the market, by a SA lady for owned property in Hong Kong. I owned a house in Durban North which was purchased by a South African.
My neighbour was burgled and the police didn't even bother to attend.
One of my brother's shop near London was broken into so many times he gave up and sold, his house was also trashed.
I live in England and am not moving anytime soon but lots of my friends have moved to France as Britain has changed so much in recent years.
Take a trip into Docklands London , you will find many gated comunities with security guards .

[MichaelJ47]

Hi Micky

SA has to be one of the cheapest countries for a foreigner to live in particularly if you are arriving with GBP or Euro's. Yes, many foreigners are buying property here but it is still less than 0.05% of total purchases.The government tried to bring a rule last year banning foreigners from buying here but it is on hold at the moment.

Also some interesting laws that were promulgated last year in property...if the government likes your property and wants it they can offer you ANY value and you must take it as they have first choice before anyone else...there is a term for that action

and all Public Open Space is now designated government property to be allocated and developed anyway that they see fit whenever that may be..

Did Pam Golding also tell you that the economy is booming so well that they have downsized every single extra office they can possibly find in the Western Cape, sliced the staff members by about 1 third etc.

They also didnt mention that one of their agents was shot to death in her show house about 3 weeks ago in the Cape Town area did they? or that Chubb security has a special deal with estate agents to protect them in areas in Sunday show houses ?

Or that private security firms have been hired in some areas to protect police stations that can't protect themselves .

No doubt the banks failed to mention that SA has some of the highest bank charges on the planet and Reserve Bank rulings state that a bank may lend out 10x more than its security.
It is a fact there is a very interesting site called bankgate dot co dot za that can keep you up to date with all the ethical dealings the great banks in SA have.

Cranes everywhere ...in some areas yes..in other areas developments were sold in the boom years 2004/2005 and the current owners are getting financially burned. Look at all the property for sale and all the Auction boards up all over the place yet very few buyers to match the supply. Many apartment buildings standing empty.

Rental returns are apalling with owners having to subsidise rentals 50% or more and that doesnt even cover the bond. Then there is still the management fees on top of that.

The only reason your property would be snapped up would be because it was at a bargain price or bought by a buyer who wanted that unit only. Well done anyway - good for you! Its always nice to hear of successes

You are correct every country has it's problems but unfortunately SA's crime is out of control with no end in sight. If one has a choice why would you want to endure this ? Why wouldn't you want to live somewhere else for a while ?

Millions have left the country yet a handful still return every year. There is no place like home and living here is very unique but there are other exciting, safer places to be , particularly if you have a partner and kids.

The truth is I dont want to live behind bars , electronic fences, alarms and gated villages. I want to be able to walk down the street in safety or swim on the beach with out having my stuff stolen or being attacked . I am tired of living in fear now I just want to live

[MichaelJ47]

I just want to add to this thread a little before all the flaming starts .....

This problem is affecting everyone in this country, right across the spectrum. The poor & disadvantaged are preyed on relentlessly by their own people. A young man who works as staff of ours was attacked and stabbed in the head for his sneakers when he went outside on his own property to the toilet. He was in hospital for a week. Suspects got off scott free

His 3 month old cousin was raped as the belief is if you have sex with a young child it cures aids . The child is in hospital and the culprits are unknown.

He dare not buy anything new or aspire to a better life or he becomes a target. We offered to finance his schooling for him as he is a bright young man but his "friends" have warned him that he better not get any bright ideas about going back to school or he may come to sticky end.

Mothers used to tuck there money into their bra when they went home so the thieves wouldn't find it, now those same thieves make them squat and search their most private of areas - how humiliating that must be and you can't get help from the cops and you cannot get away from the area you live in.

Xenophobia..hard working Central & Northern African immigrants come to this country and and are killed because they work damn hard when they are employed or start their own businesses . Yet those who do little break down the good for all.

Much of our crime is syndicated by drug gangs and car hijackers and it is permeating from JHB right throughout the country. Our cops get paid a pittance and some turn a blind eye - who can blame them - its not right but it happens.

Have you seen how the taxis drive here - right past the cops and nothing is done ..do you know why? The cops stay in the same area as the Taxi owners and are threatened with their life if they intervene or their families are threatened and in SA crime does pay and you do get away with murder. Hence only those who will pay are fined ..makes perfect economical sense to me. I don't like it but that is the way it works. Very sad but very true.

When you travel to the interior some camera traps are set to snap every car which passes. Those with out of town registration get sent fines knowing full well that it is impossible to contest and the drivers will pay without a fuss to avoid the frustration. Minor mischief but corruption is visible on all levels

Please think carefully before you move your family here . By all means come for an extended holiday. Buy property come out for a beautiful holiday - we would love to have you here for a while

[Mickyxxx]

The economy isn't booming nor is it in the UK or anywhere else but the potential as an emerging country along with other African countries is far greater than western countries hence the huge ongoing investment, 95% of SA property is purchased by South Africans.
There is a worldwide downturn in property, I wouldn't be buying in Dubai, falls are predicted at 25% soon. Many estate agents in GB are going out of bussiness and look at the USA
The SA Government wanted to stop Foreigners buying prime property espcially waterfront property as this as been targeted by overseas buyers, I cannot see this happening, time will tell.
I sold my apartment last year at a 50% profit , there are no other apartments in my block for sale and another I was recently looking at is sold out
I will look into some of your other statements and report here.
ASBA bank is operated and owned by Barclays and SA have stringent mortgage laws to stop buyers lending beyond their means which is the cause of the property crashes elsewhere
My apartment was a one bed and achieved R8000 a month or 6.5% net and was let very quickly. I did not sell at a bargain price either making a nice profit being the reason I sold.
My Brother his family and many relatives live in Durban and Cape Town and are very happy to do so, they could come to GB but don't want to
Good luck in Dubai, they arrest you if you take an asprin or a drink, who would want to live in a desert anyway

[MichaelJ47]

Originally Posted by Mickyxxx

The economy isn't booming nor is it in the UK or anywhere else but the potential as an emerging country along with other African countries is far greater than western countries hence the huge ongoing investment, 95% of SA property is purchased by South Africans.
There is a worldwide downturn in property, I wouldn't be buying in Dubai, falls are predicted at 25% soon. Many estate agents in GB are going out of bussiness and look at the USA
The SA Government wanted to stop Foreigners buying prime property espcially waterfront property as this as been targeted by overseas buyers, I cannot see this happening, time will tell.
I sold my apartment last year at a 50% profit , there are no other apartments in my block for sale and another I was recently looking at is sold out
I will look into some of your other statements and report here.
ASBA bank is operated and owned by Barclays and SA have stringent mortgage laws to stop buyers lending beyond their means which is the cause of the property crashes elsewhere
My apartment was a one bed and achieved R8000 a month or 6.5% net and was let very quickly. I did not sell at a bargain price either making a nice profit being the reason I sold.
My Brother his family and many relatives live in Durban and Cape Town and are very happy to do so, they could come to GB but don't want to
Good luck in Dubai, they arrest you if you take an asprin or a drink, who would want to live in a desert anyway

Thanks for the wishes

I am going to miss the greenery and the mountains as Dubai is one big construction site. Currently I live in the most beautiful place on earth but it is a little limited and my days of partying with alcohol are long gone. Prefer interesting company and good conversation.

I have the opportunity to visit GB and will do so in the future although I am not sure that I would want to stay there permanently.

With the internet the world has become smaller and information access is so much easier so perhaps I will spend the next decade or so experiencing other lands and cultures. A change is long overdue