French inheritance law

[tonygo]

My wife and I are seriously looking into the possibility of retiring permanently to France in the very near future, in fact we are planning to spend some time during Dec/Jan (Limousin) on a house hunting mission.

We understand that french inheritance law does not allow the disinheritance of offspring in the provisions of a will - even though contact has not been made for 30 years or more, therefore, we would not be able to dispose of any property in France as we would wish.

Is this true, and if so, is there any way that this particular aspect of the law can be circumvented legally?

Any advice, comments etc would be much appreciated

Tony

[Bevdeforges]

If you are resident in France, you estate will be subject to French inheritance law - which means that your kids get most of your estate. It doesn't matter if the kids haven't contacted you in 50 years. The only assets you can exempt from this are real property assets (i.e. land and buildings) located outside France, which would be subject to the inheritance laws in the country where the property is located.

You can organize a donation entre époux to protect your spouse, but there are serious limits as to how much and how the surviving spouse can inherit. It also depends on your "marital contract" - which amounts to the default laws regarding sharing of marital assets between spouses in the place and at the time of your marriage. Whether the children are children of your current marriage or a prior marriage will also have an effect on how the assets are divided.

Best you can do is to consult with a notaire before you buy a house in France. There might be some minor advantage in setting up an SCI, which is a property owning device lots of folks use in France. I'm a bit fuzzy on the details, but perhaps a notaire could explain the use of an SCI to you and suggest something to you.
Cheers,
Bev

[parsnips]

Originally Posted by tonygo

My wife and I are seriously looking into the possibility of retiring permanently to France in the very near future, in fact we are planning to spend some time during Dec/Jan (Limousin) on a house hunting mission.

We understand that french inheritance law does not allow the disinheritance of offspring in the provisions of a will - even though contact has not been made for 30 years or more, therefore, we would not be able to dispose of any property in France as we would wish.

Is this true, and if so, is there any way that this particular aspect of the law can be circumvented legally?

Any advice, comments etc would be much appreciated

Tony

You can protect your house by buying in Tontine, this allows the surviving spouse to become full owner of the property also without any tax. You can Will your non- real estate assets in "Quasi- Usufruit"(in the terms of Art. 587 Code Civil) which means the surviving spouse gets full disposal of the assets while the "offspring"if they can be traced, get a form of legal IOU (Créance), which they claim against the surviving spouse's assets at their eventual death.
You may, if the offspring is of your marriage, be able to adopt the marriage regime of "Communauté Universel avec attribution integrale" whereby everything passes to the surviving spouse.
You must find an ENGLISH FLUENT Notaire and sort all this out BEFORE buying a house (to reduce possible costs)
I would advise you to take a copy of your question and this answer to the Notaire (together with any other answers which you feel would meet your needs).

[NicolsT]

Have a look at the Pennington's Solicitors Website They drew up my French Will for me, and they had lots of good advice. I am not recommending them per se, although they did a good job!!

[Bevdeforges]

Be careful with the changing of your marital regime. If you want to go to that "universale" regime that parsnips mentioned, you have to get permission (i.e. sign off) from the children if they are adults. This could be a problem if you have been out of contact for a long time.

Talk to a notaire - if you need to find an english speaking notaire, contact the British Consulate or the American Consulate in France. They usually maintain lists of English speaking professionals.

The inheritance laws have changed in the last few years to protect the surviving spouse a bit better, but the rules depend on your exact circumstances - particularly whether the children in question are from your current marriage or from a prior marriage. There are also advantages and disadvantages of usufruit (where the children retain the ownership of the asset, but the surviving spouse retains all rights of use and the right to income from the property).
Cheers,
Bev

[giantpanda]

Hi!

French Inheritance law ( a direct implication of the marriage contract, except for some special points ) gives the children a privileged situation in as much as they are " héritiers réservataires ", which is not the case of the wife, but who is still partly protected.

You can only desinherit children in very limited cases ( such as proved attempted murder etc.

If you are a French resident ( and then normally as Expat you will be considered as married " en séparation de biens " unless you are able - in the sense you fulfil the conditions - to choose a different regime) all your estate except houses/flat outside France are subject to French inheritance law.

Within limits you can organize your succession.

In fact worrying about French succession really starts, before you buy a house in France .

Yours,

giantpanda


PS. If you send me a PM with your private email I can send you a paper, which is quite explicit.

[parsnips]

[quote=Bevdeforges;53107]Be careful with the changing of your marital regime. If you want to go to that "universale" regime that parsnips mentioned, you have to get permission (i.e. sign off) from the children if they are adults. This could be a problem if you have been out of contact for a long time.

It is only where there are children of a previous relationship when they have to formally renounce their right to an "action en retranchment", thats why I specified that they could adopt the "universelle" only if the out-of-contact" child(ren) were of the marriage.
Again I must stress that the advice of a good ENGLISH-FLUENT Notaire is essential, no-one should ever make any succession arrangements purely on the advice of individuals on a forum!
notaires.fr have a national register where you can find a local english speaking notaire---BUT check them out by phone to be sure they are fluent.

[Rony Weissman]

Hi Tony,

There is a lot of very good advice above, especially the response by Bev. It may be interesting to you to speak with a french notaire about setting up an SCI if you have a lot of assets, but otherwise the surviving spouse in a french succession is very well protected as far as their rights to their house and usufruit of other assets. You should also talk to the notaire about a DDV (Donation au Dernier Vivant) since you were married outside of France.

Remember that life insurance policys in france are not included in french successions (there are exceptions for abuses), so there are ways to use this to give money to whomever you want, thus reducing the part reserved for children.

Good luck with the house hunting!

Rony

[Bevdeforges]

Originally Posted by Rony Weissman

but otherwise the surviving spouse in a french succession is very well protected as far as their rights to their house and usufruit of other assets.

As with many things in French succession law, this depends on the specific circumstances. If the children are from different marriages, the rights of the surviving spouse are not so well protected unless the couple has taken some care to protect themselves through a donation entre époux or something similar. (If you haven't guessed by now, I'm the second spouse of someone with kids from a previous marriage so have done a bit of research on this for my own case. )
Cheers,
Bev

[Rony Weissman]

Originally Posted by Bevdeforges

As with many things in French succession law, this depends on the specific circumstances. If the children are from different marriages, the rights of the surviving spouse are not so well protected unless the couple has taken some care to protect themselves through a donation entre époux or something similar. (If you haven't guessed by now, I'm the second spouse of someone with kids from a previous marriage so have done a bit of research on this for my own case. )
Cheers,
Bev

Hi bev, as you say and I mentioned they should look at a DDV, as if there are children from another marriage, the surviving spouse has only the option to 1/4 of the patrimoine in plein propriete, (though with the new laws she would have the right to lodgement in the residence principale). France is very complicated for this. Until recently, the surviving conjoint (typically the wife) was very vulnerable in certain family situations. Also remember that everyone married under the standard french CBRA regime is protected by a default state sponsored DDV since 2001.

Rony