Non EU countries in Europe ??

[Aussies]

We believe that Andorra and Serbia are not classified as EU Countries. This being the case, would it be correct to assume that if we entered France from either of those countries, that our allowed 3 months in the EU / Shengen area would start from the time of actual arrival in France ?
Also, are passports checked between Andorra and France. Appreciate help from anyone who knows these details.

[Joppa]

Originally Posted by Aussies

We believe that Andorra and Serbia are not classified as EU Countries. This being the case, would it be correct to assume that if we entered France from either of those countries, that our allowed 3 months in the EU / Shengen area would start from the time of actual arrival in France ?
Also, are passports checked between Andorra and France. Appreciate help from anyone who knows these details.

First, you are confusing Schengen with EU. Schengen countries, where 90-in-180 days limit applies as a whole, comprise most but not all EU countries, excluding such countries as UK, Ireland, Bulgaria and Romania, where a separate immigration rule applies. Schengen also includes some non-EU countries like Norway, Iceland and Switzerland.
Secondly, while Andorra is both outside Schengen and EU, it has no airport of its own so every traveller has to go through either of the neighbouring Schengen countries, France or Spain. So before you enter Andorra by road, you will already have entered Schengen and have started your 90-day stay, and while the period you spend in Andorra doesn't technically count towards 90 days, because of lack of formal passport control, it's difficult to argue your case.
There is an ID check of a sort, but what Spanish/French officials are looking for are contrabands and goods in excess of duty-free limit bought in Andorra, esp booze and cigs.
Serbia is neither in EU nor Schengen, and if you start your trip there, you will begin your Schengen stay after landing in France or another Schengen country.
Though it isn't part of your question, it's useful to know where those non-Schengen countries are, so that you can leave Schengen after 90 days to stay in those countries for 90 days before returning to start another 90-day period.

[Aussies]

Originally Posted by Joppa

First, you are confusing Schengen with EU. Schengen countries, where 90-in-180 days limit applies as a whole, comprise most but not all EU countries, excluding such countries as UK, Ireland, Bulgaria and Romania, where a separate immigration rule applies. Schengen also includes some non-EU countries like Norway, Iceland and Switzerland.
Secondly, while Andorra is both outside Schengen and EU, it has no airport of its own so every traveller has to go through either of the neighbouring Schengen countries, France or Spain. So before you enter Andorra by road, you will already have entered Schengen and have started your 90-day stay, and while the period you spend in Andorra doesn't technically count towards 90 days, because of lack of formal passport control, it's difficult to argue your case.
There is an ID check of a sort, but what Spanish/French officials are looking for are contrabands and goods in excess of duty-free limit bought in Andorra, esp booze and cigs.
Serbia is neither in EU nor Schengen, and if you start your trip there, you will begin your Schengen stay after landing in France or another Schengen country.
Though it isn't part of your question, it's useful to know where those non-Schengen countries are, so that you can leave Schengen after 90 days to stay in those countries for 90 days before returning to start another 90-day period.

Dear Joppa, thanks so much for your advice. I'll explain our situation in a bit more detail and you may be able to suggest which non-EU country would be best to visit in order to change passports. We are entering the Shengen area (France) on Australian passports under the 90 day tourist visa. On our arrival in France we intend to apply for EU passports due to having a father who was born in a country that is now part of the EU. We have been told that those EU passports will definitely be issued to us, but will take about 30 days. On receiving our new EU passports, we then need to depart the Shengen area on our Aussie passports and then re-enter on our EU passports, as we wish to have at least 12 months in the Shengen area. We were wondering which would be the closest non-EU country to France to do this. Very much appreciate any help with advise on this.

[Joppa]

Originally Posted by Aussies

Dear Joppa, thanks so much for your advice. I'll explain our situation in a bit more detail and you may be able to suggest which non-EU country would be best to visit in order to change passports. We are entering the Shengen area (France) on Australian passports under the 90 day tourist visa. On our arrival in France we intend to apply for EU passports due to having a father who was born in a country that is now part of the EU. We have been told that those EU passports will definitely be issued to us, but will take about 30 days. On receiving our new EU passports, we then need to depart the Shengen area on our Aussie passports and then re-enter on our EU passports, as we wish to have at least 12 months in the Shengen area. We were wondering which would be the closest non-EU country to France to do this. Very much appreciate any help with advise on this.

You are still confusing EU with Schengen! France is in Schengen, and in order to do what you want, you must exit Schengen and re-enter on your new EU passport. The nearest non-Schengen country is UK or Ireland. so I suggest you take a day trip to UK on a budget airline - if you choose carefully, mid-week, you can probably find a return ticket for 50 euro or less (look out for no-tax, no-fee deals on Ryanair). Or if you are anywhere near the Channel coast, a day trip on a ferry will also be cheap.

[-mia-]

Why don't you apply for your passports at home before traveling to Europe? TBH, I'd be nervous relying on someone telling me my passport will take 30 days. I just wouldn't believe it. Better be safe and apply at home. Maybe I'm too cautious. What country is it?

If you do want to go with plan A, you could go to the UK, Personally I would probably plan a nice week vacation to Egypt, Turkey, Morocco... etc. There are plenty cheap package holidays and you'll be sure to get stamped.

You won't get stamped in any of those mini states on the continent.

[Clic Clac]

Originally Posted by Joppa

You are still confusing EU with Schengen! France is in Schengen, and in order to do what you want, you must exit Schengen and re-enter on your new EU passport. The nearest non-Schengen country is UK or Ireland. so I suggest you take a day trip to UK on a budget airline - if you choose carefully, mid-week, you can probably find a return ticket for 50 euro or less (look out for no-tax, no-fee deals on Ryanair). Or if you are anywhere near the Channel coast, a day trip on a ferry will also be cheap.

Hi Joppa - I think I am also in need of your wisdom :

I am in France on a UK passport (British Citizen).
Is there any time-restriction on my stay here and if so is this "re-set" every time I make a trip back to the UK?

TIA

[_Sarah_]

Originally Posted by Clic Clac

Hi Joppa - I think I am also in need of your wisdom :

I am in France on a UK passport (British Citizen).
Is there any time-restriction on my stay here and if so is this "re-set" every time I make a trip back to the UK?

TIA

...the UK is a member of the European Union, you can stay as long as you want in France.

[Clic Clac]

Originally Posted by Clic Clac

Hi Joppa - I think I am also in need of your wisdom :

I am in France on a UK passport (British Citizen).
Is there any time-restriction on my stay here and if so is this "re-set" every time I make a trip back to the UK?

TIA

This, from the our Foreign Office site seems to partially answer my question, at least from the UK point of view........

Entry Requirements - Passport ValidityYou must hold a valid passport to enter France. For stays of up to three months your passport must be valid for the proposed duration of your stay; you do not need any additional period of validity on your passport beyond this. However, it is always sensible to have a short period of extra validity on your passport in case of any unforeseen delays to your departure. You do not have to wait until your old passport expires to apply to renew it. Any time left on your old passport when you apply will be added to your new passport, up to a maximum of nine months. For passport applications in the UK, you should apply to the Identity and Passport Service. For stays of longer than three months, contact the Embassy of the country to which you are travelling.

[Bevdeforges]

Clic clac, you only need a passport for France because there is no national i.d. card for the UK. You do need a national i.d. to live in France, for various administrative things and to prove your nationality should it become an issue.

As Sarah says, you can stay as long as you want - and you can probably even renew your passport through the British embassy or consulate in France if you don't want to return to the UK to do so.
Cheers,
Bev

[Clic Clac]

Originally Posted by _Sarah_

...the UK is a member of the European Union, you can stay as long as you want in France.

Phew thanks Sarah..

I can relax and get back to the wine lol.

I think the rules must keep changing (?) as I have previously read about having to register with the Prefecture after a certain time but when I arrived the French Passport control waived me straight through without even looking at the passport.

Let's hope the French don't carry out their threat to suspend Schengen after their spat with Italy.