Advice on the logistics of moving to france please

[tragichips]

Hi all,
I am in the early stages of planning a move to france, and seem to be overwhelmed with conflicting info, advice would be much appreciated please.
I plan to move w my long term partner( 15yrs, but never married) and our children. Myself and my children are EU citizens but my partner is Canadian...he has residency status here in the UK.
Our plan is for both of us to continue commuting/working in the uk, myself on a very part time basis, w my partner working more....
My queries:
1) As EU citizens do myself and my children still need a carte de sejour?
I presume my partner definately needs one, can he get one by virtue of being a parent to EU citizen?
2) What do I need to do in order to register mysef and my children for healthcare and school?
3) I think I declare all wordly income made but will only pay tax on employment in the UK is this correct.
4) What should I be doing prior to the move as opposed to in France itself.
5)If we were to marry here or in france is there a length of time needed before my partner can get residency via this route? if he is unable to do so via our children
6) As my partner will be spending at least half year working in the UK does he need residency in France? My reading suggests he does as this will be where the family unit is based...
7)please advise on anything else glaringly obvious!

many thanks in advance, i'm sure this will be the first of many posts....

Helen

[Bevdeforges]

Originally Posted by tragichips

My queries:
1) As EU citizens do myself and my children still need a carte de sejour?
I presume my partner definately needs one, can he get one by virtue of being a parent to EU citizen?
2) What do I need to do in order to register mysef and my children for healthcare and school?
3) I think I declare all wordly income made but will only pay tax on employment in the UK is this correct.
4) What should I be doing prior to the move as opposed to in France itself.
5)If we were to marry here or in france is there a length of time needed before my partner can get residency via this route? if he is unable to do so via our children
6) As my partner will be spending at least half year working in the UK does he need residency in France? My reading suggests he does as this will be where the family unit is based...
7)please advise on anything else glaringly obvious!

Hi, and welcome to the forum.

1. As EU citizens, you may not be able to get cartes de séjour - they are no longer required, and a Brit friend of mine was told that the local préfecture will not issue them to EU nationals. (But as in all things here, your mileage may vary... local préfets seem to have their own ways of doing things.)

Some folks will tell you differently, but what I think your partner will need is a visa to enter France. Get the visa stamped on entry and then he can get a carte de séjour. He needs to go to the local French Consulate and set that process in motion, as it takes a few months.

2. Healthcare is something that is handled through your employment - either by your employer or, if you register as an "independent" you have to register yourself with the appropriate "caisse" for health care and retirement. Evidently there is a form you can get from the UK health services that will get you temporary health services in France - for up to two years, I think it is - but past that point you will need to either be contributing to the French system or to find private insurance.

3. No, not quite. If you are resident in France, you will pay taxes on your worldwide income to the French tax authority. There are treaties with other countries to avoid double taxation, but that depends on what type of other income you have and whether or not it is taxed in the source country.

4. The main thing, I suppose, is looking into getting a visa for your partner. If you're not married it will make things more complicated for him unless he has a "reason" for wanting to live in France.

5. Gee, hard to know what to tell you - I was illegal here for almost two years after marrying my French husband in France. (But then again, I entered France without a visa, based on some bad advice from the French Consulate in Germany...) It's slightly different, in any event, for someone married to an EU national. I suspect things will go easier for you if you were to marry where you are and then apply for his visa. The other option is for you to relocate, then get PACS'ed (civil union in France) and base his visa application on that.

6. If you are married or PACS'ed your partner will be considered to be resident in France (for tax purposes at least) if his family is resident here - probably regardless of how much time he spends elsewhere. If you aren't married or PACS'ed, then you aren't entitled to file together as a household, and I suppose he could have his legal and tax residence elsewhere if he spends 183 days a year outside France and has some sort of ties to another country. But who gets to take credit for the kids on the tax forms is anyone's guess - probably you.

7. Oh, by now I guess you have enough stuff to consider...

The conflicting information is completely normal at this point. You will get conflicting information even from the official agencies here in France. The visa and carte de séjour process is changing constantly these days, and can vary from departement to departement within France. Take things one step at a time and come back with questions as they arise.
Cheers,
Bev

[giantpanda]

Hi!

Just a constructive suggestion.

You have asked too many questions - and the full answers can be very long for each point.

It is preferable to set single questions, where you are going to get several answers.

Now after Bevdeforges has answered,one tends to consider the matter as finished and it is not.

If ever the people wanted to answer on single points, the whole thing gets really unweldy.

Yours,

giantpanda

[parsnips]

If,as you say, both you and your partner will be working in the UK but resident in France,you should discuss your tax and national insurance position with the HMRC centre for non residents on 0845 070040.
Being married will greatly improve your inheritance tax position in France, and once you are established you can adapt your marriage contract to gain maximum advantage.
If you have UK ISAs and other tax free investments which you may need to cash , this is best done before becoming French resident as here they will be subject to Capital Gains Tax.

[tragichips]

Many thanks all 3 of you for your speedy replies/advice, I see I have lots to go on there..., I will look at each point made step by step but start w the uk tax office i think.

My partner as a canadian doesnt need a visa to enter France temporarily.
As he will be returning to the Uk at least every two months does he really need residency? Finacially our meagre savings are tied up in Canada so im not too woried abouth the finacial implications involved w moving rather the legality of the move.

thanks again....
tax office here i come....yikes

helen

[giantpanda]

Hi!

If you want to benefit from the advantages of a partnership ( and it starts straight away with the question of the Health insurance, because possibly you can be tagged on, i.e. without having to pay), you will have to seek residency. But there would be further advantages.

Moteur de recherche service-public.fr : résultats de la recherche

Yours,

giantpanda

[Bevdeforges]

Originally Posted by parsnips

Being married will greatly improve your inheritance tax position in France, and once you are established you can adapt your marriage contract to gain maximum advantage.

One small caveat here... If you get married outside France, the French will determine what sort of marriage contract you have based on the default in the country in which the marriage takes place. (In the US, it varies by state. In Canada, it may vary by province.) If you get married in France, you either must go to a notaire before the marriage to draw up a contract (for the financial side of your marriage) or you will be assumed to have accepted the French default, which is more or less a "community property" regime.

In France, you must live with whatever marriage contract you were married under for two years (I think it is, unless it has changed recently) before you can change this. And changing your regime de marriage is expensive and must be done by a notaire. Figure on 1500 euros or more to change regimes after the wedding - more if the change in regimes involves transferring the ownership of major assets.
Cheers,
Bev

[giantpanda]

Hi!

As soon as your are a French fiscal ( NB. These days you can be fiscal resident in several EC countries ) resident:

Quelle définition l'administration fiscale donne-t-elle de la résidence principale ? - Service-public.fr

Nb. The quote is valid also for the résidence fiscale - only one condition is necessary.

You will have to declare ( calendar year ) your world income ( and taxes you pay in other countries ) - the 1st time you will have to volunteer that, you will not be asked;

If you are partners ( not PACSED, which is aa French measure ) , then you will have to make make sperate income tax returns.

Les concubins déclarent leurs revenus séparément, mais l'ISF en commun

See here the table with the different situations:

PACS, mariage ou concubinage : le comparatif

Yours,

giantpanda

[Bevdeforges]

>>Les concubins déclarent leurs revenus séparément, mais l'ISF en commun<<

Is that true these days? I thought the big scandal about Ségo and François Hollande never getting married was that it was how he was avoiding having to pay ISF on his property (since she is subject to ISF due to an inheritance).

Cheers,
Bev

[Bevdeforges]

Originally Posted by tragichips

My partner as a canadian doesnt need a visa to enter France temporarily.
As he will be returning to the Uk at least every two months does he really need residency?

Be careful with this one. Most people quote you the 183 day thing as if it were enshrined in law, but it isn't. It's more a principle - if your partner spends 183 days in a single calendar year in France (or in any one country) they will presume he is "resident" there unless he can prove to the contrary. (For the UK it's 183 days in a single tax year, starting in April.)

But, the fact that he returns regularly to wherever you are (in France), and that his children are living there and that he is contributing to the household established there (financially or in any other way), heck even the fact of him keeping his extra clothes or a toothbrush there - all that adds up to the argument that he is "resident" in France, even if he doesn't make the 183 day mark.

Coming and going in increments that fit in under the "tourist visa" limitations don't matter - what counts is where his "home base of operations" is and there are many ways to determine that.
Cheers,
Bev