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Assurance vie and retirement - Page 2


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  #11 (permalink)  
Old 23rd September 2010, 08:53 AM
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Originally Posted by parsnips View Post
Hi,
No, I'm not an agent , I am a customer (retired fireman)who after 18 years in France has made a study of all these issues for my own advantage. I have also studied taxes and inheritance.
Thank God! (that you're not an agent)

I've just been in contact with both of the firms you mentioned, Fortuneo and Linxea. Have you been invested with them during the good times and the bad..post Lehmann Bros.?

Like Bev seemed to be saying in her last post, I'm of the same mind and not really interested investing in a high risk assurance vie product with promised double-digit returns...

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Old 23rd September 2010, 12:32 PM
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Originally Posted by goneglobal View Post
Thank God! (that you're not an agent)

I've just been in contact with both of the firms you mentioned, Fortuneo and Linxea. Have you been invested with them during the good times and the bad..post Lehmann Bros.?

Like Bev seemed to be saying in her last post, I'm of the same mind and not really interested investing in a high risk assurance vie product with promised double-digit returns...

Hi,
I've been with Fortuneo since 2005, and Linxea since 2009 (when I reached the govt. guarantee limit on Fortuneo).
I have followed a medium risk policy with ,in Fortuneo, approx. 65% in the guaranteed euro fund (which cannot lose and gives about 4.5% p.a.) and the rest in a selection of equity funds. After declining a lot at the depths of the crisis I am now showing an overall gain of about 3000€.
In Linxea I have 75% in the euro fund and the rest in 3 asian funds which are showing an overall gain of about 8% since Nov. 2009.
To avoid any possibility of loss you can put everything into the euro fund of your chosen manager. Then if you think the markets look promising you can switch (not more than 20-30% into other funds -the fund managers rate them according to degree of risk.

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Old 23rd September 2010, 01:08 PM
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Originally Posted by parsnips View Post
Hi,
I've been with Fortuneo since 2005, and Linxea since 2009 (when I reached the govt. guarantee limit on Fortune)
Thanks for the feedback..

Is the limit you are referring to the maximum amount the French government insures private individual accounts? I read somewhere that it was 90K.. but didn't realize it was for assurance vie contracts as well. Would you have been able to open a second account with Fortuneo to get the government protection?

And if so, a 60K upfront investment would allow for growth of 30K at the current limit, right? At 4.5% a year compounded, with 100% of the principle and interest rolled over each year, that would still be below 90K at the end of eight years.....


Last edited by goneglobal; 23rd September 2010 at 01:13 PM. Reason: error
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Old 23rd September 2010, 03:30 PM
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Originally Posted by goneglobal View Post
Thanks for the feedback..

Is the limit you are referring to the maximum amount the French government insures private individual accounts? I read somewhere that it was 90K.. but didn't realize it was for assurance vie contracts as well. Would you have been able to open a second account with Fortuneo to get the government protection?

And if so, a 60K upfront investment would allow for growth of 30K at the current limit, right? At 4.5% a year compounded, with 100% of the principle and interest rolled over each year, that would still be below 90K at the end of eight years.....
Hi,
The cover was 70 000€, but I think it is to be increased to 100 000€.
Once the limit is reached with one provider, regardless of the number of contracts, it is necessary to move to another to get another lot of cover.

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Old 3rd October 2010, 06:23 AM
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Dear Bev

Beyond what was explained to you: assurance vie is a capitalisation pension scheme which is exonerated from high taxes. Usually interests are paid around 8-9% per year, on a mid term perdio (7-8 years). They are limitations on the accessibility of funds invested.

Above 7-8% per year results, the scheme is bound to high risk financial derivatives which I do not recommend unless you want to spend your time monitoring the financial trends, on an hourly basis. The world economy has just lost 5000 billions USD, and I doubt it will be recovered in a fortnight.

They are 2 relatively safe ways to build a pension scheme in France (converting a foreign pension fund) :
- real estate (profits are in the tune of 6.5 to 9.5%) per year, you buy 2 or 3 flats as an investment, and the rents give you the returns (minus taxes, maintenance and agent fee). It is better to have an SCI (societe civile immobiliere) established in your name by a notaire, than managing in your personal name (for tax purposes). You could also do that in countries where taxes are lower (Luxembourg, Belgium , Austria) and have your income transferred one in while within SEPA.
- assurance vie is contracted from a genuine Assurance Vie company, not your local Caisse d'Epargne (as they also use high risk derivative products. You can contact me in PM for serious companies.

Please note that a return above 10% per year, as some advertise, is either High risk or a fraud scheme.

The risky way is to gamble your capital on the stock exchange if you like that, profits are higher, risks as well. And there is proverb that says, on the the stock exchange the are main 3 players: the banker, the broker/agent and the customer, and among those 3, only 2 make a profit.


Best


Last edited by GALLUS; 3rd October 2010 at 06:28 AM.
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Old 5th October 2010, 03:55 PM
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Originally Posted by GALLUS View Post
Dear Bev

Beyond what was explained to you: assurance vie is a capitalisation pension scheme which is exonerated from high taxes. Usually interests are paid around 8-9% per year, on a mid term perdio (7-8 years). They are limitations on the accessibility of funds invested.

Above 7-8% per year results, the scheme is bound to high risk financial derivatives which I do not recommend unless you want to spend your time monitoring the financial trends, on an hourly basis. The world economy has just lost 5000 billions USD, and I doubt it will be recovered in a fortnight.

They are 2 relatively safe ways to build a pension scheme in France (converting a foreign pension fund) :
- real estate (profits are in the tune of 6.5 to 9.5%) per year, you buy 2 or 3 flats as an investment, and the rents give you the returns (minus taxes, maintenance and agent fee). It is better to have an SCI (societe civile immobiliere) established in your name by a notaire, than managing in your personal name (for tax purposes). You could also do that in countries where taxes are lower (Luxembourg, Belgium , Austria) and have your income transferred one in while within SEPA.
- assurance vie is contracted from a genuine Assurance Vie company, not your local Caisse d'Epargne (as they also use high risk derivative products. You can contact me in PM for serious companies.

Please note that a return above 10% per year, as some advertise, is either High risk or a fraud scheme.

The risky way is to gamble your capital on the stock exchange if you like that, profits are higher, risks as well. And there is proverb that says, on the the stock exchange the are main 3 players: the banker, the broker/agent and the customer, and among those 3, only 2 make a profit.


Best
Hi,
I don't know what product gallus is describing in the first part of his post, but it is certainly not a french euro life assurance plan. To correct just two points--the average interest on a guaranteed fund is around 4% mostly from investments which the funds have in government bonds, and there is usually no restriction (or penalties)on withdrawals.

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Old 25th November 2010, 01:00 PM
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I just found this thread - I'm just in the middle of muddling through this Assurance Vie stuff. My situation is similar to Bev's, but UK-related not USA, and my timing is different.
I am British, now becoming French resident, retired, aged 60. I have some savings in UK PEPs, ISAs, and ordinary bank deposits. I would like some income from these, although I also have a UK sterling income from an annuity.

I came across an independent broker called Abbey Financial Services (they are based in Spain), who recommended I should take an Assurance Vie product, but not one sold by a French company, but to chose one from an off-shore location, their favourites being Luxemburg, Jersey, or Dublin, since these are in the EU, with strong regulation, but the funds can be held in sterling or euros, as I prefer.

They are recommending a product from Irish Life (who are NOT an Irish bank) in Dublin. The overall management fees for running this are about 1.8% per annum, with zero set up cost (although I guess there are some exit fees from my old PEPs). The broker charges no fees (they are paid by Irish Life)

In your thread I was interested in how you recomment chosing the supplier of an Assurance Vie; do you have any comments on what I am looking at? How can you tell if a broker is really independent? If the deal is good? If the Assurance Vie product is safe?

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Old 25th November 2010, 03:34 PM
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Be very careful with the "offshore" insurers. Seems like every time I read the fine print, it excludes citizens and residents of both the US and France. Lots of brokers push these products for Brits, and may not worry too much about the fine print.
Cheers,
Bev

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Old 25th November 2010, 03:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by barbel View Post
I just found this thread - I'm just in the middle of muddling through this Assurance Vie stuff. My situation is similar to Bev's, but UK-related not USA, and my timing is different.
I am British, now becoming French resident, retired, aged 60. I have some savings in UK PEPs, ISAs, and ordinary bank deposits. I would like some income from these, although I also have a UK sterling income from an annuity.

I came across an independent broker called Abbey Financial Services (they are based in Spain), who recommended I should take an Assurance Vie product, but not one sold by a French company, but to chose one from an off-shore location, their favourites being Luxemburg, Jersey, or Dublin, since these are in the EU, with strong regulation, but the funds can be held in sterling or euros, as I prefer.

They are recommending a product from Irish Life (who are NOT an Irish bank) in Dublin. The overall management fees for running this are about 1.8% per annum, with zero set up cost (although I guess there are some exit fees from my old PEPs). The broker charges no fees (they are paid by Irish Life)

In your thread I was interested in how you recomment chosing the supplier of an Assurance Vie; do you have any comments on what I am looking at? How can you tell if a broker is really independent? If the deal is good? If the Assurance Vie product is safe?
Hi,
First point, UK peps and ISAs and other" tax-free" investments are not tax-free in France. If you have equities in your schemes and sell them the capital gains will be taxed ,without any allowances at about 31%. Unless they are really good products you should cash them in BEFORE becoming french fiscal resident.
If you want to invest in french -style life assurance in pounds sterling then the product you have been recommended may be suitable- however I have my doubts about the "no entry fee" claim, and 1.8% p.a. is a bit steep.
If you are going to invest some or all of your savings in €s, then a french on-line life assurance company such as "Fortuneo" or "Linxea", is the cheapest, and easiest to run, option.
No broker who is remunerated in commission from the companies he recommends can be considered as really independent as he will recommend the product which secures him the biggest commission--it's human nature.
All french assurance vie policies are covered by the government guarantee of 70 000€ per company (soon to increase ,I think, to 100 000€.

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Old 13th January 2011, 07:21 AM
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Retirement should be the beginning of one's dream but the realities of making that real and beautiful is constantly fraught with uncertainties in today's economic climate. I personally would like my life to be Zen-like and paper free ( as far as possible) so I am not attracted to all the small prints in insurances and assurances. I agree with goneglobal - the literature is a mind boggle. It'll be like trying to understand cricket on radio for me.
Have you ever considered that putting your well-earned sums into bonds in a couple of good banks ; including off shore ones, can be a simpler and safer returns than taking out life assurances ( which, at maturity, are always less promising even in good times )? The question is, ' Are banks more of a guarantee to pensioners than the Life Insurance/Assurance companies?'
I find that Credit Agricole offers quite good rates of interest for their bonds and even ordinary savings at 2.25 % and slightly above. Hence, a sum of around 150,000 Euros can earn you close to 500 Euros a month. It's simple as that. Moreover, your money is secure and won't fluctuate with the bulls and the bears. The English banks offer good interest rates for savers too.
Hope this helps. Wishing you a great celebration on that day and thank you for all your current good work in this forum Bev.


Last edited by anneteoh; 13th January 2011 at 07:24 AM.
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