Help! Information meltdown re long-stay visa for France

[Tanja]

Originally Posted by Bevdeforges

The 90 days on and off isn't going to add up to the 6 months or a year you need. It's intended to be a full year (or whatever) on a long stay visa.

If you're willing to PACS, you should probably be willing to get married. The differences are negligible. And it's bound to be easier in Australia than in France.

But the big question is, where is he resident at the moment? If he's working outside France and not paying taxes, chances are he isn't resident in France. And that's the big thing working against you. He can take you to live in France with him. But if he's not resident there, your being there full time will establish his residence if you're married. Under French law, married partners share the same residence more or less by definition, and his earnings from the Middle East (I'm assuming someplace like Dubai that doesn't have income taxes) will become taxable in France if you're living there as his wife.
Cheers,
Bev

Thanks again Bev. I really appreciate all your detailed replies.
Will let you know how it pans out...
Cheers Tanja

[Tanja]

Originally Posted by Bevdeforges

The 90 days on and off isn't going to add up to the 6 months or a year you need. It's intended to be a full year (or whatever) on a long stay visa.

If you're willing to PACS, you should probably be willing to get married. The differences are negligible. And it's bound to be easier in Australia than in France.

But the big question is, where is he resident at the moment? If he's working outside France and not paying taxes, chances are he isn't resident in France. And that's the big thing working against you. He can take you to live in France with him. But if he's not resident there, your being there full time will establish his residence if you're married. Under French law, married partners share the same residence more or less by definition, and his earnings from the Middle East (I'm assuming someplace like Dubai that doesn't have income taxes) will become taxable in France if you're living there as his wife.
Cheers,
Bev

Hi Bev

Well I spoke to my other half. Looks like were definitely going back to Australia to do the deed. I'm starting to get used to the idea, so that's all fine.

However, I am still confused about a couple of things...and was hoping you could shine a light on them for me.

1.) The livret de famillie? I am assuming it is issued by the French Consulate in Australia once you give them your marriage certificate?
If that's the case...why is on their list of things to bring bring when applying for the long term visa??? If you get married in Australia then surely they don't need it as it's a French custom/procedure.
Unfortunately I can't contact them and ask them via email. Here's the link: (more research for your book )

Long Stay Visa for Foreign Spouse of a French citizen - La France en Australie

And if they do issue it at the consulate, why are people suggesting it takes 3-4 months to receive?

2.) Should I be applying for the 'Vie Privee et Familiale Carte de Sejour' when I'm in Australia, once we're married?

3.) Can I work with this once I'm in France or is there another waiting period? Another carte?

Thanks for your patients Bev. I promise I'll leave you alone after this one.

Did you say that you've had some theatre training in the past? If that's so then that's something we have in common....but that's another story best saved for another time.
Cheers
Tanja

[Bevdeforges]

Originally Posted by Tanja

1.) The livret de famillie? I am assuming it is issued by the French Consulate in Australia once you give them your marriage certificate?
If that's the case...why is on their list of things to bring bring when applying for the long term visa??? If you get married in Australia then surely they don't need it as it's a French custom/procedure.
Unfortunately I can't contact them and ask them via email. Here's the link: (more research for your book )

Long Stay Visa for Foreign Spouse of a French citizen - La France en Australie

And if they do issue it at the consulate, why are people suggesting it takes 3-4 months to receive?

If you are married overseas, it's the French Consulate that issues your Livret de Famille. And basically, you can't apply for your visa de long séjour based on marriage to a French national until you have your Livret de Famille.

Check back through the archives here on the forum. There are a few threads dealing with the process for getting a livret de famille in the US. Most of those seem to indicate that the delay in the process is getting the appropriate certification for your foreign marriage certificate. You can't just show them the certificate they give you after your marriage - it has to be stamped or certified by some authority in Australia to make it acceptable to the French Consulate.

Technically, they should be able to issue the livret on the spot - but they may have to send things back to France to be officially recorded in all the places this needs to be done. (The French update a person's birth certificate when they get married - I guess to guard against bigamists.)

2.) Should I be applying for the 'Vie Privee et Familiale Carte de Sejour' when I'm in Australia, once we're married?

You can't apply for any sort of carte de séjour until after you get to France. And basically, you just apply for a carte de séjour. They give you whichever one they choose to give you. The fact that you qualified for your visa based on being the spouse of a French citizen means they'll give you the appropriate carte de séjour (i.e. with working privileges more or less right away).

3.) Can I work with this once I'm in France or is there another waiting period? Another carte?

According to the OFII, you may not even need a carte de séjour - just to have a stamp placed in your passport. Unfortunately, the English translations on the OFII website OFII - Office Français de l’Immigration et de l’Intégration leave alot to be desired. You're better off if you can read all this stuff from the French part of the website. And there is always the little matter of variations in procedure you may run into as you work your way through the administrative maze.

Cheers,
Bev

[Tanja]

Originally Posted by Bevdeforges

If you are married overseas, it's the French Consulate that issues your Livret de Famille. And basically, you can't apply for your visa de long séjour based on marriage to a French national until you have your Livret de Famille.

Check back through the archives here on the forum. There are a few threads dealing with the process for getting a livret de famille in the US. Most of those seem to indicate that the delay in the process is getting the appropriate certification for your foreign marriage certificate. You can't just show them the certificate they give you after your marriage - it has to be stamped or certified by some authority in Australia to make it acceptable to the French Consulate.

Technically, they should be able to issue the livret on the spot - but they may have to send things back to France to be officially recorded in all the places this needs to be done. (The French update a person's birth certificate when they get married - I guess to guard against bigamists.)



You can't apply for any sort of carte de séjour until after you get to France. And basically, you just apply for a carte de séjour. They give you whichever one they choose to give you. The fact that you qualified for your visa based on being the spouse of a French citizen means they'll give you the appropriate carte de séjour (i.e. with working privileges more or less right away).



According to the OFII, you may not even need a carte de séjour - just to have a stamp placed in your passport. Unfortunately, the English translations on the OFII website OFII - Office Français de l’Immigration et de l’Intégration leave alot to be desired. You're better off if you can read all this stuff from the French part of the website. And there is always the little matter of variations in procedure you may run into as you work your way through the administrative maze.

Cheers,
Bev

Thanks so much. You are truly amazing. What would all these expats do without you? We're all nervous wrecks here. But obviously you see that every day via the emails you receive...all that angst. Cheers Tanja

[Bevdeforges]

Originally Posted by Tanja

Thanks so much. You are truly amazing. What would all these expats do without you? We're all nervous wrecks here. But obviously you see that every day via the emails you receive...all that angst. Cheers Tanja

Gee, thanks. I only wish I'd had me to help myself back when I was a newbie in France. I'm just trying to keep other folks from finding themselves in the main lobby of the préfecture, screaming English obscenities for all to hear. It's momentarily satisfying, but it doesn't do you any good in the long run (as I found out).
Cheers,
Bev

[MataMata]

Originally Posted by Tanja

In order for me to stay here in peace... we wanted to get married, but discovered we cant because my partner doesn't have a Tax file number as he works overseas... mostly the middle east and hasn't paid taxes for years. So that's out.

Is this really the case ?

Certainly I'm no expert in the field but surely as a French national tax matters are between him and the French tax authorities and not a bar to marriage ?

Regardless of working overseas if he is tax resident in France then I think he should still have been completing an annual return and hence have a tax reference number.

Of course if he has been avoiding paying tax in France when he should have been then it turns into an entirely different situation.

Bonne chance

[glentheleg]

Tanja,

Hello fellow Australian beating your way through french bureaucracy!

I've been living in France with my partner for 1 year (yesterday), we were pacs'd 3 weeks ago, and yesterday we went to the Prefecture with my documents for a carte de sejour vie privée et familiale. All went smoothly and now I just have a doctors visit, and several hundred euros to pay and I'm home and hosed as it were.

Now, my situation is a tiny bit different from yours so I'm going to explain what I did and you can take it or leave it.

Basically if you've lived in France for a year and are pacs'd you have almost the same rights as someone who's married to a French person (so the lovely lady at the prefecture told us).

To start with, I spent my first year here legally on a visa vacances travail (working holiday visa), which meant that I'm legal. So this may be an option for you if you're under 30. France offers 1 year working visas to Australians (for $150), but you do now have to be in Australia to apply for one. Mine took a total of 3 weeks to complete, though, so it was rather swift. You also have to prove funds, but a total of 2000E instead of a whole year worth of money to support yourself with. This visa has no particular restrictions on the type of work that can be done, it just doesn't give you any access to the social security services.

When I was at the prefecture they were very particular about seeing that I'd had a visa for the entire time I was here, so I'd be rather wary about normalising your situation after being here semi-illegally.

Not really sure if this is a road you want to go down, or if any of this info is of help, but do let us know what happens in the end.

Glen.

Originally Posted by Tanja

Dearest Bev
Thank you so much for taking the time to reply. It's so nice that there are people out there who actually care. Let me know when you finish your book, because I'll be the first one to buy it.

I guess we have been living together legally...during the times I have been allowed to stay on my tourist visa....the 90 days....on and off for over a year now.
The phone bill is even in my name.
So not sure about that one. That remains a mystery.

As far as the appointment on the 27th of Nov; That's at the Tribunal D'Instance De Marseille. It's the day we need to bring in our papers etc.
But honestly, I'm not sure we'll go through with that one.
If we PACS it means I have to go back (have to go back to Australia either way) and prove that I can support myself for one year...and I just don't have the 20 000 euro they're asking. Also I read that you can't apply for a spouse visa if you're PACSed...
so then I'm not sure I'm allowed to work the first year or not? Probably not if I have to show them how much money I have.

Whereas if we're married I'm pretty sure I can.
Hence, I feel the best and easiest way is to get married either here or Australia and then go back to apply for the long-term visa once I have the livret de famille.
My only concern is that by the time all of that is organized - perhaps in another month or two, I would have long overstayed my welcome here, and I don't want to get into any trouble or possible jeopardize my application.
Not sure if I can organize it all from here if I'm not even supposed to be here? Do they even care? Do they want to see the long-term visa before they marry us?
I'm not sure anyone can answer that?
Thanks so much for your support.
Cheers
Tanja