French Fiancé Visa MESS (Visa en vue de mariage...)

[miaou]

Hello everyone,

I'm new here, but have been lurking a little while to see how others have been dealing with the new French immigration laws...I'd like to share my story to see if anyone else has been facing the same problem...

Once I became engaged at the beginning of 2009, my fiancé (now husband) and I decided that I come to France to be with him and live in France for the foreseeable future. In effect, we figured that the French fiancé visa (Visa long sejour en vue de mariage avec un ressortissant français et pour s'installer en France) would suit our purposes since we both wanted to get married in France.

Of course, the day I applied for this visa at the consulate (June 1st, 2009) was the day the new immigration laws came into effect. And on June 1st, the fiancé visa (Visa en vue de mariage...) no longer existed. Normally before 6/1, they would give me a visa long sejour visiteur, where after the wedding, I would go to the Préfecture to receive a carte de séjour (mention vie privée et familiale)

So, according to the new rules, the consulate issued me a visa long sejour mention Visiteur (valid for one year) so I can come to France, marry my fiancé in France, and live in France...I arrived in June, and sent off my OFII form to the OFII office as soon as I arrived. We got married this past July, checked the service public website to see if there were any updates about the next step to obtain a carte de séjour, and mistakenly thought that anyone with a visa long sejour would have the right to work under the new law. So, I started applying for jobs and everything! After a few of the temp agencies told me that my visa long sejour was not acceptable proof of the right to work, we started to do research and found that with a visa long sejour mention visiteur, I did not have the right to work in France.

So, We cross checked the French consulate website, which indicated that once married, I would have to go to the Préfecture to do a "changement de statut" from visiteur to conjoint de français.

I went to the préfecture the other day, and explained my situation to a rather unfriendly fonctionnaire. He explained that it was impossible to change my status...the only way to change my status to conjoint de français would be to 1) wait 6 months and come back with proof that I've been living with my husband for those 6 months, 2) wait 2 months before the expiration of my visa long sejour in which I would then ask for a change in status, or 3) go back to New York and apply for a new visa. None of these options are very preferable...I need to earn an income as my husband is stretching quite a bit to take care of our expenses with his salary alone.

We've called an immigration attorney to see if we can sort things out with his help. So, next Monday, my husband took a half day off of work so we can go to the prefecture together and straighten things out by ourselves...otherwise, we go to keep our appointment with the attorney later that evening...

Sorry for the long winded post, but it's been something that has been stressing me out and keeping me up at night!

[Bevdeforges]

Believe me, I sympathize completely. My immigration hassles were all caused by bad information I got at the French consulate, too. But the term "unfriendly fonctionnaire" is truly a redundancy - 90% of the time you'll find them so.

One thing you're caught up in is the change in the law. Yes, the effective date of the change was June 1st, but no one expects the procedural information to hit the consulates around the world until after the summer holiday period. And one great truth to dealing with French fonctionnaires is that, if they aren't sure what to tell you, they'll make something up.

OK, when you go to the prefecture on Monday, be ever so nice to whoever you speak to. Be absolutely obsequious if you have to. (Your husband, too.) It may well be possible for someone there to sort you out, but no one will if you even mention that you have an appointment with an attorney later that day. Do explain that you were following the instructions you were given at the French consulate and seem to have run afoul of the change in the law.

According to the information on the OFII website OFII - Office Français de l’Immigration et de l’Intégration you don't need to have a carte de séjour your first year in France. But the problem you'll run into is that the employers here don't know that, and will shy away from hiring you if you can't produce your cds. (I suspect this is a ploy to keep newly arrived spouses out of the workplace.)

Try not to let it stress you out, and above all, do NOT lose your cool at the prefecture. Don't tell them what the law is, but rather ask them, "what can I do?" and "can you help me?" (In all innocence, if you can muster it.) It will get you considerably farther. (And it always helps to have a friend at the prefecture.)

If worse comes to worse, you might have to arrange a trip back "home" to reapply for the proper visa and re-enter France. But I'd be surprised if someone can't get you through the maze over here (maybe even the immigration attorney). Just remember, nothing happens fast in France, and right now you're at the height of vacation season. Things may go a bit smoother for you after the Rentrée.
Cheers,
Bev

[iwannabefrench]

So, how did it all work out for you? ... I'm engaged to a french woman and am looking down the same long list of administrative nightmares. was the immigration lawyer of any help? if so, who did you use? ... i hate this. there are so many questions and seemingly nowhere to get answers.

[Snodge]

Not that I have much experience with the system yet, but it seems one way to ease the problems would be to get married before going to France and then you wouldn't get a visitor visa and wouldn't have to change status. If you have your heart set on a wedding in France, just do a quickie one in the US and then a full blown ceremony in France.

[Bevdeforges]

Originally Posted by iwannabefrench

So, how did it all work out for you? ... I'm engaged to a french woman and am looking down the same long list of administrative nightmares. was the immigration lawyer of any help? if so, who did you use? ... i hate this. there are so many questions and seemingly nowhere to get answers.

From my experience (15 years ago) I can definitely advise you to do whatever you can to get a visa BEFORE you go to France (no matter where you choose to get married). It's expensive and it's a royal pain the butt, however if you bring a lawyer into the situation things will get trickier real fast.

I wound up having to go before a tribunal to get my papers. There were about a dozen of us in similar circumstances, all having our cases heard in sequence. Several of us had attorneys, but due to some horrific traffic jam, all the attorneys involved were late to the proceedings. The first two people called asked to have their sessions postponed until their attorneys arrived, and I could tell from the reaction of the judges that this was NOT a positive factor. So when I got called up and my attorney had not yet arrived, I simply stepped forward, said nothing and got on with things with no mention of the missing attorney.

While I think all of us wound up getting our situations cleared, I think my case went much quicker thanks to my decision not to wait for the attorney. It can be seen as a very "American approach" to the problem and taken quite the wrong way.
Cheers,
Bev

[iwannabefrench]

How did you end up resolving your visa situation? I am about to go back to the states to get a visa long-sejour and need to figure out how I can get the right to work in France. It has already been a huge pain to get all the papers to file for the marriage, let alone the visa for the long-sejour. Now, wow, there is yet another problem of getting the right to work!

The whole process has been keeping me up at night too!

cheers

[frogblogger]

Originally Posted by Snodge

Not that I have much experience with the system yet, but it seems one way to ease the problems would be to get married before going to France and then you wouldn't get a visitor visa and wouldn't have to change status. If you have your heart set on a wedding in France, just do a quickie one in the US and then a full blown ceremony in France.

That's what we have done, my Thai wife is shortly to go through the French administrative grinder with her (long stay spouse) visa interview coming up on October 6th in Bangkok.

As discussed in another current thread, for non-Francophone spousal long-stay visa applicants, the French consulates are gradually and haphazardly introducing a language test that takes place at the time of the visa interview. Not particularly hard, but worth being prepared. Already in operation in Canada, Ukraine, some North African countries, due to be introduced imminently in Thailand, soon in Japan. Failing the test means the visa request is refused, and applicants have to take a language course for a number of weeks, before submitting the paperwork again.

I have no information about other countries, but even if there is nothing about it on the Consulate's website for your country, it's worth phoning or emailing them to check. In Thailand's case there's nothing about it on the website or in information emailed to would-be immigrants, but the system is supposed to be up and running in Bangkok w.e.f. October 1st. A few Thais turning up for their interview early October are going to have a nasty surprise...

PS iwaanabefrench

After you sent off the OFII form, were you contacted for an interview, medical check-up, etc?

[iwannabefrench]

I haven't applied for the visa de long-sejour yet. I am still in france and planning to return in a few weeks to apply. Then, hope to return to France for our wedding in the fall....

I'm getting a bit scared about the whole process cause I'm not sure if I am going through the right steps... A marriage outside of France doesn't really fit into either of our plans/schedules. I just hope that they'll issue me the visa so i can at least return for the wedding here.

cheers

[Coton90]

Originally Posted by frogblogger

That's what we have done, my Thai wife is shortly to go through the French administrative grinder with her (long stay spouse) visa interview coming up on October 6th in Bangkok.

As discussed in another current thread, for non-Francophone spousal long-stay visa applicants, the French consulates are gradually and haphazardly introducing a language test that takes place at the time of the visa interview. Not particularly hard, but worth being prepared. Already in operation in Canada, Ukraine, some North African countries, due to be introduced imminently in Thailand, soon in Japan. Failing the test means the visa request is refused, and applicants have to take a language course for a number of weeks, before submitting the paperwork again.

I have no information about other countries, but even if there is nothing about it on the Consulate's website for your country, it's worth phoning or emailing them to check. In Thailand's case there's nothing about it on the website or in information emailed to would-be immigrants, but the system is supposed to be up and running in Bangkok w.e.f. October 1st. A few Thais turning up for their interview early October are going to have a nasty surprise...

PS iwaanabefrench

After you sent off the OFII form, were you contacted for an interview, medical check-up, etc?

I recently obtained my long-term VISA from the French Consulate in Washington D.C. I was not asked to take a language test. The fact that I spoke to the interviewer exclusively in French and asked her things like how did she like living in D.C, may have had something to do with it.

[Bevdeforges]

Originally Posted by iwannabefrench

How did you end up resolving your visa situation? I am about to go back to the states to get a visa long-sejour and need to figure out how I can get the right to work in France. It has already been a huge pain to get all the papers to file for the marriage, let alone the visa for the long-sejour. Now, wow, there is yet another problem of getting the right to work!

The whole process has been keeping me up at night too!

cheers

There used to be a two year delay between getting a spouse visa and getting the right to work. That has been eliminated - in part, I suspect, because of the EU regulation requiring member countries to allow non-EU spouses of EU nationals all the same rights as the EU partner.

According to everything I've seen on the current spousal or fiancé visa for France, you will have the right to work once you've registered with the OFII (since they don't give you a carte de séjour for at least the first year now). Finding a job in France is a whole nuther question...
Cheers,
Bev