Anybody know what Du Telecom are like to work for?

Originally Posted by DesertStranded

Actually, every JD I read out here says you need to work well under stress.

So what makes you want to move to Dubai if you don't mind my asking?

1. Adventure - we (wife and I) have never lived in or visited an Arab country. And
it's time for us to do something quite different.
2. Money

Currently, our requirement is 1. and 2. And we're trying to suss out both.

[DesertStranded]

Originally Posted by Contemplator

1. Adventure - we (wife and I) have never lived in or visited an Arab country. And
it's time for us to do something quite different..

That's a good enough reason. I'd kind of like to live in South America, either Brazil or Argentina, just for the change in scenery. Unfortunately, I don't see my fiance faring any better in finding IT jobs there than he is here.

[gforce23]

Apologies for the delay in getting back to you. I'm in the midst of a delivering a client project and things are getting a bit out of hand at the moment.

Anyhow, it may come as a surprise to you but I'm actually leaning a wee bit towards AD. According to my friends in Dubai and Sharjah, the construction and traffic is just insane right now. AD seems to be a bit more laid back and the traffic's a bit better. It's true that the renting in AD is becoming less viable by the minute and you'd be wasting a lot of time trying to find one but I still think that a medium sized apartment/villa is cheaper in the national capital than the tourism capital. Maybe some expert can chip in here yah?

Anyhow, I had applied to both companies for a couple of positions way back in August. Ironically, there's a counter on the Du page that lists the number of times that your application has been viewed. Mine stands at 10 if I remember correctly. Methinks the only way to get into Du is via a recruitment agency. Etisalat's first e-mail was an automated "we've received your app bla bla bla" via Bayt. The following week, someone called me to ask if I were interested in a particular role that was a bit different from the one I had originally applied for. After 2 phone calls, they stopped responding to my status requests via e-mail and finally got back to me last week with another interview request. I've replied in the affirmative and have even volunteered to fly down to the UAE and meet the hiring managers in person.

Unfortunately, that's were the good news with Etisalat ends. I've done a lot of research on the two firms and it seems that remuneration at the bigger firm is less than what Du pays for a similar role. The rate of attrition seems to be a bit higher than average too (based on my first hand knowledge of AT&T, Telstra & T-Mobile). Anyhow, have you taken a look at this (etisalat-careers.ae/careers/english/grades.jsp?grade=#) page? Managerial positions should be close to grade 22/23 since a bit of Google sleuthing reveals that engineering roles are grade 20, so that should give you a rough idea of the benefits/perks involved. I have no idea of a tangible amount but I wouldn't wager a bet on the housing allowance being more than 15K AED.

Originally Posted by gforce23

Apologies for the delay in getting back to you. I'm in the midst of a delivering a client project and things are getting a bit out of hand at the moment.

Anyhow, it may come as a surprise to you but I'm actually leaning a wee bit towards AD. According to my friends in Dubai and Sharjah, the construction and traffic is just insane right now. AD seems to be a bit more laid back and the traffic's a bit better. It's true that the renting in AD is becoming less viable by the minute and you'd be wasting a lot of time trying to find one but I still think that a medium sized apartment/villa is cheaper in the national capital than the tourism capital. Maybe some expert can chip in here yah?

Anyhow, I had applied to both companies for a couple of positions way back in August. Ironically, there's a counter on the Du page that lists the number of times that your application has been viewed. Mine stands at 10 if I remember correctly. Methinks the only way to get into Du is via a recruitment agency. Etisalat's first e-mail was an automated "we've received your app bla bla bla" via Bayt. The following week, someone called me to ask if I were interested in a particular role that was a bit different from the one I had originally applied for. After 2 phone calls, they stopped responding to my status requests via e-mail and finally got back to me last week with another interview request. I've replied in the affirmative and have even volunteered to fly down to the UAE and meet the hiring managers in person.

Unfortunately, that's were the good news with Etisalat ends. I've done a lot of research on the two firms and it seems that remuneration at the bigger firm is less than what Du pays for a similar role. The rate of attrition seems to be a bit higher than average too (based on my first hand knowledge of AT&T, Telstra & T-Mobile). Anyhow, have you taken a look at this (etisalat-careers.ae/careers/english/grades.jsp?grade=#) page? Managerial positions should be close to grade 22/23 since a bit of Google sleuthing reveals that engineering roles are grade 20, so that should give you a rough idea of the benefits/perks involved. I have no idea of a tangible amount but I wouldn't wager a bet on the housing allowance being more than 15K AED.

Thanks gforce23, some interesting stuff.

Good points about AD vs Dubai. I'm now widening my job search to include AD. Again, the main financial issue still seems to be the cost of accommodation. It can beggar you if you don't correctly allow for it.

That's interesting about the counter at the Du site showing the number of views. And the months that have past since you applied. I don't know what is normal in the UAE but, here in Australia, it can take 3/4 months to get an offer ie. just because one has heard nothing for a number of months doesn't mean one's application is dead in the water.

One point which interests me is that Etisalat are still actively considering your application well after the current global financial disaster had commenced. I note in another thread some unfortunate guy in the building industry had resigned his job at home, his wife had resigned, rented out his house and then had his contract canceled before he left Australia. And I think about the chances of that happening or being retrenched not long after starting work in the UAE. Really, nowhere is safe these days (I hear this morning that Citibank is retrenching a further 50,000 staff world wide after previously retrenching 35,000 ie. in total, a touch over 1 in 5 retrenched). Possibly an oil pumping country will ride it about better than most. Who knows. Sometimes you just have to have a go, knowing that from time to time you're gonna get mugged.

I'd seen the Etisalat page of job Grades but I hadn't been able to work out what job is at what level. Thanks for that.

I've attached a 2008 Salary Survey for IT roles in the UAE from a mob called Charterhouse (headhunters - http://www.charterhouseme.ae/pdf/Sal...e%20-%20IT.pdf). You may well have seen it already. Food for thought.

[K!tt!è]

Hi all hope u all are well,im kinda new here so i wouldnt no how to start my own 'thread'im jus curious WHERE DO U GET THESE VACANCIES! i have been jobhunting 4 last 7months,the agencies in UAE are totally hopeless,oh im in cape town,south africa and here these agencies recruit 4 hotels in UAE for minimum wage,if im to move to UAE then it should be worth my while,dont no why its such a shlep getting an agency or company to recruit fr0m S.A.

[gforce23]

@Contemplator:
Citibank's edging back a bit, thanks to the efforts of the US government, although I'm guessing that the CEO is going to be KO'ed in all of this.

Thanks for that document. I'm not too sure if its accurate though. It seems that an average senior telco engineer earns more than his manager!

If I may take the liberty of creating an approximate package for a telecom manager based off the information on the Etisalat web site, it seems that the overall offer is slightly on the lower side tbh.

Base: 35K (from your document)
Housing: 15K (based on my research)
Transport allowance: probably enough for a mid-sized car or SUV
National allowance: N/A since we're western expats
Children educational allowance: N/A in my case but I'm guessing it'll cover the cost of education at an American/British school
Utility allowance: 500-1000 AED, I suppose for power, gas, water etc.
Air passage: I'm hoping for a BC/BE ticket but I'll assume economy for now
Vacation allowance: same as national allowance and therefore N/A
Telephone rebate: I'd be happier if they'd cover my cell phone/Blackberry usage bill. 500 AED is my guesstimate based on my current usage pattern in the US and UK.
Medical Insurance: included

I'm not too sure how it works for you guys in Oz but us Americans have to pay taxes on income over $85K (or 311K AED/year), which does take some of the sheen off that "tax free" job. Guess I'll wait for either telco firm to make an offer and decide after that. Anyhow, the holy month of Hajj (sp?) has just begun in the Middle East and if its anything like Ramadan, the hiring managers won't be getting back to us anytime soon.

@K!tt!e
Sorry, I don't have a circumflex key on my laptop and can't get that "e" in your name. Anyhow, take a look at the major job web sites like Bayt, GulfTalent, JobsInDubai etc. in addition to the careers portal of all the relevant multi-national companies who have a presence in the UAE market. Bombarding applications is the easy bit; its the pre-app or research phase that'll take some time. Keep applying and don't lose hope. You might want to reach out to someone on here who's in the same industry (I'm assuming hospitality??). Good luck!

Originally Posted by gforce23

@Contemplator:
Citibank's edging back a bit, thanks to the efforts of the US government, although I'm guessing that the CEO is going to be KO'ed in all of this.

Thanks for that document. I'm not too sure if its accurate though. It seems that an average senior telco engineer earns more than his manager!

If I may take the liberty of creating an approximate package for a telecom manager based off the information on the Etisalat web site, it seems that the overall offer is slightly on the lower side tbh.

Base: 35K (from your document)
Housing: 15K (based on my research)
Transport allowance: probably enough for a mid-sized car or SUV
National allowance: N/A since we're western expats
Children educational allowance: N/A in my case but I'm guessing it'll cover the cost of education at an American/British school
Utility allowance: 500-1000 AED, I suppose for power, gas, water etc.
Air passage: I'm hoping for a BC/BE ticket but I'll assume economy for now
Vacation allowance: same as national allowance and therefore N/A
Telephone rebate: I'd be happier if they'd cover my cell phone/Blackberry usage bill. 500 AED is my guesstimate based on my current usage pattern in the US and UK.
Medical Insurance: included

I'm not too sure how it works for you guys in Oz but us Americans have to pay taxes on income over $85K (or 311K AED/year), which does take some of the sheen off that "tax free" job. Guess I'll wait for either telco firm to make an offer and decide after that. Anyhow, the holy month of Hajj (sp?) has just begun in the Middle East and if its anything like Ramadan, the hiring managers won't be getting back to us anytime soon.

@K!tt!e
Sorry, I don't have a circumflex key on my laptop and can't get that "e" in your name. Anyhow, take a look at the major job web sites like Bayt, GulfTalent, JobsInDubai etc. in addition to the careers portal of all the relevant multi-national companies who have a presence in the UAE market. Bombarding applications is the easy bit; its the pre-app or research phase that'll take some time. Keep applying and don't lose hope. You might want to reach out to someone on here who's in the same industry (I'm assuming hospitality??). Good luck!

I like your offer, I'll take it, when do I start???

That package very much looks like what may be on offer. Again, I think the big item is the Housing Allowance, both in the first year and all out years ie. no point in having the first 12 months covered with a fixed allowance if the rent for year 2 is 25% - 50% higher and the increases in following years are again high. Particularly in AD. I think one could go from accumulating a nice sum to barely being able to afford one’s next beer.

The big unknown, I guess, is whether the big two telcos are going into cost-saving, batten down the hatches mode. I’ve seen a number of recent posts where some unfortunate folks have had their contracts cancelled or have been retrenched. The occupations that they have been working in have nearly all been construction/building. I haven’t seen a telco yet. Or IT infrastructure for that matter. Fingers crossed.

Very kindly, my government (Australia) does not tax any foreign earning while one is a resident of that country.

Best of luck with the offers. Hope they roll in. And with a package that will require a larger wallet.

[gforce23]

You made some valid observations. Thankfully, the telecom sector is still going strong in many parts of the world. FWIW, Etisalat is going on a buying spree with its $3B stockpile of cash. A few companies that are partially owned by them have been signing B/OSS deals with us. In the scheme of things, Etisalat's outlook seems to be quite bullish at the moment.

Anyhow, a couple of new jobs have popped up on the Du web site. You might want to take a look.

[nm62]

Hi
Just wanted to add if you have Masters Degree you automatically gets a Grade higher.

[gforce23]

Originally Posted by nm62

Hi
Just wanted to add if you have Masters Degree you automatically gets a Grade higher.

Got one right here. I'm guessing you're an employee, is it?