Summer trial, then hopefully moving in 18 months - Page 2

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Summer trial, then hopefully moving in 18 months - Page 2


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Old 6th February 2012, 09:57 AM
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Very sensible advice Veronica, I was thinking that is what we will have to do, doesn't look like we have much choice for now unfortunately. Will just have to stick to visits for a few more years and see how things are again in 6 years when then stakes aren't so high i.e my youngest's education and happiness. Thank you again.
I would definitely wait until your youngest is out of school. The free schools here are in Greek and they are not good generally. Private schools cost an arm and a leg. Jobs are extremely hard to come by, especially if you are not Cypriot.

I am an American and moved here with my husband 15 months ago. It was a HUGE culture shock. (we lived in the UK for 4 years before). My husband is Greek Cypriot and his family lives in our village so it wasn't as hard for him. For your kid's sake I would just wait. Let them finish out school in peace. Sorry to be a downer but I think it is only fair for the kids to wait if you can. And don't buy anything when you move here- rent first. And if you do buy- the homes built by property developers and sold cheap are not made well.

Visiting Cyprus is so much better than living here. It can be so frustrating. Everything is so expensive here. Also you have to jump through hoops to get anything official ever done. Cypriots govt is not organized at all. Be prepared to be frustrated even just parking at the grocery store as Cypriots tend to take up two spaces for each car and park in handicapped regularly. (this drives my husband nuts and he is Cypriot!) I am stuck here the rest of my life. I cried for months and months. Now I help rescue animals and it gives me a reason to be here.

That is another thing, The animal welfare situation is horrible in Cyprus. So many dogs are locked in cages and never let out (cages rarely cleaned- sometimes fed once a week- especially hunting dogs) On my block alone there are at least 20 such caged dogs. Abuse and neglect runs rampant.

It seems in the cities some people are more enlightened on such things than in the villages. The villages are stuck in 1950 when it comes to animal welfare. I live next door to and across from caged dogs and it is pitiful and sad. I talked the people next door into at least letting me walk their poor dog, a beautiful boxer. I tried to talk them into letting me find her a good home but no, she is their property. It's frustrating and sad. Many animal rescuers are threatened by hunters/neglectful owners who say they will shoot them. Most Cypriots can be nice to people but they crap on animals. And generally most Cypriots will be nice to you but will talk about how dirty English and Americans are (because a lot of Cypriots are neat freaks). And if you keep an animal in your house they will think you are extra dirty and may not even come into your house.

Sorry for being so jaded- maybe it's village life... I am in a village 20 min from Larnaca and right next to Dhekalia.

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Old 7th February 2012, 11:35 AM
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I would definitely wait until your youngest is out of school. The free schools here are in Greek and they are not good generally. Private schools cost an arm and a leg. Jobs are extremely hard to come by, especially if you are not Cypriot.

I am an American and moved here with my husband 15 months ago. It was a HUGE culture shock. (we lived in the UK for 4 years before). My husband is Greek Cypriot and his family lives in our village so it wasn't as hard for him. For your kid's sake I would just wait. Let them finish out school in peace. Sorry to be a downer but I think it is only fair for the kids to wait if you can. And don't buy anything when you move here- rent first. And if you do buy- the homes built by property developers and sold cheap are not made well.

Visiting Cyprus is so much better than living here. It can be so frustrating. Everything is so expensive here. Also you have to jump through hoops to get anything official ever done. Cypriots govt is not organized at all. Be prepared to be frustrated even just parking at the grocery store as Cypriots tend to take up two spaces for each car and park in handicapped regularly. (this drives my husband nuts and he is Cypriot!) I am stuck here the rest of my life. I cried for months and months. Now I help rescue animals and it gives me a reason to be here.

That is another thing, The animal welfare situation is horrible in Cyprus. So many dogs are locked in cages and never let out (cages rarely cleaned- sometimes fed once a week- especially hunting dogs) On my block alone there are at least 20 such caged dogs. Abuse and neglect runs rampant.

It seems in the cities some people are more enlightened on such things than in the villages. The villages are stuck in 1950 when it comes to animal welfare. I live next door to and across from caged dogs and it is pitiful and sad. I talked the people next door into at least letting me walk their poor dog, a beautiful boxer. I tried to talk them into letting me find her a good home but no, she is their property. It's frustrating and sad. Many animal rescuers are threatened by hunters/neglectful owners who say they will shoot them. Most Cypriots can be nice to people but they crap on animals. And generally most Cypriots will be nice to you but will talk about how dirty English and Americans are (because a lot of Cypriots are neat freaks). And if you keep an animal in your house they will think you are extra dirty and may not even come into your house.

Sorry for being so jaded- maybe it's village life... I am in a village 20 min from Larnaca and right next to Dhekalia.
Americanha: Oh dear, what a depressing response. While I agree with the conclusions most people have expressed with moving to Cyprus, I do think one of the worst features here is the whinging ex-pats who expect everything to be the same as their home country.

There are many categories of prices that are more expensive than the UK and many things that are much cheaper. Overall we find our cost of living to be the same as the UK.

The treatment of animals is much the same in most countries on this side of the world and the picture painted is too bleak. We have caged dogs near us who are cleaned out each day, fed twice a day and when we see them let out are perfectly happy animals. Although we would not choose to keep our dog this way, to suggest that all animals are treated badly is wrong.

The comment on parking also made me smile. If there's one thing that's easy here it's parking and very rarely with a charge. Lane discipline both on the road and in car parks tends to be poor, but who cares if a car took up 2 spaces - there's plenty of others!

Cyprus Government undoubtedly needs its procedures updating and simplifying, they are rather like the UK 50 years ago, but this will slowly happen like the recent census which was handled efficiently and informatively particularly the comprehensive web site that was set up.

I have never heard a Cypriot suggest the British and Americans are dirty and my overall experience would rate them as helpful, friendly and generous people, with the occasional exception of those stuck in the EOKA time-warp. None have refused to come in our house because of the dog, but of course we do keep him away from some of them when they express the all too common fear of dogs.

Tracylo09: My thoughts on your situation would be to think very carefully. If you were retiring here I would say go ahead but with children's education and jobs to consider you will find it a tough environment in most places of the world right now. If you do decide to come plan a fall-back position in case it doesn't work out, do travel round the island to see where you might live - we did and nothing would get me to live on the east side once I'd seen the beauty of the west and mid areas. As others have said do not buy a home, it is essential to rent right now at least until the market recovers. Above all try to take off the rose tinted glasses and enjoy Cyprus for what it is which means adopting a modified lifestyle, after all if you want to live like a Brit as if in the UK, why come here?

Good Luck,

Pete
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Old 7th February 2012, 11:57 AM
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Well said Pete.
I would totally agree 100% with every single word you said

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Old 7th February 2012, 01:15 PM
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I must admit to feeling a little saddened by Americanah's situation as described in her post as it reminded me of the inevitable culture shock that I too experienced. Far from being a whinging ex-pat, she has come here without expectations, but to follow her heart in marrying a Cypriot national (much as I did 7 years ago). There is a difference between those that find themselves living and trying to work here because of fate and circumstance rather than from the fulfilment of a long held-dream of relocation. Hats off to Americanah for finding a niche and purpose.

On the other side of the coin, I agree with Pete's post although for balance I have come across more bigotry and hostility here than I care to mention, but that is all down to the field I work in and the topics I research - but that is always countered by the seemingly limitless hospitality to be had in the majority and the fascination this wonderful island holds. If it is any consolation, in my experience, the culture shock does wear off after about five years and those of us fortunate enough to arrive here via Cupid's arrow almost always end up falling in love with Cyprus as well as their spouse...
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Old 7th February 2012, 01:58 PM
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I must admit to feeling a little saddened by Americanah's situation as described in her post as it reminded me of the inevitable culture shock that I too experienced. Far from being a whinging ex-pat, she has come here without expectations, but to follow her heart in marrying a Cypriot national (much as I did 7 years ago). There is a difference between those that find themselves living and trying to work here because of fate and circumstance rather than from the fulfilment of a long held-dream of relocation. Hats off to Americanah for finding a niche and purpose.

On the other side of the coin, I agree with Pete's post although for balance I have come across more bigotry and hostility here than I care to mention, but that is all down to the field I work in and the topics I research - but that is always countered by the seemingly limitless hospitality to be had in the majority and the fascination this wonderful island holds. If it is any consolation, in my experience, the culture shock does wear off after about five years and those of us fortunate enough to arrive here via Cupid's arrow almost always end up falling in love with Cyprus as well as their spouse...
Very, very well said Kimonas! She needs support and understanding. I also did not see her as a "whinging expat" but someone who is disillusioned after she saw the other side. I would suggest if she has the money and time to plan trips out of the country once a year or twice if possible then do it. That always made us feel refreshed and gave us something to look forward to when island living became a little monotonous. Also, there is an American woman's group that meets (or used to meet) in Nicosia. It is just nice to meet up with other people once in awhile who know what you are talking about and totally understand you.

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Old 7th February 2012, 02:31 PM
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Very, very well said Kimonas! She needs support and understanding. I also did not see her as a "whinging expat" but someone who is disillusioned after she saw the other side. I would suggest if she has the money and time to plan trips out of the country once a year or twice if possible then do it. That always made us feel refreshed and gave us something to look forward to when island living became a little monotonous. Also, there is an American woman's group that meets (or used to meet) in Nicosia. It is just nice to meet up with other people once in awhile who know what you are talking about and totally understand you.
It wasn't my intention for my comment to force the discussion to go off-topic but I do think it fair to say that if you read through Americanah's original post, virtually everything she mentions is a whinge about conditions in Cyprus. That is all I was commenting on not her circumstances, need for support or anything else. Just plain fact based on her words.

My comment was not exclusively pointed at her either. How many of you have met people who whinge on about Cypriots and Cyprus with an air of superiority as if everything in their home country, usually UK, was perfect? Typical subjects being driving, the roads, parking, price of imported food, building quality, too hot, too cold, too wet, nepotism, bribery, hunting, etc.

Support where it is needed may make an important contribution to creating a more positive attitude but the key issue is that this is Cyprus. It belongs to the Cypriots and we are the guests. We do no credit to ourselves with constant complaints.

Pete

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Old 7th February 2012, 04:25 PM
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Americanha: Oh dear, what a depressing response. While I agree with the conclusions most people have expressed with moving to Cyprus, I do think one of the worst features here is the whinging ex-pats who expect everything to be the same as their home country.

There are many categories of prices that are more expensive than the UK and many things that are much cheaper. Overall we find our cost of living to be the same as the UK.

The treatment of animals is much the same in most countries on this side of the world and the picture painted is too bleak. We have caged dogs near us who are cleaned out each day, fed twice a day and when we see them let out are perfectly happy animals. Although we would not choose to keep our dog this way, to suggest that all animals are treated badly is wrong.

The comment on parking also made me smile. If there's one thing that's easy here it's parking and very rarely with a charge. Lane discipline both on the road and in car parks tends to be poor, but who cares if a car took up 2 spaces - there's plenty of others!

Cyprus Government undoubtedly needs its procedures updating and simplifying, they are rather like the UK 50 years ago, but this will slowly happen like the recent census which was handled efficiently and informatively particularly the comprehensive web site that was set up.

I have never heard a Cypriot suggest the British and Americans are dirty and my overall experience would rate them as helpful, friendly and generous people, with the occasional exception of those stuck in the EOKA time-warp. None have refused to come in our house because of the dog, but of course we do keep him away from some of them when they express the all too common fear of dogs.

Tracylo09: My thoughts on your situation would be to think very carefully. If you were retiring here I would say go ahead but with children's education and jobs to consider you will find it a tough environment in most places of the world right now. If you do decide to come plan a fall-back position in case it doesn't work out, do travel round the island to see where you might live - we did and nothing would get me to live on the east side once I'd seen the beauty of the west and mid areas. As others have said do not buy a home, it is essential to rent right now at least until the market recovers. Above all try to take off the rose tinted glasses and enjoy Cyprus for what it is which means adopting a modified lifestyle, after all if you want to live like a Brit as if in the UK, why come here?

Good Luck,

Pete
Ahhh dear Pete, i take no offense at you putting me in the whinging category because you are very naive. I am married to a Cypriot. Cypriots and Greeks in general think of Americans and Brits as dirty. They don't say it to their faces for goodness sake. And basically I had not much of a choice coming here. My husband is from here and was coming back and wouldn't move to California. Being that I know many Cypriots who will actually say what they think behind brits backs I think I have a better perspective of this than you. Also, I see all of the time that Brits get 'taken' and charged more for many things (services etc) because they are Brits and the Cypriots even say so.

I do animal rescue work here in Cyprus so I see the many dirty secrets. The dogs in cages thing, my super Cypriot father-in-law even said it was like 90% of the dogs and people just are behind. He doesn't even like dogs and cats and he admits this. Cypriots aren't going to let you in on all of these things if you are foreign.

I didn't come here for dream life on an island. But I did not expect so much animal abuse and neglect. I know that happens in my country too but it is on a huge scale here. As I said before, on my block ALONE there are 20 caged dogs who are never let out. Of those, at least 5 of them are fed once a WEEK. They almost all have grimy, soupy green water to drink and some are only fed pasta. And they are NEVER let out. Dog across the street lays in his pee and poo and is a huge dog in a small cage. 4 dogs outside our grocery store in cages on a field had piles and piles of poo. I've had to report them so many times. A majority of Cypriots do not care about these animals- they think of them as property and if one dies get another. A Cypriot child was abusing a kitten and my English Cypriot friend asked the parent why he let the kid do it- that the kitten would die. Guy said- it's ok we can get her another if that happens. In my rescue work we see an ENORMOUS amount of neglect and cruelty. Dogs being dumped in the mountains, puppies on the side of the road. Animals who can barely walk from being caged and starved. Even the pounds here are horrible. Dhali pound has animals starving and they mix big dogs with small and small dogs get killed by the bigger dogs. This place is a mess when it comes to animal welfare. Do you live in a place with lots of english people? Because I do not know how you do not know about all of this that goes on.

Sorry for getting a bit worked up but this place is a hell for animals and for anyone to belittle that fact is wrong. Some of our rescuers are Cypriot and they are appalled by their countrymen's attitude towards them.

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Old 7th February 2012, 05:11 PM
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Ahhh dear Pete, i take no offense at you putting me in the whinging category because you are very naive. I am married to a Cypriot. Cypriots and Greeks in general think of Americans and Brits as dirty. They don't say it to their faces for goodness sake. And basically I had not much of a choice coming here. My husband is from here and was coming back and wouldn't move to California. Being that I know many Cypriots who will actually say what they think behind brits backs I think I have a better perspective of this than you. Also, I see all of the time that Brits get 'taken' and charged more for many things (services etc) because they are Brits and the Cypriots even say so.

I do animal rescue work here in Cyprus so I see the many dirty secrets. The dogs in cages thing, my super Cypriot father-in-law even said it was like 90% of the dogs and people just are behind. He doesn't even like dogs and cats and he admits this. Cypriots aren't going to let you in on all of these things if you are foreign.

I didn't come here for dream life on an island. But I did not expect so much animal abuse and neglect. I know that happens in my country too but it is on a huge scale here. As I said before, on my block ALONE there are 20 caged dogs who are never let out. Of those, at least 5 of them are fed once a WEEK. They almost all have grimy, soupy green water to drink and some are only fed pasta. And they are NEVER let out. Dog across the street lays in his pee and poo and is a huge dog in a small cage. 4 dogs outside our grocery store in cages on a field had piles and piles of poo. I've had to report them so many times. A majority of Cypriots do not care about these animals- they think of them as property and if one dies get another. A Cypriot child was abusing a kitten and my English Cypriot friend asked the parent why he let the kid do it- that the kitten would die. Guy said- it's ok we can get her another if that happens. In my rescue work we see an ENORMOUS amount of neglect and cruelty. Dogs being dumped in the mountains, puppies on the side of the road. Animals who can barely walk from being caged and starved. Even the pounds here are horrible. Dhali pound has animals starving and they mix big dogs with small and small dogs get killed by the bigger dogs. This place is a mess when it comes to animal welfare. Do you live in a place with lots of english people? Because I do not know how you do not know about all of this that goes on.

Sorry for getting a bit worked up but this place is a hell for animals and for anyone to belittle that fact is wrong. Some of our rescuers are Cypriot and they are appalled by their countrymen's attitude towards them.
Please reread my comments. I gave an example of reasonable treatment of dogs nearby us trying to make the point that not all animals are badly treated here. You seem to live in a place where there are some particularly poor owners and wish to tar everyone with the same brush.

No we don't live in a place with lots of English people. Our village has only 1 other English person who is a recluse and we have never met.

You have focussed on the animal issues you brought up. Can you not see that this was just a part of your original post where you made so many negative comments leading to the impression of being a whinger.

If you are not then I apologise however I keep to my general criticism of ex-pat whingers.

Finally I need to point out that in no way am I guilty of "belittling that fact". Commenting on what you said is not belittling it at all, this is a discussion forum for sharing opinions.

Pete

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Old 7th February 2012, 05:37 PM
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well said pete. i've been reading and following several posts and threads and in the end i will make up my own mind as to what i think but in any case i do think sometimes if someone has nothing good to say then it may well be best to say nothing at all????

darren

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Old 7th February 2012, 05:42 PM
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It wasn't my intention for my comment to force the discussion to go off-topic but I do think it fair to say that if you read through Americanah's original post, virtually everything she mentions is a whinge about conditions in Cyprus. That is all I was commenting on not her circumstances, need for support or anything else. Just plain fact based on her words.

My comment was not exclusively pointed at her either. How many of you have met people who whinge on about Cypriots and Cyprus with an air of superiority as if everything in their home country, usually UK, was perfect? Typical subjects being driving, the roads, parking, price of imported food, building quality, too hot, too cold, too wet, nepotism, bribery, hunting, etc.

Support where it is needed may make an important contribution to creating a more positive attitude but the key issue is that this is Cyprus. It belongs to the Cypriots and we are the guests. We do no credit to ourselves with constant complaints.

Pete

My view is that if the UK was such a good place to live, as it once was, why are people wanting to jump ship?

I don't like, in the short time I have been here, the notion that Brits are trying to implement their UK habits, way of life and such like here, the way it is is what makes it so special.

In the UK ,we were the first to complain of immigrants who made specific demands to have what they had in their own country. No wonder there were cries of 'If you don't like it go home', I would suggest the same applies here.

Sorry !

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