SA Haters

Darko · #39 (**permalink**) 7th May 2009, 04:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zimtony

Darko

Again you choose to ignore the big picture and focus on a micro view on whcih to base your insults, impart your knowledge and share your wisdom. To clear a view points:

None of us who post here are SA haters. We rather are individuals who have personal experience of being born/growing up/living in/doing business with/emigrating from South Africa. (You can delete or tick the applicable!) As stated before, it is not possible to hate a country and none of the posters here have professed to hate South Africa.
Clearly South Africa may be the Holy Grail for certain expatriates. I have no problem with that at all and I wish all of you all the luck in the world.

My personal desire to post is to provide some sort of balance to those SA newbies who now wish to portray South Africa as some sort of Garden of Eden. Sure, it is one of the most beautiful places on the Earth. Yes, so long as you have some money, you can lead a fairly decent quality of life. However, if you do not want to bring your children up in an atmosphere of fear; should you not want to live behind a security system that is admired by Fort Knox; if the simple things in life are precious to you (just going for a walk down the road/ along the beachfront/strolling through a town centre) then, generally, life in South Africa is not for you. Any suggestion to the contrary is, at best misguided and at worst, a blatent lie by those who are trying to fool others whilst also fooling themselves or trying to justify a bad mistake to themselves and others!

The micro comments about South Africa right now (world cup 2010, no bloodshed at these last elections,ZAR at 12 to 1, not 30) are just not relevant.
Consider this big picture:
In 1980 Zimbabwe gained independence.
Rober Mugabe was seen by the western world (mostly the UK) as some kind of saviour able to transcend the black/white problems of the day.
At this time, the country exported more food to the rest of Africa than it used itself.
Up to this independence date, the country had suffered appaling sanctions being placed on it from the western world, primarily the UK.
It was largely self sufficient, except for oil.
It had one of the most enviable infrastructures in Africa. (Electricity, water, roads, health system, schools, apprenticeship schemes and had a very small per capita unemplyment rate)
At the time of Independence the Zimbabwe Dollar was woth 1.47 US Dollars! (I would get RSI if I tried to type in all the zeros that would be applicable today if I tried to now calculate how many Zim dollars I could buy with 1 US dollar. And by the time you had read this, it would have changed exponentially again.)
It had trouble free elections.
Now remember, at this point in time, many people also had a rose tinted view about how great it was going to be in this new, exciting, independent country.

What thoughts on Zimbabwe today? Any comments? See any parallels? Any other real life examples? I know a lot of people that moved to Zimbabwe during this period, looking for the new land of milk and honey. I have a rather sneaking feeling that not too many are there today! And consider the brain drain on qualified people leaving Zimbabwe, that were replaced by relatively lower skilled/lower experienced people, that is being equalled in South Africa today. Don't believe me? Just google South Africans in Austalia/UK/Ireland/USA etc and see for yourself.

Unfortunately, it is without doubt that South Africa is heading the same way. The path may be slightly different, due to other factors, (communications, different tribal dynamics, strong diverse financial base in relation to the rest of the continent), but the destination will be the same. Another failed African state needing bailing out by the rest of the world.

Like many other posters here, in the words of Clarke Gable, "Frankly my dear, I don't give a damn" about those of you who have moved there and are trying to make it work. Truly, I wish you all the luck in the world and I would absolutely love to have to eat my hat after being proved wrong. However, I do believe that it is my birthright to be able to share a little more "perspective" with those that are considering a move on the basis of a one-sided view given by posters such as yourself.

Good luck, hope that you really do well and that South Africa can survive. Me, I prefer to be able to sleep at night, knowing my 17 year old daughter can drive herself home safely, that the dog barking probably means it has seen a cat and that if I wake up to a strange noise in the house, the icemaker has just dropped another load in the freezer.

Aaaah, Zimtony...pls tell me where I have insulted anyone? Hypersensitivity is something that does not often marry well to contributions on open fora/forums.

1. "SA Haters" is a term I quoted from the thread originator. As I stated in previous posts, it is not my term of choice to begin with. This statement alone should take care of most of your post.

2. Of course my "micro" comments are relevant. These are the very comments (and again, I said before, they are only a few examples of such comments) used by "SA Haters" to dispell negativity about the country. But I guess when it doesn't swing in the favour of the "SA hater" it becomes irrelevant. I understand. Amazing how relevant it does become when it suites the person posting isn't it?

3. Thanks for the history lesson on Zimbabwe. But until SA becomes Zimbabwe, i suggest we hold onto the "I told you so's". It has been proven time and time again that predictions of doom have been unfounded - and if not, doom will arrive in an indeterminate time...right? Fact and Prediction are 2 different things. The parallels...well, there will always be parallels. We are in post-colonial Africa. The beginnings of independence will alawys look the same. The brain drain in Zimbabwe is nowhere near comparable to that of South Africa's. But no time now to get into the obviousness of this.

4. Heading towards another failed African state huh? Is this another fact? I'm sorry, but it can't be called fact until sucvh time that it happens. Like the fact that SA was surely headed for civil war and bloodshed in 1994. Liek SA's currency would be worthless by COB 2008 etc etc etc. Nothing but personal opinion and predictions....no fact whatsoever.

5. Ditto on Clarke Gable about those that moved abroad...to each their own. Except that you contradict yourself. You state you don't give a damn, and then that you truly wish us luck....which is it?

6. Pls tell me a single one-sided post I have given to convince anyone to move back to SA. I wait in anticipation. You can't just shoot from the hip without substantiation - even though that is the modus operandi of the "SA Hater" My opinions are based on fact. I am not in denial about crime and all those other lovely things. Your facts are based on predictions...many of which have been proven wrong over...and over again.

7. Glad you can finally sleep well at night. You should've left Zim long ago and come to SA. We sleep quite well here. And please....don't try to convince yourself that you are happy where you are. I'm sure you made the right decision.